Have not seen nor tried a Mezzo, don't wear cleated shoes...well not the modern versions. There aren't any folding bikes here where I live,except the ones I own. Any time I travel I keep an eye out for shops that stock them and pay them a visit.

Aaron :)

I actually got a letter from my folding bike's manufacturer that told me my frame might crack under normal use, it was a known problem with their design, and if the frame did crack they would NOT replace it and I'd have to buy another. Of course, this wasn't with Dahon, it was BikeFriday.

It doesn't seem to be, although Dahon's engineering department has clearly breathed on the design. The EEZZ (which is not for sale yet) seems to be a further development of this concept, and I'm hoping Dahon will expand this frame fold into other, more broadly useful models which offer a bit longer wheelbase and the ability to fit industry standard internal gear hubs.

So the "tried every folding bike and only the Brompton fits" is less of a grand supporting statement now !!!!

I don't feel that the pedal to seat length is a big strength of a Brompton here.
I dont feel that a Brompton fits a person of 5"8 or more very well, this is partly due to the lack of cockpit space, and the pedal to seat distance for me (5 foot 11). There are lots of people who disagree, or think it is OK given the complete Brommie package. Bromptons tend to fit women really well in my experience.

I feel lots of peope will only consider a Brompton when they consider a folding bike, and that the opposition gets overlooked due to hype/ bais in some quarters. So I don't think anything that Dahon does will greatly alter this postion with these 16" wheel bike consumers. From what I can gather on forums this effect is greater in some countries than others. In York, UK, I mainly see either Bromptons or 20" Dahons on trains, nothing else much.
Anyway Dahon make an extendable seatpost, Brompton do , bike friday do ttbomk, standard mezzo seatpost is fairly long.

Most people don't alter their bike much, but many of these shortcomings can be overcome by the meddling.
I might be interested in this Dahon, but not at full RRP.

I've read the arguments against Dahon and the aluminum frame and I think it clearly demonstrated some misunderstanding.

Most folding bikes are made as a one size fits all, except for some custom models. A one size fits all principle works well for most people, but obviously if you're too short or too tall, there will be challenges. This is a limitation of the sizing principle; NOT the brand maker. Dahon fits me well. Brompton, however, does not fit me well. Yes, I've rented many times from Clever Cycles. But this is just a sizing issue and it's got to do with the length of the top tube of any bike which should put you in a C.G (center of gravity) that feels right in all riding positions (climbing, seated and sprinting) to give maximum pedal stroke. I think it's rather silly and childish to criticize one maker for not making the correct frame size for you.

Secondly. Folding frames have to be designed to be more robust on the hinges. 10 years or more so ago, aluminum frames had to be overdesigned to prevent liability issues. These days, they are more robust especially on Tern bikes. Keep in mind that technology of bikes move forward, but people still adopt a certain dogma of prior years that they had the bad experience from a certain manufacturer and then make it as fact forever and goes around bad mouthing it. Unrealized for the fact that today's bikes are engineered with improvements from the past. Bike makers always make better bikes next year. This is to entice people who are loyal to a brand to upgrade either to address some older outstanding issues or simply to upgrade to a more appropriate ride.

The Jifo 16 is not for everyone. But sometimes I found that this forum has members who have a tendency to provide virtual opinion on a product they HAD NOT even seen or ridden and to provide un-factual opinion and make it as fact.

Fascinating..

common
adj.
2. Widespread; prevalent.

failure
n.
7. A decline in strength or effectiveness.

Here's one: http://www.flickr.com/photos/yokohamarides/3773585007/
Or here: http://www.bikeforums.net/archive/in.../t-575813.html
Or here: http://forum.dahon.com/index.php?showtopic=6487
Or here: http://www.tomw.net.au/2005/bbb.html
More than one here: http://www.bikeforums.net/archive/in.../t-281134.html


I'm a mobile bike mechanic, you're a Dahon dealer.

Yes, I can.

Your original statement involved the steering tube.

