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Bastille Folding Bike (France)

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Bastille Folding Bike (France)

Old 05-29-24, 10:05 AM
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Bastille Folding Bike (France)

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Old 05-29-24, 07:14 PM
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Originally Posted by john m flores
Interesting fold but tres expensive and heavy. Also limited to hub gears as configured. Note how low the handlebar is, and any mod to the stem is going to increase the fold dimension.
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Old 05-30-24, 05:50 AM
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Originally Posted by Schwinnsta
Interesting fold but tres expensive and heavy. Also limited to hub gears as configured. Note how low the handlebar is, and any mod to the stem is going to increase the fold dimension.
The pivoting seat as the seatpost quick release is a neat idea.
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Old 05-30-24, 06:26 AM
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Ah, a dapper Frenchman leaving his Paris flat with his folding bike. Peugeot La Pliante (Captain Gerard) 1900:



"La Pliante est la bicyclette la moins encombrante, puisque l'on peut, en quelques secondes, réduire son volume de moitié. Cette réduction de volume permet au cycliste de monter sa machine dans son appartement, au lieu de la laisser en dépôt dans un garage."


Originally Posted by Schwinnsta
Also limited to hub gears as configured.
Am I missing the part where a different model with the same fold could be fitted with derailleurs?

Last edited by tcs; 05-30-24 at 12:33 PM.
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Old 05-30-24, 07:32 AM
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More info from the designer

https://armandserafini.fr/en/bastille-en/
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Old 05-30-24, 09:49 AM
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Big wheels = too big folded size!

And, it seems, no possibility to mount a rear rack to carry something on the bike due to the way it folds?
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Old 05-30-24, 12:24 PM
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Originally Posted by Jipe
And, it seems, no possibility to mount a rear rack to carry something on the bike due to the way it folds?
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Old 05-30-24, 05:29 PM
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Originally Posted by Jipe
Big wheels = too big folded size!
Says YOU! Not everyone wants a 16" or 20" folder... We each have different preferences.
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Old 05-31-24, 01:56 AM
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Originally Posted by tds101
Says YOU! Not everyone wants a 16" or 20" folder... We each have different preferences.
Yes, indeed, but the market show the same, big wheels folding bikes represent a small percentage of the folding bike market with only a couple of brands selling only big wheels folding bikes, the vast majority of folding bikes have small wheels.

When you look at the posts on this forum, the vast majority is about small wheels folding bikes.

Big wheels folding bikes are clearly a niche market.

Last edited by Jipe; 05-31-24 at 03:10 AM.
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Old 05-31-24, 03:43 AM
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https://techcrunch.com/2023/10/05/ba...lding-bicycle/



Sweet!
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Old 05-31-24, 04:14 AM
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Originally Posted by Jipe
Yes, indeed, but the market show the same, big wheels folding bikes represent a small percentage of the folding bike market with only a couple of brands selling only big wheels folding bikes, the vast majority of folding bikes have small wheels.

When you look at the posts on this forum, the vast majority is about small wheels folding bikes.

Big wheels folding bikes are clearly a niche market.
I own a Tern joe P24, and I've had more people interested in the larger folding bike than my smaller folders. The posts you see here in the forums are a niche group of users. This isn't indicative of all people wanting a folder. People that I've spoken with prefer the ride quality of the larger folder. The real reason that Americans aren't "interested" in larger folding bikes is because of their lack of availability. NOT because of the desire to own a smaller folder for travel, commuting, etc. It's the manufacturers deciding to omit the North American market for these types of bikes.

Stop "assuming", it's ridiculous.
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Old 05-31-24, 05:16 AM
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If you ask people who never tried a small wheel bike what they would prefer, almost all of them will tell you that they want a full size wheel folding bike.

Every time a new big wheels folding bike appear on the market (Bastille is by far not the first one), the manufacturer say that he has made marketing studies telling him that customers want big wheels, that big wheels are much better, but at the end of the day, sales do not confirm what the results of these marketing studies.

If the manufacturers and resellers do not sell big wheels folding bikes, its because the market is too small, its not profitable.

And its not only in the US, its the same in Europe including in countries where there a lots of cyclists like The Netherlands, Belgium, Denmark... where there are many bike-shops selling folding bikes but not big wheels folding bikes. Even specialized online folding bike shops selling many brands of folding bikes including less known ones do not sell lots of big wheels folding bikes.

Tern and Dahon have a wide range of folding bikes including big wheels folding bikes, resellers and customers have the choice between the big wheels and small wheels and prefer the small wheels bikes.

You can see above a picture of a Peugeot big wheels folding bike from 1901 more than a century ago, so such big wheels folding bikes aren't new, they all were commercial failure. Montague exists sine decades, well known but sales are still small.

