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Origami Swift - Thoughts, Ideas For a New Version of a Classic

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Origami Swift - Thoughts, Ideas For a New Version of a Classic

Old 05-24-22, 02:53 PM
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Originally Posted by mlau
Any updates on this bike?
I am still working on it. I have the drawings at about 90% and just need a few tweaks to make the prototype.
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Old 05-26-22, 12:25 AM
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Originally Posted by Pinigis
I am still working on it. I have the drawings at about 90% and just need a few tweaks to make the prototype.

Well, that's a teaser. Looking forward to seeing your prototype.
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Old 08-08-22, 05:43 AM
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pingisi

Can you share any updates?
I am looking forward to your new Swift design, ... waiting to change the mix of folders I have.
Thanks.
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Old 08-08-22, 07:19 AM
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Originally Posted by porschetoyz
pingisi

Can you share any updates?
I am looking forward to your new Swift design, ... waiting to change the mix of folders I have.
Thanks.
We have a couple of Proto types in production right now. I should be able to share photos of them with you in a couple of weeks
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Old 08-10-22, 08:57 AM
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Is it possible to ask the moderators to change the title of this thread from "Origami Swift - Thoughts and Ideas for a New Version of a Classic" to simply plain old "Origami Swift"?

When I named the discussion several months ago I was feeling quite exuberant and excited that Paul at Origami was moving forward with a new Swift and I wanted to convey that he was gathering feedback. It seems this project has proceeded to the point that Origami is at a prototype production stage and that this product may be available to purchase several months from now. Changing the title to "Origami Swift" In my opinion invites more broad discussion, yet preserves and consolidates rhe folding bike forum' feedback discussions under one topic.

Cheers!
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Old 08-10-22, 01:10 PM
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Originally Posted by Schwinnsta
One additional criticism of my Swift is the horizontal rear drop out. Running 2" tires meant using Surly Monkey nuts. I know you don't have to have them, but they make life easier. Also, if you'e running fenders, you have to go to extra lengths to assure you are able to pull out your wheel without removing the fenders. You can find workarounds, but are the horizontal dropouts worth it?
Don t you need horizontal dropouts if running an IGH?
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Old 08-10-22, 01:17 PM
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Originally Posted by jfouellette
Don t you need horizontal dropouts if running an IGH?
No, take Brompton for example.
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Old 08-10-22, 01:19 PM
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Originally Posted by jfouellette
Don t you need horizontal dropouts if running an IGH?
Well, there are other options, like eccentric bottom brackets or tensioners, but horizontal dropouts are best for and IGH. We chose to stick with vertical dropouts since our baseline will be a derailleur.
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Old 08-10-22, 02:07 PM
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OK, I need a little help. I lost track and cannot remember who first suggested that Origami bring back the Swift. If it was you, or if you know who it was, please let me know.
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Old 08-10-22, 02:07 PM
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Originally Posted by Pinigis
Well, there are other options, like eccentric bottom brackets or tensioners, but horizontal dropouts are best for and IGH. We chose to stick with vertical dropouts since our baseline will be a derailleur.
I think the reason the original Swift had had horizontal dropouts was for fixed gear / varying wheel sizes.
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Old 08-10-22, 02:09 PM
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Originally Posted by Pinigis
OK, I need a little help. I lost track and cannot remember who first suggested that Origami bring back the Swift. If it was you, or if you know who it was, please let me know.
It wasn't me but I like the idea of bringing it back.
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Old 08-10-22, 03:59 PM
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Originally Posted by Darth Lefty
Zee was discontinued this year.
I was able to buy one on Amazone just last week fwiw.
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Old 08-10-22, 05:31 PM
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Originally Posted by willydstyle
I was able to buy one on Amazone just last week fwiw.
That's good! The big retailers have been out of the "freeride" version for seems like ages already. Same with the 73 spindle crank, which was a screaming deal
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Old 08-10-22, 06:46 PM
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Lead times being what they are, I think being able to purchase an Origami Swift in only several months from now is really optimistic.

Originally Posted by joey buzzard
Is it possible to ask the moderators to change the title of this thread from "Origami Swift - Thoughts and Ideas for a New Version of a Classic" to simply plain old "Origami Swift"?

When I named the discussion several months ago I was feeling quite exuberant and excited that Paul at Origami was moving forward with a new Swift and I wanted to convey that he was gathering feedback. It seems this project has proceeded to the point that Origami is at a prototype production stage and that this product may be available to purchase several months from now. Changing the title to "Origami Swift" In my opinion invites more broad discussion, yet preserves and consolidates rhe folding bike forum' feedback discussions under one topic.

Cheers!
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Old 08-10-22, 10:02 PM
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Originally Posted by Darth Lefty
Zee was discontinued this year.
Source?
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Old 08-11-22, 08:11 AM
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Originally Posted by Ron Damon
Source?
It was deduction. Not like there was a news story. Maybe I'm wrong. Jenson is showing stock on the 36 derailleur again and "1 left" for the 73mm spindle cranket. Those had been gone for like a year. Maybe Shimano finally made more? Maybe QBP found a box? Edit: they don't have the brakes.

It's at the end of its cycle. It launched in 2012 and never got updated. It was always a little oddball in the 1x era. At the time Shimano was still seemingly committed to 2x fronts and SRAM was therefore eating their lunch. Freeride is not au courant like it was and downhillers like the premium version Saint, or other brands. And there was no talk of weight at all, it was always about sturdy, which is hard to sell next to a 1x XT set. Saint is also really long in the tooth, it's the last group remaining with a 3-digit groupset level number.