Maybe I missed something, but your examples don't appear to support your position. And your position seems to be that this result is invevitable. And your definition of "failure" is puzzling to me.

Of course, we don't know the actual number and types of failures. However, IMHO, a failure rate of less than 2% is not common/widespread/prevalent.

BTW, I think Thor may qualify as a bike mechanic. :)

-HANK RYAN-
Norman, Oklahoma USA

How does this jibe with their lifetime frame warranty? http://www.bikefriday.com/service/policies

one a year ..... lol
did you check the dates ?
give me a break .... oops ...rather not

You just prooved my point, obviously you spend considerable time searching and thats all you can come up with ?
Dahon made something like 3 million folding bikes in that period of time ....

Ouch ....


yeah Mr Bike Mechanic and where is your agenda ?
I dont make no secret about being a dealer .... and I sign with my own name ....
Thor

If you are going to quote me quote the entire line...I have never, ever been told by Dahon, Dahon Dealers, nor have I ever seen mention of extension seat posts for Dahon bikes, until now.

I don't mind a short cockpit, my daily rider for years was a Raleigh Sports and they have a short cockpit, so that is what I am comfortable with. Leg extension is more critical to me.

Aaron :)

While the retail price is somewhat lower than the Brompton (but not all that much), I too will pass as I prefer a steel frame, more gearing, a neater fold, and most of all, proven reliability/durability and unique proprietary parts ease of availability. Even my early 1970s Raleigh Twenty & Jetstar has those qualities. I just don't see it in this new product just like my former Dahons before it. Sorry, definitely not a Brompton killer in any way.


I'm not alone that's for sure.

I rather go "vintage" with folding bikes as there are many more of those "old" bikes here than the new ones-like the one that is the subject of this thread-will be 40 years from now.

Actually, the only thing most people like the ones describe above cares about is how cheap the price of the bike is plus what their friends think of their choice in bicycles. Everything else is moot.

With folding or "oddball" bikes, it is a matter of education or even awareness of the existence of this bike type in the first place. Most people are just interested in paying as little as they can toward a bike or use what any old bike they have in the back of the garage. As for single speed, I just upgraded my former single speed Jetstar bike to a kickback 2 speed one. There is much more ease of climbing up long hills. Believe me, there is.

As for sales, I always see a Dahon or 2 listed on Ebay or Craigslist for sale all the time. I only saw 1 Brompton on Ebay a long while back (and sold very quickly). Bromptons are rarely on the used bike market-especially in North America. Dahons usually are. So will this one eventually when the customer gets tired of it and it loses it's appeal just like most products in this throwaway society.

Fair point, I was paraphrasing. Sorry, I should have made that clearer.


Re Dahon ex post
They certainly exist, I had one on my Dahon curve. I think Dahon might have stopped producing their extending seatpost, But last time I said this I had a reply stating if I needed one they could supply me with one.

I turned a Dahon SDG seatpost into an extending seat post, not to make it longer but so that it accepts a 27.2mm Thudbuster. Very easy to do. I'd imagine it'd be fine for lighter taller riders.

I think Dahon must have bought the design.
The Smartcog Bipod Mint is a 14" bike with 3 speeds and has been out since 2008, maybe earlier.
http://www.smartcog.co.jp/Products/mint-spec.htm
Seems as though you can get one in Japan for ~$850 at today's exchange rate.
http://www.loro.co.jp/item/fold_mini...ipod_mint.html

I really like the quick fold on these bikes because I'm lazy.
I'm just not loving the price.

I largely agree. That is, quite often I wouldn't lower the seat post while using a folding bike on Metro. I was simply trying to make folding times more consistent.

From the videos, the Jifo looks really convenient.

$400+ is a meaningful jump from a $900 retail price of the Jifo, IMO.

http://www.nycewheels.com/all-models...ding-bike.html

Great pic of the cat. I have fond memories of a rescued Maine Coon during graduate school.

