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Thoughts on the TERN verge x11 ?

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Thoughts on the TERN verge x11 ?

Old 06-14-23, 08:25 PM
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Thoughts on the TERN verge x11 ?

Was looking at this bike and wondering if anyone has one or has an opinion on one.
Thanks


https://www.ternbicycles.com/us/bikes/472/verge-x11
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Old 06-15-23, 12:36 AM
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Originally Posted by roguewave
Was looking at this bike and wondering if anyone has one or has an opinion on one.
Thanks


https://www.ternbicycles.com/us/bikes/472/verge-x11
$2,699? No. For that money I'd be looking for a bike that brings more to the table like a Pacific Cycles Reach.

Or for a lot less money, depending on your world location, I'd build myself a similar though better specced bike based on an FnHon Tornado frameset. And I'd still have about $1,500 leftover at the end.

FnHon Tornado frameset that goes for no more than $250 (handlepost included) in Asia.

...so that Tern for $2,699? No.​​​

Last edited by Ron Damon; 06-15-23 at 02:34 AM.
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Old 06-15-23, 02:38 AM
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Originally Posted by Ron Damon
$2,699? No. For that money I'd be looking for a bike that brings more to the table like a Pacific Cycles Reach.

Or for a lot less money, depending on your world location, I'd build myself a similar though better specced bike based on an FnHon Tornado frameset. And I'd still have about $1,500 leftover at the end.

FnHon Tornado frameset that goes for no more than $250 (handlepost included) in Asia.

...so that Tern for $2,699? No.​​​
thank you Ron for the input, I see the reach GT is $3020.
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Old 06-15-23, 07:47 AM
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The Fnhon looks like a good choice not only from a budget perspective but also for quality. In North America I think that Tern and Dahon market their bikes as high end products. This could explain the price differences.
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Old 06-15-23, 08:30 AM
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Originally Posted by jfouellette
In North America I think that Tern and Dahon market their bikes as high end products. This could explain the price differences.
I don't think anyone considers a Dahon Boardwalk a high end product. I think its safer to say that both Dahon and Tern have a range of models in a range of pricing ...
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Old 06-15-23, 08:57 AM
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The upcoming Origami Swift has a similarly-wide gear range (11 - 42t) but will be faster with its 58T chainring, will be chromoly, will also have hydraulic disc brakes, will come standard with full fenders and rear carrier rack/stand, will actually include pedals! Will cost less than $900
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Old 06-15-23, 09:27 AM
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Agree for people who follow the various available products. Those companies want to create the perception of high quality. Quality being defined on different criteria.
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Old 06-15-23, 01:43 PM
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I live in Europe, so no origami for me (or high shipping costs). I'm also not a mechanic, so I can't build a bike myself (or choose the right components).
I have the Tern Verge X11 and it's a great folding bike.

Keep in mind that it's built for the road, and good roads at that, as it uses thin tires.

I bought it 2 years ago and the price has now gone up 20% due to supply chain issues.
When I bought it, there were only two types of bikes: the cheap and the expensive.

The Verge X11 is expensive, but it's a performance bike.
The components are high end and I was pleasantly surprised because it rides almost like a regular bike. It rides better than my old MTB with mid-range components (Deore).
This is my first and only folding bike so I can't really compare.

Here are 2 interesting videos:
The first one is an honest and interesting review

The second one is by a guy who has a lot of experience with folders.

I can attest that the bike is tough. I have taken it to places not meant for it.

It's not the smallest folder, and when folded it doesn't roll well because the magnet isn't strong enough.

I agree with the conclusions of both videos: the X11 is incredible, but some components are overkill. And it's expensive.

They agree with the opinions posted here: you can have the same level of quality at a lower price.

Like the reviewers, I don't regret buying it.
I use my X11 for commuting (taking it on board) as often as I can, but I'm looking for a smaller folder for commuting as the train is too crowded at times.
I'll keep the X11 of course as I love it.

Think about how you're going to use your bike and watch the videos, You'll see if the Verge X11 is for you.
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Old 06-15-23, 04:13 PM
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Originally Posted by Pinigis
The upcoming Origami Swift has a similarly-wide gear range (11 - 42t) but will be faster with its 58T chainring, will be chromoly, will also have hydraulic disc brakes, will come standard with full fenders and rear carrier rack/stand, will actually include pedals! Will cost less than $900
For those new around here, Pinigis is the owner of the Origami so you'll need to take his suggestion as essentially advertisement.