The reason is very simple: most people who buy a folding bike do so because they need a bike which folds small, for other purpose they use a not folding bike.

For the people on this forum, they are nor stupid nor ignorant, they know that there are big wheels folding bikes, they also know that its easily possible to buy them online but most of them use small wheels folding bikes.

Last edited by Jipe; 05-31-24 at 05:21 AM.
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Old 05-31-24, 07:24 AM
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Originally Posted by Jipe
If you ask people who never tried a small wheel bike what they would prefer, almost all of them will tell you that they want a full size wheel folding bike.

Every time a new big wheels folding bike appear on the market (Bastille is by far not the first one), the manufacturer say that he has made marketing studies telling him that customers want big wheels, that big wheels are much better, but at the end of the day, sales do not confirm what the results of these marketing studies.

If the manufacturers and resellers do not sell big wheels folding bikes, its because the market is too small, its not profitable.

And its not only in the US, its the same in Europe including in countries where there a lots of cyclists like The Netherlands, Belgium, Denmark... where there are many bike-shops selling folding bikes but not big wheels folding bikes. Even specialized online folding bike shops selling many brands of folding bikes including less known ones do not sell lots of big wheels folding bikes.

Tern and Dahon have a wide range of folding bikes including big wheels folding bikes, resellers and customers have the choice between the big wheels and small wheels and prefer the small wheels bikes.

You can see above a picture of a Peugeot big wheels folding bike from 1901 more than a century ago, so such big wheels folding bikes aren't new, they all were commercial failure. Montague exists sine decades, well known but sales are still small.

The reason is very simple: most people who buy a folding bike do so because they need a bike which folds small, for other purpose they use a not folding bike.

For the people on this forum, they are nor stupid nor ignorant, they know that there are big wheels folding bikes, they also know that its easily possible to buy them online but most of them use small wheels folding bikes.
As I've stated, larger wheel folding bikes aren't available in North America, and it's the manufacturers who decide what markets receive which bikes. The public will choose whatever is available to them, and most here seem to be more interested in the larger folder. Space isn't as limited, but they like the ability to fold the bike for apt dwelling. Where the idea of people here being stupid or ignorant, that's on you. You have your opinion, I have mine.
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Old 05-31-24, 09:08 AM
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Folded sizes, all manufacturer's claim:

Bastille: 88x74x33cm or 0.214 cubic metres
Verge D9: 80x74x44cm or 0.260
Verge S8: 81x73x42cm or 0.248
Verge P10: 80x74x38cm or 0.225
Mu SL: 85x66x43cm or 0.241
Mariner: 85x69x40cm or 0.234
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Old 05-31-24, 10:47 AM
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Originally Posted by tds101
As I've stated, larger wheel folding bikes aren't available in North America, and it's the manufacturers who decide what markets receive which bikes. The public will choose whatever is available to them, and most here seem to be more interested in the larger folder. Space isn't as limited, but they like the ability to fold the bike for apt dwelling. Where the idea of people here being stupid or ignorant, that's on you. You have your opinion, I have mine.
Please read my post: I wrote: "For the people on this forum, they are nor stupid nor ignorant", not the opposite as you said.

Both Montague and Changebike are available in the US. Same for the Tern Eclipse.

Anyway, the market is always right!

Time will tell if this new big wheels bike will be a commercial success.

Bi-fold aren't really small, Brompton (58.5cm x 56.5cmm x 27cm), Curl (54 x 27 x 58cm), Birdy (61cm x 33cm x 72cm), Iruka (78cm x 48cm x 35cm), Tyrell Ive ( 61cm × 71cm × 35cm) Vellobike (57cm x 79cm x 29cm) are small folding bikes.
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Old 05-31-24, 11:41 AM
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The seat flips for a smaller fold, that's neat!
Will it flip when hitting a bump causing a painful problem?

I need a MUCH closer look at the folding mechanisms AND a test ride.
Granted, it LOOKS great, but it states 300 unique parts.

That's a BIG "yike" from me.

A lot of failure points and wear points.
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Old 05-31-24, 03:44 PM
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$2700 for a bike that weighs 33 pounds is kinda yikes no?
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Old 06-01-24, 03:42 AM
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Originally Posted by CrimsonEclipse
The seat flips for a smaller fold, that's neat!
Will it flip when hitting a bump causing a painful problem?

I need a MUCH closer look at the folding mechanisms AND a test ride.
Granted, it LOOKS great, but it states 300 unique parts.

That's a BIG "yike" from me.

