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Change Bike 650B

Old 01-26-21, 04:43 AM
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Thanks again

Good advice again!

I ordered most of the parts except brakes as the seller on Lazada was very slow and told me its sold out.

Would this flat mount brakes work? https://www.ebay.com/itm/264435342212

Is it easier/better to find an adapter for flat mount or post mount brakes?

Originally Posted by pinholecam
Correct. It was the Kinesis QR version of the fork.
Do note that if you want a more upright riding position, you might want to consider a fork that has longer Axel/Crown length. There are some carbon forks that are sold as "MTB carbon forks" which have a longer axel/crown length (as suspension forks are longer too)
That said, since you are taller, you can just opt for a stem with a raise angle.

Last edited by Freem@n; 01-26-21 at 05:07 AM.
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Old 01-26-21, 07:57 PM
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Originally Posted by Freem@n
Good advice again!

I ordered most of the parts except brakes as the seller on Lazada was very slow and told me its sold out.

Would this flat mount brakes work? https://www.ebay.com/itm/264435342212

Is it easier/better to find an adapter for flat mount or post mount brakes?

Certainly not Flat mount as AFAIK, it only had adapter to Post mount.
Hence if you get Flat mount you will need to Flat > Post > IS (which is probably messy and full of bolts)

But you can do some research on this to confirm as things might have changed over the time I have set up my bike.
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Old 01-30-21, 09:58 AM
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Hi Pinholecam, stupid question but what headset did you use? I saw foldingtales used quite a lot of spacers. it doesn't seem like you had any.

Also wanted to ask your opinion of your experience with 28mm wheels - one of my friends offered a spare pair of 700c Bontrager Elite 35 wheels and was thinking of it as a spare for road duties with road tyres and SRAM 11 speed PG 1130 cassette.

Was keen as well as my Hunt 650b wheels will only arrive earliest in 3rd week of April.

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Old 01-31-21, 07:26 PM
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Originally Posted by Freem@n
Hi Pinholecam, stupid question but what headset did you use? I saw foldingtales used quite a lot of spacers. it doesn't seem like you had any.

Also wanted to ask your opinion of your experience with 28mm wheels - one of my friends offered a spare pair of 700c Bontrager Elite 35 wheels and was thinking of it as a spare for road duties with road tyres and SRAM 11 speed PG 1130 cassette.

Was keen as well as my Hunt 650b wheels will only arrive earliest in 3rd week of April.

I can't recall what headset I used, just asked my LBS (Bike Stop) to install a budget one for me w/o emphasizing on it.
It should not affect the number of spacers used since that is more likely a decision by each rider on how upright he/she wants the bike to be.
It can't be too long either if its carbon due to breakage concerns (there's actually a recommended length, but you have to google for it as I can't recall the number)

Problem with the swap in wheel that you propose will be that your chain length will need to be changed and you'd then need to keep 2 chain lengths (and swap together w/ the wheels);
ie. Since one is 10-42t and the other is 11-30t.

As for 28mm tires, they would bring back more of a road bike feel in that the cushy feeling of low pressure tires will largely go away. I never used mine long enough to have a good impression on improved speed.
In fact, I did not feel that it was worth the hassle swapping every few weeks.
YMMV of course as I am really very busy as a parent and would like to spend as little time as possible fiddling with the bike stuff. (so a single guy who likes dabbling in bikes, will certainly have a different opinion from me)


Hunts look good, and have had many good reviews, its been in my radar for a while.
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Old 02-01-21, 02:14 AM
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Originally Posted by pinholecam
Problem with the swap in wheel that you propose will be that your chain length will need to be changed and you'd then need to keep 2 chain lengths (and swap together w/ the wheels);
ie. Since one is 10-42t and the other is 11-30t.
.
And you need a clutched derailleur with 11-42T PG1130. I swap my 650b (10-42 pg1150) and 700C (11-42 pg1130) because the derailleur is clutched and the final ration is the same. I found that it would be OK if I was to fit a 42max and 46max but I would need the 42T setting to be at the slack end of the tolerance and the 46T at the tensioned end...
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Old 02-01-21, 08:32 AM
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Thanks for guiding

Thanks - did you have to swop the wheels and the chain in your experiment with 28mm tyres? Sounds like a lot of work!

