linberl

Unlike the HAD, it easily converts to a single rider travel bike. The rear "frame" of the HAD is not replicated here, it is a detachable series of rack options instead. So this one model can be a single person's light travel e-bike as well as their cargo bike, while fitting anyone with the adjustable frame. Pretty cool imo. 33lbs for the single rider packable travel bike (a bit heavy) but only 36 lbs as a touring e-bike.

honcho

After seeing this thread, I looked at the Wikipedia entry for Bike Friday and saw that the founder of Green Gear/Bike Friday was also involved in the founding of the Burley Cooperative. Burley made great products but couldn't make the cooperative model work over the long haul in the bicycle business. The old Burley disappeared, it's now privately owned and many of their great products (rain gear, interesting recumbents) were discontinued and now they sell mostly imported junk with just a tiny fraction of their product produced in the USA. I hope Green Gear / Bike Friday doesn't meet the same fate but it's a distinct possibility. The Stolz family has made a positive impact in the cycling world but it's hard to swim against the tide.

trainsktg

Not quite a zombie thread yet, so I thought I’d throw my $0.02 in here after reading through most of these pages.

I just got my first BF bike, a 2005 Pocket Rocket Pro, and I’m going to go out on a limb here and say that BF probably has a leg up on just about every other folding bike manufacturer out there, and that is the Pocket Rocket, their original bike.

There are probably hundreds of thousands of hard core roadie cyclists world wide who struggle to find ways to bring their bikes with them on extended business trips. I did and do. I’ve been looking for something for two years to fill this need and the thought until now of my riding a Brompton-like bike with power meter pedals and wearing a HR strap to maintain a training schedule just wasn’t generating a positive mental image. That problem is now solved. I live in Portland and I’d never even heard of Bike Friday until two months ago when I ran across my new bike on a local Craigslist. One test ride later and it was mine; it is an amazing bike.

I would venture to say that an aggressive advertising campaign to re-market their most unique product line, a drop bar folding bike that otherwise replicates the controls and ride of a normal road bike, would guarantee a surge of sales that they would be hard pressed to keep up with.

Keith



2

amyvegan

Bike Friday told me in August 2022 that Burley hitches for Burley kid and cargo trailers work just fine. Please clarify. Thank you. amy

2_i 

When the hitch mounts on the axle, it should not matter whether it is Bike Friday or another bike.

Ron Damon

Except that they last thing BF is is hip. Bromptons are hip. Why would an 'urban hipster' buy a BF camel vs a Brompton pony?

Ron Damon

As usual, Yan, there is too much brand 'loyalty' and that often clouds thinking.

For me, the problem with BF is very simple: it is way overpriced and therefore uncompetitive relative to the options available today in 2022 and my needs. I don't need the service, customization or the group sense of belonging and the high premium involved in all that.

Jipe

Again the same type of simplistic reasoning taking into account only the price !

Both Brompton and Bike Friday are designed and made (not only assembled) in a western country with workers paid a decent wage. Both bikes have a sophisticated design, not a simplistic middle frame folding hinge.

Then, both companies offer a real customer after sale support including for Brompton bikes sold in the EU two year full warranty and a wide network of resellers where customers can try the bikes and have their bike maintained. For Bike Friday, you have a wide choice of components and the Bike is almost custom built for you.
Both manufacturers offer a wide range of accessories for their bike (that some Chinese manufacturers also use or copy like the Brompton front luggage block and bags).

If for instance you buy an FNHON frame, its made by workers with an ultra low salary, you cannot test it, you receive a frame without any specification of which components will fit on it, no after sale support, no warranty (don't tell me that you can ship it back to China, its way too slow and expensive).

Other Asiatic manufacturers like Tern also offer sophisticated bikes with lots of accessories, but these aren't cheaper than Bike Friday and Brompton.

Jipe

Not only your needs!

