Do you rate the Schlumpf drive makeinu?

I tried it on a Carryme and thought it was very inefficient. Given the reports I've read I suspect it was maladjusted but I'm not sure if that absolves the inefficiency because one of the nice things about a single speed is that once you get the chain tension set there's nothing to maladjust.

Lately I've been starting to think that anything more than a single speed just isn't worth the extra weight, hassle, and expense. For commuting, the other traffic doesn't like it when you gear down to a snail's pace in order to go uphill and by the time you get to the top there's no sense in getting even sweatier (not to mention putting yourself in danger by reaching unsafe speeds) pushing a high gear downhill either. Derailleurs are out of the question on a folder because oily chains are unacceptable. So after fiddling with the gear shifter on the road, adjusting it at home, and pedaling that much harder to make up for the additional inefficiency and weight, I just don't know if it's worth it.

My Downtube VIIIH has 8 speeds, but I can't honestly say that it's easier or faster to go anywhere than it is on my 17 pound Carryme. It's a bit more comfortable (especially since the Carryme's 8 inch wheels drop off in efficiency rather sharply below 80 psi), but I don't ride trails or offroad, so the longer the rides I take the smoother the roads tend to be and discomfort never becomes much of a problem (and even if it did there are plenty of places where the Carryme's frame could benefit by fixing an elastomer or simply replacing the saddle).


In truth I'm actually not as enthusiastic about the IF Mode as I used to be, which is probably a good thing as far as my wallet is concerned. It's easy to get wrapped up in all the marketing about more gears and big wheels, but sometimes less is more and I'm having trouble justifying why I would spend hundreds or thousands on a heavier bike that would be almost impossible to conceal from belligerent security guards when I already have one that weighs less than most expensive road bikes, rides great, and can be passed off as a baby buggy ("a baby doesn't ride a bike and an adult doesn't ride a stroller" as BF's Lynette was scolded by one security guard about her tikit, but I doubt anyone would think twice if I covered the cranks of my Carryme and called it a baby buggy). Besides, fit and quality control is so hit or miss that I'm not particularly enamored with the idea of wasting my time seeking out a new dream folder when I already won the lotto with my current one (that is, won the lotto in that I got a bike that I enjoy, fits perfectly, and isn't a lemon or was at least put together properly unlike so very many of the folders I've tried before...including Bike Fridays, Bromptons, Dahons, Carrymes, etc).

That's not to say I wouldn't like to try an IF Mode or that I don't think it will be successful in the market. On the contrary, I think that many people who can't get over the psychological barrier of small wheels will find the IF Mode to be their dream bike, but unmarketable as it is, when push comes to shove I think the Carryme will prove to be a better bike for the purpose of "take/ride everywhere metropolitan bike".

Makeinu, so you are saying that you have had other carryme's that were lemons or otherwise poor quality?

As I said, I tried a 2-speed Carryme in a shop and the drive train felt inefficient. I don't know if it was a lemon, a bad design, or just not adjusted properly, but, as I said, I suspect it's the latter.

In any case my point was that shopping for a new bike is hard work when the entire industry has an ingrained attitude that they can take things lightly under the assumption that their customers are hobbyists. It seems that when it comes to bicycles if the design isn't screwed up then the manufacturing probably is, and if the manufacturing isn't screwed up then the quality control probably is, and if the quality control isn't screwed up then the workmanship at the shop probably is, and even if it all goes right then the bike probably won't fit that well anyway and nobody cares because they know that the vast majority of cycle customers just buy on whim anyway. So now that I have a bike I'm happy with there's not much motivation for me to deal with this kind of crap in order to buy a new one and I'm perfectly content to quell my socially endowed consumerist tendencies and just stick with what I got. It's just an attitude I seem to have developed that really has nothing to do with the Carryme or the IF Mode or any other particular bike.