Originally Posted by chucky http://www.bikeforums.net/images/but...post-right.png
I'm not entirely sure that you do really need to lower the saddle separately like you do with the Brompton because the Jifo's seat tube is telescoping and the bottom portion is linked with the rest of the folding mechanism...it might depend on how you achieve the initial fit adjustment. However I agree that this is a major flaw for most folders, including the Brompton (only ones I can think of that don't have this issue are the tikit and carry-me).

Diblasi is another exception.

How true of the different levels of pricing between Dahons & Bromptons. I-plus others too as well-would be willing to pay the extra amount as I tend to keep bikes for the very least a decade. My Brompton has doubled in price from the 700 dollars I paid for it back in 2005 to a whopping 1,400 dollars now. I go more for durability and dependability than flashy model upgrades.

Hellion the cat pictured is also a rescue I adopted last year. I hope to keep her with me all her (I hope) long life.

yes ...Brompton's price has been going up around $100 every year here in the states probably because of the falling dollar which keeps losing its value ..I have a friend who keeps telling me that she's going to buy a brompton soon for the last couple of years and haven't done so and every year I remind her the price have gone up another $100. Yes a Brompton is an investment !! with a good return.

I doubt if dahon will ever have a brompton killer. the last 25+ years they've been making bikes they keep coming up with new model in the name of progress but what it is is that they haven't really figured out yet a design for a reliable folding bike like brompton which has only one[1] model type that has been proven since its inception. sure dahon outsells bromptons by the millions but someones has make cheap bikes for the masses and its dahon and i'm glad they're there to fulfill the need.

This jifo16 looks like an extension of their china domestic line, here is a bike that seems similar that was available several years ago.

Dahon Dove 14

With the extended seatpost from Dahon this allows for somewhere around 800mm extension from BB/top seat, normally enough for 190cm person.

Weight is similar, folded size similar.

Same narrow hubs front/rear, single speed.

New price in china (2 year warranty) : ~US$250.

Youtube of same,

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ycVt8Jrog68

Brompton bikes are not cheap, certainly, and they are lower speced than most rivals at their price level.
Its unfair to imply that Dahon bikes are unreliable. They sell an alot of bikes that are reliable and work in their niche well. They are not just cheap bikes for the masses, they also have made many very desirable expensive folders that many people would like to own. speedtt, jetsream........etc

I feel the main area of comparison where Dahon badly falls down is the interchangeability of parts and asseccories between models. Where Brompton do really well with the retro upgrade stuff, buts its easier if you only make one bike type.

There's certainly scope for a much improved Brompton equivalent, the idea that you need titanium parts to offset the weight of cheap hi-ten steel and pay £1400 is totally ridiculous and there's a big gap in the market for something cheaper, lighter, and with proper consideration paid to stiffening the frame in strategic places. I think at some stage a big bicycle company will step in.

Dahon are in a curious position since Tern seem to have positioned themselves as doing what Dahon do but better. Perhaps Dahon will bring out more models that deviate from the standard fold-in-half design.

I am not going to mention Mezzo, oh too late.....................

(I might get a Brompton next week. Might be seduced by second hand offering locally, he will need to price cheap enough for my tastes !), Diblasi is a great design IMO, love to see someone take that further at a reasonable cost.

Any chance of a more compact "If mode" ?
that would be interesting.

A Big Bicycle Company will step in and do what - give Brompton a slap on the wrist and tell them to behave ?

tcs : "Andrew Ritchey has said the Brompton factory can produce 40,000 bikes a year."

Well for all their faults they make 40,000 and sell them all at list price, Tern on the other hand, introduced to the UK market 2-3 months back, is already being discounted on the shop floor in London.

The Brompton price tag is largely dependent on the unique fold, that market position allows them to skimp on other areas. The price has gotten so high & the design isn't protected by patents so there's room for direct competitors who can produce potentially a better product at a lower cost. Then Brompton would have the option, for starters, of not charging £30 for the cheapest handlebar it's possible to make, and not putting a £20 price tag on a bottom bracket that elsewhere retails for half that, so as to become more competitive.

Mezzo's look very nice but the fold doesn't allow for the functional versatility that the Brompton has due largely to the luggage system.