Let's see how the parts end up coming along in terms of delivery before I decide to take on the spare wheels. I was thinking about it as the long wait for Hunt Wheels (i hope its worth the wait) and just getting a PG 1130 11-42 cassette but it sounds like swopping spare wheels seems to a bit of a hassle and i cannot interchange the wheels easily for road duties which was what I was hoping.

In the end I decide to wait for the Hunt 650b wheels as i heard many good reviews... seems like a good set of gravel wheels.

Originally Posted by pinholecam
I can't recall what headset I used, just asked my LBS (Bike Stop) to install a budget one for me w/o emphasizing on it.
It should not affect the number of spacers used since that is more likely a decision by each rider on how upright he/she wants the bike to be.
It can't be too long either if its carbon due to breakage concerns (there's actually a recommended length, but you have to google for it as I can't recall the number)

Problem with the swap in wheel that you propose will be that your chain length will need to be changed and you'd then need to keep 2 chain lengths (and swap together w/ the wheels);
ie. Since one is 10-42t and the other is 11-30t.

As for 28mm tires, they would bring back more of a road bike feel in that the cushy feeling of low pressure tires will largely go away. I never used mine long enough to have a good impression on improved speed.
In fact, I did not feel that it was worth the hassle swapping every few weeks.
YMMV of course as I am really very busy as a parent and would like to spend as little time as possible fiddling with the bike stuff. (so a single guy who likes dabbling in bikes, will certainly have a different opinion from me)


Hunts look good, and have had many good reviews, its been in my radar for a while.
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Old 02-01-21, 08:34 AM
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Thanks Fentuz - I dont think mine is clutched (Rival 3.0 Long cage) so I think its too troublesome to fit the Sram PG 1130 11-42 cassette. Guess I have to sit tight and just wait....
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Old 02-01-21, 09:18 AM
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Rival long cage might be clutched. this on is:
https://www.bikester.co.uk/sram-riva...er-662643.html

Regarding tyres, I run the 650b with 50-584 and pressure is 30psi front 35psi rear. the 700c are fitted with 33-622 and I run 65psi front and 70psi rear

you can also look at that: https://axs.sram.com/guides/tire/pressure

Last edited by Fentuz; 02-01-21 at 09:25 AM.
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Old 02-02-21, 05:56 AM
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Thanks

Hi Fentuz,

Ok I will find out from the LBS when I get closer to getting all my parts and see how far out i need to wait for my wheels. Suspect its going to be a long wait...

Originally Posted by Fentuz
Rival long cage might be clutched. this on is:
https://www.bikester.co.uk/sram-riva...er-662643.html

Regarding tyres, I run the 650b with 50-584 and pressure is 30psi front 35psi rear. the 700c are fitted with 33-622 and I run 65psi front and 70psi rear

you can also look at that: https://axs.sram.com/guides/tire/pressure
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Old 02-02-21, 09:35 AM
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Pinholecam, would you happen to know what is the head tube angle for this bike?
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Old 02-02-21, 06:38 PM
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Originally Posted by Freem@n
Pinholecam, would you happen to know what is the head tube angle for this bike?
I don't have this info too.
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Old 02-11-21, 12:35 AM
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Hi Pinholecam,

Happy CNY to you!

Pinholecam, I ordered Shimano Deore XT M8000 11 speed cranks but i received instead a M8100 12 speed crank.

Is there any way this is still somehow workable? I already received the 96bcd 44t and 11 speed chains as well.
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Old 02-13-21, 08:09 PM
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Originally Posted by Freem@n
Hi Pinholecam,

Happy CNY to you!

Pinholecam, I ordered Shimano Deore XT M8000 11 speed cranks but i received instead a M8100 12 speed crank.