"will be faster with its 58T chainring"
This is misleading. What he should have said instead is, "it can achieve, subject to rider input, a higher top-end speed". To me, the Swift is too highly geared for use with a rack as intended so buyer beware.


Yeah, good luck schlepping stuff up inclines on the included rack with only 28 gear-inches at the bottom.

Last edited by Ron Damon; 06-15-23 at 06:24 PM.
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Old 06-15-23, 07:08 PM
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Originally Posted by Ron Damon
For those new around here, Pinigis is the owner of the Origami so you'll need to take his suggestion as essentially advertisement.

"will be faster with its 58T chainring"
This is misleading. What he should have said instead is, "it can achieve, subject to rider input, a higher top-end speed". To me, the Swift is too highly geared for use with a rack as intended so buyer beware.


Yeah, good luck schlepping stuff up inclines on the included rack with only 28 gear-inches at the bottom.

If 28 gear inches isnít low enough for you itís a simple job to swap out the chainring. We will even do if for you for free.
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Old 06-15-23, 07:57 PM
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Originally Posted by Pinigis
If 28 gear inches isnít low enough for you itís a simple job to swap out the chainring. We will even do if for you for free.
Good to see that you provide that option. Though I reckon many folks won't pay attention when buying and have to do it themselves once they receive the bike.

Last edited by Ron Damon; 06-16-23 at 01:27 PM.
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Old 06-17-23, 10:25 AM
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Thanks y’all, good info !
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Old 06-21-23, 03:57 AM
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Well, the verge x11 is arguably the "tern Halo folding bike", they pretty much though everything at it. It is fitted with Sram Force1 and GX transmission components, Shimano Deore braking system. If you like at aluminium gravel bike fitted with this range of components, you will be in a similar price range.
Now, it is not cheap and for a commuting folding bike, it may be overkill and as other said, it is possible to find good folder that will do 90% of the job for 50% of the price. Look for something like shimano Sora groupset or Tiagra Hydraulic groupset.

I think the Verge P10 is a much better option than the X11 as the main "performance" difference is the weight saving on the crank (300g lighter), saddle and tyres Durano vs One... you can swap the tyres and remove the kickstand and fit the saddle you like....

The D9 is not bad but would need a 11-40 cassette, better tyres and saddle. It is heavier because on the wheelset which is stronger though.
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Old 06-21-23, 11:07 AM
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Originally Posted by Pinigis
If 28 gear inches isnít low enough for you itís a simple job to swap out the chainring. We will even do if for you for free.
It isn't. And the other poster is right. Most won't know how to make the swap, or that they could/should ask for you to do it for them. So .... why not offer the bike with a 22" low gear OEM, whatever that makes the top gear. I'm sure it will be over 100" which would be plenty. Those who want a 58T chainring will know where to get one, or you can make the same offer in your brochure.
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Old 06-21-23, 01:16 PM
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Originally Posted by Fentuz
Well, the verge x11 is arguably the "tern Halo folding bike", they pretty much though everything at it. It is fitted with Sram Force1 and GX transmission components, Shimano Deore braking system. If you like at aluminium gravel bike fitted with this range of components, you will be in a similar price range.
Now, it is not cheap and for a commuting folding bike, it may be overkill and as other said, it is possible to find good folder that will do 90% of the job for 50% of the price. Look for something like shimano Sora groupset or Tiagra Hydraulic groupset.

I think the Verge P10 is a much better option than the X11 as the main "performance" difference is the weight saving on the crank (300g lighter), saddle and tyres Durano vs One... you can swap the tyres and remove the kickstand and fit the saddle you like....

The D9 is not bad but would need a 11-40 cassette, better tyres and saddle. It is heavier because on the wheelset which is stronger though.
That's a fair assessment. Do not buy the X11 just for commuting.

However, its reduced weight compared to the P10 (1.5 kg) is welcome when you have to carry it up the stairs at the station if you use it also for commuting.