Interesting to hear the Carryme is so good. It certainly looked like it was made of top quality components in the shop where I saw it. But I'd never call a Brompton a 'lemon' lol! The Brompton is to me what the Carryme is to makeinu. Being a gadget lover, I'd have to say the Brompton is the best one I've had. As a bicycle it is very capable and the fold is superb.

We see lots of innovations every year in bike parts but 2008-9 should be the 'year of the fold' starting with the release of the Tikit, then the IF bikes and possibly the Dahon Curl. Time to see more innovation in the folding mechanism itself.

Perhaps there's a bit of a culture clash here, but when I said "lemon" I just meant a bike with manufacturing defects. Surely you can admit that not every Brompton on every show floor is equally perfect (I know I can because I've seen some less than perfect ones).

Anyway, sorry to derail this thread with thoughts which really have more to do with my personal sentiment than the IF Mode. I agree that the folding bike industry seems to be bursting with innovation and the IF bikes are a prime example.

if mode seems to be perfect...definitely cant wait to test it out...

Right fold not withstanding, a folded Cross seems to have substaintially more exposed chain than a folded Dahon Curl, which Brompton users have already declared inadequately cloistered.

tcs

My comparison was with current Dahons of which the IF Cross offers comparatively more grime protection in addition to derailleur protection. I agree the Curl is also a big improvement over current Dahons, but Dahon has never even said if/when they are bringing it to market. All there is of the Curl is a patent and a prototype (and Dahon doesn't always end up producing those...I distinctly remember Dahon demonstrating some ultra-low profile folding pedals a few years ago and they never surfaced).

Besides if you ask me the Brompton's chain is also inadequately cloistered if you want to use a lot of oil. The chainring is still flush with the back of the bike (as opposed to recessed) and there's no protection from drip.

Ah, this explains your anti-oil stance. :) But chains should be as dry as possible on the outside. A "dripping" chain I have NEVER seen, let alone let out of my garage. :thumb:

It's not the oil that drips, but the water that picks up dirt from the messy chain. Brake pads are nearly as bad which is one reason why I'm also pro coaster brake (though I make an exception for extra light road calipers on ultralight folders).

But I was hinting at the fact that ideally a chain should be dripping wet with oil and enclosed, but you can't do that without a chain case (which the Brompton lacks and the IF Mode has).

Hey shuguru314,

Cool post on your Blog, Thanks! Here is another quick youtube video I attempted put together with the Mode we just sent off to the Eurobike Awards put on the International Forum (IF) Design. September 4th we find out the results.

www.youtube.com/v/BD2lFgMfh2k

Mode features mechanical disc front and rear with the housing is routed internally in the frame and fork so hydraulics were not an easy assembly option. And disc brakes offer a clean solution for brake attachment and keep it clean and simple.

The drive train features a Schlumpf 2 speed with a casual cruising gear and shift up to speed your way along. Then in the rear there is a unique free hub body that allows the wheel to freewheel either forward or backward. This feature is most beneficial when rolling Mode backwards because the cranks will not rotate and grab onto thing.

I will know more pricing details next week when I have a chance to review things with our sales staff. Too much time in the R&D lab for me lately getting ready for Eurobike and Interbike and Cycle Mode Japan.

Hi BC-303

Great video really shows off the folding capability of the bike. Have to say Pacific are always willing to challenge the norm and implement new innovations on the fold. The amount of people who are converted once they use a folder is amazing. This Pacific IF mode will make folding bikes more accessible to consumers who prefer larger wheels. The fold and ergonomics is beautiful. Do you plan to offer one with hub gears too as I believe this will extend the bikes range beyond commuting?

Any plans to work on the Reach soon? Would love to see a video of the Reach IF mode!

The folding/rolling design is way cool.

But I'd want more gears so I could ride the bike on hills too. I've sold my mountain bike and my Motobecane road bike and want an omni-purpose bike, suitable for light XC, toting groceries, and commuting.

Are front-wheel-drive designs feasible? E.g. with an IGH on the front wheel?

The IGH would be outside the fold and not interfere with the wheel-wheel kiss. The frame would hinge in front of the seatpost behind the crank.