Is there any way this is still somehow workable? I already received the 96bcd 44t and 11 speed chains as well.

Happy CNY to you too.

It should not be a problem with the crank.
You should be able to use it w/o issue.
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Old 02-15-21, 02:38 AM
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M8000 vs M8100

Pinholecam, I am out of my depth -

What is the difference between 12 speed M8100 and 11 speed M8000 as the BB they use is the same threaded BBMT800.

I noticed from the technical spec https://bike.shimano.com/en-EU/produ...C-M8100-1.html the BCD is direct and appears to be star nut direct bolted to the crankwheel, and i believe the M8000 isnt since it states PCD is 96mm https://bike.shimano.com/en-EU/produ...-M8000-B1.html

Btw, I noticed the geometry of the bike you built has quite a bit of similarities to the BMC URS bike.

Originally Posted by pinholecam
Happy CNY to you too.

It should not be a problem with the crank.
You should be able to use it w/o issue.
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Old 02-15-21, 03:15 AM
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Originally Posted by Freem@n
Pinholecam, I am out of my depth -

What is the difference between 12 speed M8100 and 11 speed M8000 as the BB they use is the same threaded BBMT800.

I noticed from the technical spec https://bike.shimano.com/en-EU/produ...C-M8100-1.html the BCD is direct and appears to be star nut direct bolted to the crankwheel, and i believe the M8000 isnt since it states PCD is 96mm https://bike.shimano.com/en-EU/produ...-M8000-B1.html

Btw, I noticed the geometry of the bike you built has quite a bit of similarities to the BMC URS bike.

Ah... ok... forgot another "great" bike industry innovation of the direct mount chainrings...
The moved the standard again recently to this type of mounting instead of the 4-bolt (used to be 5 bolts and 104bcd too before that)

That said, your 12sp crankset will work fine with the rest of your components, though of course if you bought chainrings that are 96bcd, then they probably won't fit and you have to get the direct mount ones.

Cool point about the URS...
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Old 02-24-21, 12:28 AM
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Pinholecam

Just to let you know i managed to confirm that the head tube angle is 71 degrees.

If you looking for a carbon fork with longer crown to axle, columbus futura adventure carbon adjustable rake is 470mm, and comes with adjustable rake 45/50mm, and has side mounts.

In case you looking to swop down M8000 42T chainwheel let me know (No worries if you happy to stay on 44T).
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Old 02-24-21, 06:54 PM
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Originally Posted by Freem@n
Pinholecam

Just to let you know i managed to confirm that the head tube angle is 71 degrees.

If you looking for a carbon fork with longer crown to axle, columbus futura adventure carbon adjustable rake is 470mm, and comes with adjustable rake 45/50mm, and has side mounts.

In case you looking to swop down M8000 42T chainwheel let me know (No worries if you happy to stay on 44T).
Thanks for the information on the fork option.
The 44t is doing quite well so far for local as well as non-loaded overseas riding.
I do have a 38t and a 34t chainring that I will swap out when there is a chance to go overseas again. (Thanks for the offer on the 42t)


Do share photos and thoughts on your bike when its ready.
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Old 02-25-21, 03:31 PM
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Just ordered the Change 833 MTB frame from Flatbikes, USA. Looking forward to building the bike for touring. Anyone have specs on shifter and brake cable lengths? Thanks everyone for some really good detailed information!
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Old 03-03-21, 07:02 PM
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Originally Posted by bikewilltravel
Just ordered the Change 833 MTB frame from Flatbikes, USA. Looking forward to building the bike for touring. Anyone have specs on shifter and brake cable lengths? Thanks everyone for some really good detailed information!
Great!
Hope you get your bike soon.

Sorry, I don't have measurements of the cable lengths.
Might be a good idea to ask this from Flatbikes since they are the most prominent seller in the US.