Not only Bike Friday and Brompton are more expensive than low cost Chinese bikes, Tern an Pacific Cycles both Taiwanese companies are also more expensive and for the same reason.

amyvegan

What impresses me about the BF NWT is that I am 5' tall and it will fit me (custom). It's also available as an e-assist 18-speed that fits in in my living room (downtown, high rise living, no safe bike space in the garage) and the front tire and battery pack can be removed to revert it to a non-electric. I have an 8-speed Dahon Mu. The saddle to handlebar reach on the Mu is just at my limit at 5' tall.

linberl

I have a Dahon Mu as well and had to put swept back bars on because of the reach. Also, when I first went looking for a folder I tried Brompton and the reach was too long for me with all of their handlebar options. I might have been able to pay additional money for an after market retrofit that would have fixed it (moving the seat via pentaclip was not an option because it changed my KOPS for the worse) but I think it is absurd to spend 2k on a bike that doesn't fit. My BF fit me perfectly.

linberl

If you're buying a bike because it is "hip" you've got some issues. You should buy a bike because it fits you well and rides well. Also 'hip" is subjective. Around me I mostly see old fat white guys on Bromptons, lol.

amyvegan

Curious how tall you are...I have short torso, short arms too. THANKS !

linberl

I'm 5'4" but it's mostly legs (which is why KOPs is so important to me). I joke that I have T-rex arms, lol.

Ron Damon

What part of "I don't need...all that" did you not understand?

​​​​​And seeing the problems the company is in, it looks that I am far from the only one. The BF model is spent, played out, as has been argued by others here.

Ron Damon

I don't. That's precisely my point. That one reason why I buy neither BF nor Brompton.

By the same token, if you are buying a bike to get a sense of group belonging and join an in-group (as is often the case with these "exclusive" bikes), you too have problems.

Not surprised about the Brompton owners where you are. Quite predictable actually.

linberl

If you're thinking BF owners buy them for some sense of group whatever, I think you are mistaken. Aside from my own purchase which was totally because I needed a special fitment and also wanted to customize my components as well as buy USA made as much as possible, most BF buyers want bikes that are easy to travel with (easy packing) that ride like regular bikes. Brompton doesn't offer a small wheel quality roadie bike - in fact I am not sure anyone actually does besides BF (Pocket Rocket Pro). They've branched out into city bikes and cargo bikes in order to keep the business going but first and foremost they are great riding bikes. Fold always comes second with a BF. The typical BF buyer purchases because the bike offers something they can't get elsewhere and/or they really want to support a US business. BF doesn't have events and groups like Brompton, it's not remotely close to being a social thing, lol. We can't even get them to make a tee shirt!!!

Ron Damon

... Which is why I don't buy or cheerlead those bikes either. Once again, what part of "I don't need...all that." did you not understand?

BillyD

Ron, do you have anything to say other than personal accusations? Otherwise . . . .

Ron Damon

​​​​​​
Yes, I do. Thanks for asking. The chickens have come home to roost. The BF model is spent, played out, has run its course.

Siu Blue Wind

Ron Damon Then you can always leave the coop if you are complaining about the chickens.

pinholecam

I can see your point (having owned a Pocket Rocket Super Pro and rode it a lot and hard for 2 years ).
Its fallen into the same niche as the Moulton, but better too because I still think the BF models are more utilitarian.
A bit of nostalgia, a bit built on country of origin but with some limitations to the "folding", costs, availability and marketing.
I sold it off eventually not because it was bad (it was the best 'folding' bike I have used) , but I also realized I had too many bikes and this one was like $6-7K of it and I could do more or less the same on bikes 1/3 or 1/2 the cost.

BF is still very good as a travel bike as the folding is really slow and troublesome and not suited for multi-mode commute on a daily basis.
Maybe the Tikit (now Packit) was supposed to address that (but seems like it did not catch on the public's imagination ); being sited in US where its car centric does not help.

Since its as much work to break it down for travelling, a bike with the Ritchey break-away system or S&S actually does about the same, but with full size and potentially lighter weight.

Jipe

We are talking a lot of BF and the high costs of BF bikes.

But, even if most folding bikes are low cost bikes, BF (and Brompton) is not the only manufacturer making high end/expensive folding bikes.

If you look at the Pacific Cycle Reach its also not cheap. Airnimal folding bikes are also relatively expensive. Same for Tern BYB.

The Tyrell folding bikes are even more expensive.

The reason why most folding bikes are low cost is because most folding bike users buy a folding bike for seldom use and short distances, for many of them its a second (or third, fourth...) bike for occasional use.

There is only a small number of folding bike users that use a lot their bike and are looking for high quality, high reliability and high performances.

The first category is people commuting who use their folding bike daily, these are looking for a very reliable bike and for many of them a small and very quick folding bike. The Brompton is their first choice. If they want higher performances, much higher comfort while keeping a small fold, the Birdy is their choice.

Then the second category (which is even smaller than the commuters) are looking for a high performance folding bike easy to carry and as efficient as a not folding bike, these are the customers of BF Pocket Rocket, Tyrell FX/FSX, Airnimal, Pacific Cycle Reach... and probably yje Swift.