A lot of failure points and wear points.
Yes, indeed. Besides its folding size an ease to fold, like for any folding bike, the long term reliability of the folding is also a potential issue.
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Old 06-01-24, 04:26 AM
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There’s a sizeable market of folding bike riders whose needs are driven by their multimodal commutes and the limitations that places upon them. For example, most peak hour commuter trains in and out of London don’t accept bikes at all unless they are a folding bike with 20” wheels or smaller. Larger wheels don’t meet this requirement and risk you being turned away.
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Old 06-01-24, 10:09 AM
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Originally Posted by Jipe
Please read my post: I wrote: "For the people on this forum, they are nor stupid nor ignorant", not the opposite as you said.

Both Montague and Changebike are available in the US. Same for the Tern Eclipse.

Anyway, the market is always right!

Time will tell if this new big wheels bike will be a commercial success.

Bi-fold aren't really small, Brompton (58.5cm x 56.5cmm x 27cm), Curl (54 x 27 x 58cm), Birdy (61cm x 33cm x 72cm), Iruka (78cm x 48cm x 35cm), Tyrell Ive ( 61cm × 71cm × 35cm) Vellobike (57cm x 79cm x 29cm) are small folding bikes.
I wanted to make sure an assumption wasn't being made...

Concerning the Montague, Changebike, and even Tern, all three are mail order only, which is the issue. Zizzo is available at via internet sales (Costco, Amazon, etc), Origami via the internet as well, but neither offer a larger folder for fear that the market won't support it. When covid occurred was the oppoptunity to test those waters. Especially since they're two of the most fairly priced companies in North America. Dahon is is overpriced (I know of 2+ B&M locations to get a Dahon in NYC/Long Island), and Tern is nowhere to be found. At least Zizzo & Origami provide REAL customer support. Just no bikes sized lager than 20".

Is the market always right? No, it's not. Opportunities are missed, due to fear of the unknown.


Originally Posted by Reddleman
There’s a sizeable market of folding bike riders whose needs are driven by their multimodal commutes and the limitations that places upon them. For example, most peak hour commuter trains in and out of London don’t accept bikes at all unless they are a folding bike with 20” wheels or smaller. Larger wheels don’t meet this requirement and risk you being turned away.
In NYC the small sized bikes are allowed, as well as folders w/wheels up to 700c. In Europe it's an issue of bike size, not so much in the USA. I can't speak for Canada.
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Old 06-01-24, 12:37 PM
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For Montreal, here are the rules for folding bikes on public transport

Do you have a folding scooter or folding bicycle?

At any time, it is permitted to transport a scooter or a folding bike as long as they remain folded for the entire duration of your trip.
  • Gasoline scooters are prohibited for safety reasons.
  • You must not interfere with the circulation of passengers and staff.
  • It is important that your folding bike or scooter does not compromise the safety of our employees, other passengers or vehicles.

https://www.stm.info/en/info/advice/...es-are-welcome
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Old 06-01-24, 01:54 PM
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Tern Store US Eclipse P20: 1699USD

Tern Store US Eclipse D16: 1099USD

If somebody want a big wheel folding bike in the US, no problem to buy one, and the price is not very high, much less than a Brompton for instance that sells pretty well in the US, price range is between the small wheels Verge and Link which also sells well.
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Old 06-01-24, 02:26 PM
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Originally Posted by Jipe
Tern Store US Eclipse P20: 1699USD

Tern Store US Eclipse D16: 1099USD

If somebody want a big wheel folding bike in the US, no problem to buy one, and the price is not very high, much less than a Brompton for instance that sells pretty well in the US, price range is between the small wheels Verge and Link which also sells well.
Is it available in a B&M location? How is Tern when it comes to customer service? Is there something that was missed or misunderstood? At least Changebike and Montague will EVENTUALLY respond to inquires, unlike Tern AND Dahon, with their lacklustre customer support.
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Old 06-01-24, 02:34 PM
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Originally Posted by tds101
Is it available in a B&M location? How is Tern when it comes to customer service? Is there something that was missed or misunderstood? At least Changebike and Montague will EVENTUALLY respond to inquires, unlike Tern AND Dahon, with their lacklustre customer support.
Says YOU! Not everyone is unhappy with Tern and Dahon... We each have different preferences.
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Old 06-01-24, 02:43 PM
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Originally Posted by Jipe
Says YOU! Not everyone is unhappy with Tern and Dahon... We each have different preferences.
Nope... Says quite a few of our discerning forum members. Just because you find no usage for larger wheeled folding bikes doesn't mean others won't enjoy them. It's the same as the 16" wheeled folders. It's all about what the individual prefers, and not about one members "preference".

You're a wealth of knowledge, but facts are Tern, and especially DAHON, are known for crap customer service, and making customers jump through hoops for warranty claims. That's a FACT, not opinion OR preference. I own/ed both brands of folder, as well as others. Tern is bad now (they were a complete FAIL a few years ago, but have improved - I do like the Eclipse line), but Dahon has some of the worst customer support...PERIOD!
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