If you really need the lengths, do sound out again and I can try to measure them, but I'm just afraid that it won't be accurate since it will be using a ruler over a routed cable.
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Old 03-12-21, 03:25 PM
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Here's a basic 1x10 Change semi-hardtail build in basic black-and-white with a bit of red and gold bling for my wife to take on rails-to-trails paths that her Brompton cannot handle with its skinny tires, a mix of perfectly smooth macadam stretches punctuated by crumbling concrete, loose stone, dirt, gravel, and sandy grass. That's our pumpkin from Hallowe'en 2020 still intact in March 2021. The squirrels didn't devour it this year for reasons unknown to me.

I skimped on the brakes (Shimano Tourney with Origin8 compressionless housing) in order to buy the Cane Creek Thudbuster. But I'll upgrade the brakes eventually probably to TRP Spyke. The 2-finger Spyke levers are on the bike now and they feel really smooth and solid to me. Shimano Zee short-cage mech in the 36T size and Zee 10-speed shifter. Sorry, bike's facing the wrong way. Alivio hubs, nothing special. Origin8 41T narrow-wide chainring and Origin8 160mm cranks and Origin8 mini urban riser handlebars which have a nice place to mount a Go-Pro. Schwalbe Cross tires. Cane Creek Forty tapered headset. I did not install the Hollowtech BB that came with the frame but am using an IRD QB-55 cartridge BB with 103mm spindle width.

That's a Hylix carbon fork, 470mm axle-to-crown, which makes the ride posture more upright, especially when combined with that adjustable stem. I've seen the name Hylix mentioned on boards for 10 years so I figured they've got some staying power, though I could not find any information at all about the manufacturer; they should run courses on how to remain anonymous on the internet, but I guess then they'd no longer be anonymous.

DT Swiss 27.5 (584x22.5) rims and Champion 2mm spokes. The DT Swiss spoke calculator is now my go-to calculator! Spoke lengths were perfect, and I took the tension to the DT recommended max and the wheels came out perfectly dished.

The frame came with two internal-routing inserts that had a cable-stop option and two that did not. The shifter cable is bare through the downtube and the rear brake cable is in housing.

The folded Change MTB takes up much less room in the trunk than the Xootr, which likes to sprawl out and claim all the floor-space to itself.

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Old 03-14-21, 06:46 PM
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Originally Posted by timo888
Here's a basic 1x10 Change semi-hardtail build in basic black-and-white with a bit of red and gold bling for my wife to take on rails-to-trails paths that her Brompton cannot handle with its skinny tires, a mix of perfectly smooth macadam stretches punctuated by crumbling concrete, loose stone, dirt, gravel, and sandy grass. That's our pumpkin from Hallowe'en 2020 still intact in March 2021. The squirrels didn't devour it this year for reasons unknown to me.

I skimped on the brakes (Shimano Tourney with Origin8 compressionless housing) in order to buy the Cane Creek Thudbuster. But I'll upgrade the brakes eventually probably to TRP Spyke. The 2-finger Spyke levers are on the bike now and they feel really smooth and solid to me. Shimano Zee short-cage mech in the 36T size and Zee 10-speed shifter. Sorry, bike's facing the wrong way. Alivio hubs, nothing special. Origin8 41T narrow-wide chainring and Origin8 160mm cranks and Origin8 mini urban riser handlebars which have a nice place to mount a Go-Pro. Schwalbe Cross tires. Cane Creek Forty tapered headset. I did not install the Hollowtech BB that came with the frame but am using an IRD QB-55 cartridge BB with 103mm spindle width.

That's a Hylix carbon fork, 470mm axle-to-crown, which makes the ride posture more upright, especially when combined with that adjustable stem. I've seen the name Hylix mentioned on boards for 10 years so I figured they've got some staying power, though I could not find any information at all about the manufacturer; they should run courses on how to remain anonymous on the internet, but I guess then they'd no longer be anonymous.

DT Swiss 27.5 (584x22.5) rims and Champion 2mm spokes. The DT Swiss spoke calculator is now my go-to calculator! Spoke lengths were perfect, and I took the tension to the DT recommended max and the wheels came out perfectly dished.