Regards
T

+1 for more gearing. Is it possible to fit the 8 speed Shimano Alfine hub at all RC-303? That provides a really smooth quiet shift that would suit a fine bike like the IF.

Unless my eyes are not following the video, when the bike folds, the wheels appear to "kiss" -- the right side of the front wheel touches the left side of the rear wheel -- and so a hub would prevent that perfectly parallel alignment, adding 135mm (minus the width of the wheel there now) to the width of the rear.

Regards
T

this is Giuseppe. Nice meeting you here.
 

Hello Ryan,

this is Giuseppe. Nice meeting you here.

Just Beautyful the IF Mode. I guess I can get into the subway real easy with that bike.
I want to buy one!

I am finishing right now a purchasing list of parts to build several Mini125RD. The latest evolution of our portable bike.
I do not go to Eurobike this year, however a small group of the MDEbikes buddies will show from Friday.

BTW, I am climbing all what I find. That 4000m mountain in Taiwan might be a good climb. I have to show up one day, play you guys a visist and climb that mountain.

Hello All,

Thanks for the comment. Mode has been a real challange to incorporate all the unique features of the iF system into something so simple. Currently, for the slim fold the frame features single sided front fork and rear arm with narrowed hubs. Because of the single sided rear arm we could not use traditional internal geared or cassette hubs to achieve the correct width and attachment style.

Having the option to use the Schlumpf created gearing equal to a 3 speed internal rear but just get the high and low. Throughout test riding this was an acceptable solution for getting around town and back and forth I found.

The new Reach frame that we added iF to does feature a full range of gearing. We will have it on display at Eurobike. When I get back in the factory I can put together a video of how this bike works.

For the iF Reach we developed a slightly narrowed rear hub by changing the left side lock nut stlye. This allowed for us to create a slightly narrowed fold over using a standard 135 or 130 rear cassette hub.

For our iF Cross frame we also took what we learned from the iF Reach and created a full size wheel that easily folds. One of my favorite days was going riding at a local bicycle path area and when at the parking lot, many suprised fellow cyclists wondered where did 2 full sized iF Cross bikes come from? I think I spent about 30 minutes showing all how 2 iF Cross bikes just folded and went back into the trunk of the car. Playing with prototypes is always fun on days like this.

Currently, from the main frame hinge rearward we can use any style bicycle frame and drive train because that part of the bike remains the same. The front is the complicated part that has a 3 dimensional folding 4 bar linkage that hinges and pivots the head tube and fork around to axially match up the front wheel in the rear. it would be possible for a front drive but any drive train monted on the front would have to be hand powered so it would not interfer with the folding.

Right now I am in Darmstadt, Germany with my iF Mode and headed down to Eurobike on Monday. I look forward to seeing all who have the chance to visit.

Later,

Ryan

irrespective of compactness of fold, chain position etc etc..

you really have got to say the mode is a cool looking thing... would brighten up my commute - much as a love my brommie

i think a if reach might be on the shopping list as this looks like a good alround bike with the IF sorting out the failing of the current reach fold (taking the front whel out!)

Look forward to visit you and nice bike at the Eurobike on Sunday :)

I think this is a new video of the IF Mode on You Tube. Still looks like a pretty cool bike.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BD2lFgMfh2k

I bought the IF MODE and within a week, the paintwork and Pacific decals started peeling off in many different areas. Of course the poor paintwork peeled off the hinge areas albeit extremely quickly but paint also peeled off in unexpected areas. I have tried to speak to Juan who is the UK representative for Pacific Cycles but he seems to always be unavailable. Very poor customer support for a very expensive product. While I am here, I will also mention the gear change is very clunky and does not seem very durable.
Also, the disk brakes are not very powerful, you can't tighten them either as this would stop the wheel going round when the bike is folded and pushed along. Quite the glaring oversight. Based on Juans lack of any help whatsoever and the very early problems I am experiencing, I would not advise buying this bike.