I really enjoy it when cycling in the countryside and on the long avenues of Paris.
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Old 06-21-23, 02:51 PM
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Originally Posted by Leisesturm
It isn't. And the other poster is right. Most won't know how to make the swap, or that they could/should ask for you to do it for them. So .... why not offer the bike with a 22" low gear OEM, whatever that makes the top gear. I'm sure it will be over 100" which would be plenty. Those who want a 58T chainring will know where to get one, or you can make the same offer in your brochure.
First gear in a 6-speed Brompton is 33 gear inches and I don't see people carrying them up hills.

A 22" first gear would give yo uan 84" top gear, not bad, but you will still be spinning out.
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Old 06-21-23, 03:38 PM
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Originally Posted by Pinigis
First gear in a 6-speed Brompton is 33 gear inches and I don't see people carrying them up hills.

A 22" first gear would give yo uan 84" top gear, not bad, but you will still be spinning out.
Your experience and outlook is limited then, if you think that a Brompton's gearing and 33 gear-inches are some sort of reference, or that 58T is an appropriate chainring size for a 406 size wheel bike with a cargo rack and 50mm wide tires.

In my experience of touring and riding around town with a load, a gear range of 22-84 gear-inches is far preferable to the stock gearing on the Swift. I rarely spin out and in the instances that it happens I think of it as the justifiable price for able to carry a load up inclines. A fair trade-off. My ISO406 wheel touring bikes have and have had a 47T chainring. 47T.

Finally, the underlying problem here is that the Swift is ambiguously placed. It's chromoly with a rack and 50mm wide tires (Kenda Kontact 50-406 as far as I can tell from the images on your website), yet it's meant for speed with a 58T ring in the front? What? As configured, it's neither fish nor fowl, neither a speed machine nor a tourer/utility carrier.

​​​​​
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Old 06-21-23, 04:54 PM
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Originally Posted by Ron Damon
Your experience and outlook is limited then, if you think that a Brompton's gearing and 33 gear-inches are some sort of reference, or that 58T is an appropriate chainring size for a 406 size wheel bike with a cargo rack and 50mm wide tires.

In my experience of touring and riding around town with a load, a gear range of 22-84 gear-inches is far preferable to the stock gearing on the Swift. I rarely spin out and in the instances that it happens I think of it as the justifiable price for able to carry a load up inclines. A fair trade-off. My ISO406 wheel touring bikes have and have had a 47T chainring. 47T.

Finally, the underlying problem here is that the Swift is ambiguously placed. It's chromoly with a rack and 50mm wide tires (Kenda Kontact 50-406 as far as I can tell from the images on your website), yet it's meant for speed with a 58T ring in the front? What? As configured, it's neither fish nor fowl, neither a speed machine nor a tourer/utility carrier.

​​​​​
cool, like I said earlier, we are happy to swap the 58t gif 52t at no cost.

The Swift is designed for versatility, thatís we prove such a wide gear range. Yes, it can do a lot
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Old 06-22-23, 01:44 AM
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Originally Posted by Pinigis
A 22" first gear would give yo uan 84" top gear, not bad, but you will still be spinning out.
Not sure about that, my training bike it geared got 27 to 85 and I don't spin out.
My gravel is geared for either 19 to 87 or 21 to 97 depending of terrain. I don't spin out; most I get is 90 to 100 rpm.
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Old 06-22-23, 02:23 AM
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Originally Posted by Pinigis
cool, like I said earlier, we are happy to swap the 58t gif 52t at no cost.

The Swift is designed for versatility, thatís we prove such a wide gear range. Yes, it can do a lot
Cool. So stock, it is neither utility hauler or tourer, or a road rig for speedy riding. Yeah, real versatile.
​​
Btw, my offer to build one up still stands. At least I'd build it with clarity of purpose, with no 100-odd gear inches at the top and 50mm wide tires together with a pannier rack and a misleading boast that's it's faster than a Tern X11 cuz it's got a 58T chainring.

Last edited by Ron Damon; 06-22-23 at 03:24 AM.
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Old 06-22-23, 07:42 AM
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Originally Posted by Ron Damon
Cool. So stock, it is neither utility hauler or tourer, or a road rig for speedy riding. Yeah, real versatile.
​​
Btw, my offer to build one up still stands. At least I'd build it with clarity of purpose, with no 100-odd gear inches at the top and 50mm wide tires together with a pannier rack and a misleading boast that's it's faster than a Tern X11 cuz it's got a 58T chainring.
We have made frame kits available on our website for those who want a custom build.
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