Zee found a lot of love outside its intended purpose. You are talking about the derailleurs here and serious bike dads also like it for kid bikes. The crankset was bulletproof with steel spindle and pedal eye inserts. The brakes were the cheapest 4-piston Shimano option for ages until the recent proliferation, so tandem and enduro riders bought them.

It's still present on bike.shimano.com
https://bike.shimano.com/en-US/produ.../zee-m640.html

but it's no longer shown in the lineup chart https://productinfo.shimano.com/#/lc

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Old 08-11-22, 08:51 AM
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Originally Posted by Pinigis
We have a couple of Proto types in production right now. I should be able to share photos of them with you in a couple of weeks
What user suggestions did you accept and implement?
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Old 08-11-22, 09:26 AM
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Originally Posted by anga
What user suggestions did you accept and implement?
Well, first was the general suggestion that we bring the Swift back. We focused on feedback for a wide gear range, option for bull bars (upcoming), disc brakes.
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Old 08-11-22, 10:05 AM
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Originally Posted by Pinigis
Well, first was the general suggestion that we bring the Swift back. We focused on feedback for a wide gear range, option for bull bars (upcoming), disc brakes.
Looking at the frame, the only suggestion you claim is disc brakes. If I recall correctly, you were strongly for disc brakes and more than one argued against disc brakes given the folding nature and potential for damage. You could have provided bosses for cantilever or v-brakes, in addition to disc brake tabs. You didn't.
Same with dropouts. Semi-horizontal or adjustable dropouts could've accomodated IGHs. You didn't bother.
The case is the same with Lotus. You didn't implement any user suggestions.

What is the point of these threads, other than to provide free publicity for your products?
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Old 08-11-22, 10:20 AM
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Originally Posted by anga
Looking at the frame, the only suggestion you claim is disc brakes. If I recall correctly, you were strongly for disc brakes and more than one argued against disc brakes given the folding nature and potential for damage. You could have provided bosses for cantilever or v-brakes, in addition to disc brake tabs. You didn't.
Same with dropouts. Semi-horizontal or adjustable dropouts could've accomodated IGHs. You didn't bother.
The case is the same with Lotus. You didn't implement any user suggestions.

What is the point of these threads, other than to provide free publicity for your products?
We weighed all suggestions, and we still have the opportunity to make changes.

We haven't stopped working on the Lotus, but we have put it on hold until cashflow is stronger
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Old 08-11-22, 12:34 PM
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[QUOTE=anga;22606767]Same with dropouts. Semi-horizontal or adjustable dropouts could've accomodated IGHs. You didn't bother.
The case is the same with Lotus. You didn't implement any user suggestions.

I do not see any validity to this criticism. IGH can be used with vertical dropouts. Again, look to Brompton. News flash: chains can be adjusted by adding or subtracting links.
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Old 08-11-22, 05:21 PM
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Originally Posted by Darth Lefty
It was deduction. Not like there was a news story. Maybe I'm wrong. Jenson is showing stock on the 36 derailleur again and "1 left" for the 73mm spindle cranket. Those had been gone for like a year. Maybe Shimano finally made more? Maybe QBP found a box? Edit: they don't have the brakes.

It's at the end of its cycle. It launched in 2012 and never got updated. It was always a little oddball in the 1x era. At the time Shimano was still seemingly committed to 2x fronts and SRAM was therefore eating their lunch. Freeride is not au courant like it was and downhillers like the premium version Saint, or other brands. And there was no talk of weight at all, it was always about sturdy, which is hard to sell next to a 1x XT set. Saint is also really long in the tooth, it's the last group remaining with a 3-digit groupset level number.

Zee found a lot of love outside its intended purpose. You are talking about the derailleurs here and serious bike dads also like it for kid bikes. The crankset was bulletproof with steel spindle and pedal eye inserts. The brakes were the cheapest 4-piston Shimano option for ages until the recent proliferation, so tandem and enduro riders bought them.

It's still present on bike.shimano.com
https://bike.shimano.com/en-US/produ.../zee-m640.html

but it's no longer shown in the lineup chart https://productinfo.shimano.com/#/lc

Yeah...rather premature. I would have sought industry confirmation before making such a definitive, blanket assertion, particularly in light of ongoing supply chain disruptions. Some folks were actually misled by this. Instead it should have read something like this, "I suspect Shimano is phasing out and may discontinue Zee because of X, Y and Z."

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Old 08-11-22, 05:28 PM
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I for one am really interested with disk brakes, there are plenty of other bikes with side pulls, and if you want v brakes the time machine is <-- thataway and Walmart is --> thataway
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Old 08-11-22, 05:42 PM
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IGH + chain tensioner = good for me. I have a Puma Nevis that I converted to an 8 speed Shimano Nexus IGH bike, and I use a chain tensioner, and I've NEVER had an issue with it - PERIOD!
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Old 08-11-22, 05:58 PM
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Originally Posted by Darth Lefty
I for one am really interested with disk brakes, there are plenty of other bikes with side pulls, and if you want v brakes the time machine is <-- thataway and Walmart is --> thataway
Bike seller wants disc, consumer wants disc, bike designer wants rim brakes. It plays out as expected.

There are personal choices, some of which are based on aesthetics and prestige (your buddies may turn up their nose at rim brakes and think you a country pumpkin) and not on facts. But, as a matter of verifiable fact, rim brakes are generally lighter, easier to adjust and maintain and cheaper while offering only marginally less good braking on folders. It is idiocy to dismiss rim brakes as an anachronism and a conceit to tar their users as Luddites or bottom-feeders. Particularly on folders. Comments like these give you insight into the minds of these silly, arrogant folk.

In any case it need not be either|or. Rim brake mounts can be easily manufactured onto a bike along with disc brake mounts.

Last edited by Ron Damon; 08-12-22 at 11:01 PM.
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