The frame came with two internal-routing inserts that had a cable-stop option and two that did not. The shifter cable is bare through the downtube and the rear brake cable is in housing.

The folded Change MTB takes up much less room in the trunk than the Xootr, which likes to sprawl out and claim all the floor-space to itself.

Congrats on the new bike
Its good that you shared more info on the bike setup too.
That will be good reference for anyone considering this bike in the future.

Interesting that you went for the Zee RD and shifter.
Any particular reason why you did not opt for 11sp SLX which would allow the 11-42t and 11-50t cassettes?
The Zee is a good reliable option though, I used it a lot on a previous bike and it works/shifts well.

A stem extension might be a solution for your stem/bar height adjustment needs
TRIWONDER MTB Bicycle Fork Stem Extender Handlebar Riser Bike Neck Extender Aluminium Alloy Stem Raiser (Black - Super Long Version): Amazon.sg: Sports, Fitness & Outdoors
There are other options out there, I just posted the one above as an example.

How do you find the braking?
I've heard many mentioned to me that they expected more from the cable disc brakes. (though its more wrt road levers + mechanical disc brakes)
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Old 03-15-21, 01:36 AM
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Originally Posted by pinholecam
Great!
Hope you get your bike soon.

Sorry, I don't have measurements of the cable lengths.
Might be a good idea to ask this from Flatbikes since they are the most prominent seller in the US.

If you really need the lengths, do sound out again and I can try to measure them, but I'm just afraid that it won't be accurate since it will be using a ruler over a routed cable.
Received MTB frame, excellent product response and support from Flatbikes, USA. Built my bike using components from my ever increasing box of old spare parts. I used a full length cable, 2300mm, for the rear disc brake and rear derailleur. I needed every bit of it, folds nicely, maybe 2 inches to spare at the clamp bolt end! 19"MTB frame with 26" wheels fit me perfectly--I'm 5'9" with 30" pants inseam. Can't wait to bike Malaysia with this bike. Biked Penang to Singapore last year, blog on CGOAB. Take care. PS, I can't post a photo or like a post until I reach 10 posts.
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Old 03-15-21, 01:59 AM
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Originally Posted by Freem@n
Hi Pinholecam, stupid question but what headset did you use? I saw foldingtales used quite a lot of spacers. it doesn't seem like you had any.

Also wanted to ask your opinion of your experience with 28mm wheels - one of my friends offered a spare pair of 700c Bontrager Elite 35 wheels and was thinking of it as a spare for road duties with road tyres and SRAM 11 speed PG 1130 cassette.

Was keen as well as my Hunt 650b wheels will only arrive earliest in 3rd week of April.
Headset was included with my frame when purchased.
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Old 03-15-21, 06:21 PM
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Thanks bikewilltravel !
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Old 03-15-21, 06:50 PM
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Originally Posted by bikewilltravel
Received MTB frame, excellent product response and support from Flatbikes, USA. Built my bike using components from my ever increasing box of old spare parts. I used a full length cable, 2300mm, for the rear disc brake and rear derailleur. I needed every bit of it, folds nicely, maybe 2 inches to spare at the clamp bolt end! 19"MTB frame with 26" wheels fit me perfectly--I'm 5'9" with 30" pants inseam. Can't wait to bike Malaysia with this bike. Biked Penang to Singapore last year, blog on CGOAB. Take care. PS, I can't post a photo or like a post until I reach 10 posts.


Is your post on CGOAB this one?
Malaysia 2019 (Penang to Singapore), by Ted Chu (crazyguyonabike.com)

I really need to explore that site more for my future rides into Malaysia.

Glad that you found that the bike fits you well.
I just find that the ChangeBike is under mentioned when it comes to folding bikes.
Yes, its larger after fold, but its still rather manageable imho and just gives a full sized bike riding experience.

Singapore is closed to its neighbors for the time being. (doable with a 2 wk quarantine both ways, so basically a no go for any normal working person )
Hope the situation changes by the final quarter of the year.
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