folder fanatic

It hit me today that I am now 2 years Dahon free. My former Dahons-2003 Boardwalk & 2006 Piccolo purchased new-have long been sold and donated off. Thereby completely disappeared into the muck of two different people’s ownership with the added bonus of no longer mine to fret about with the known destinations of each bike being separated by thousands of miles/kilometers from my present location. Thus freeing me from the off-chance of ever seeing those 2 bikes ever again. I probably not even remembered the date except for a routine cleansing of my hard drive and stored photographs of these bikes there (see below for some memory lane photographs-even the bag on the Piccolo was sold with that particular bike!).

Looking at the "old" photographs of these once cherished bikes, I am reminded of the tarnished and potholed road of being taken by these bikes. I am not saying these were “bad” bikes or anything like that. I am saying that they were not what I was used to in bicycles-generally basic quality & reliability. I realise that most importantly it was simply time itself and different business practices separated me from my mid-century 1960s/1970s bikes expectations. The Boardwalk was my first bike purchase since I bought my Dutch made touring bike way back in the early 1970s-i.e. roughly about a 30 year gap. In those days, your local bike shop was truly a local bike shop. Not a masquerade of one hidden virtually online, big box bicycle retailer, or small potatoes someone who is about to go out of business next week or perpetually teetering on the brink of insolvency. Plus products-not just bikes-were made to last and repair when needed.

Dahon as it used to be back in 2003 when I came onboard, has changed a great deal. Each year is a totally new nightmare of “1 year and you’re out” of addressing an individual bikes or a whole model series problems or even repairing one. Then the infamous legal infighting between the Dahon Corporation & the new Tern Bicycles plus the family behind it-now separated over a year. It appears to remain separate going in different directions irreconcilably probably forever. Plus the present downturn of the never really improving economy has made not only myself, but apparently others, more cautious about new purchases. The local Craigslist has become my new best friend when it comes to a needed purchase, bike or not.

It is funny how things have come full circle. I was criticzed about my unhappiness with my former bikes on this very forum. Now a <gasp!> Brompton quasi-imitation by Dahon itself has unfolded for all the world to see-& even buy?-as this recent thread announced. See:
Dahon Curl (brompton clone) released

My sentiments exactly. Long term support & ownership. Not questionable-so-good-imitators or drama queen legal in-house fighting. Just like my old Dutch bike which was lost when the garage roof caved in on it-and the ones I now have at present-2005 Brompton C3E, 1972 Raleigh Twenty, early 1970s Ralleye Jetstar-which have replaced my lost bike. The simple key to what I wanted in the first place! The real product-not an imitation.

chagzuki

I'm sure the Curl doesn't require drilling out some loctited bolts and reaming plain bearing bushes in place when the rear frame needs servicing, something that bike shops charge £50 for. They've probably designed the hinge properly with proper bearings that you can just pop out if they need replacing, only they probably won't need replacing as they wont be plain bearings that have a short lifespan. British engineering eh?

folder fanatic

I freely admit that I am not very good at mechanical things. But I have something that is precious in of itself-the distancing of time itself. I don't know how others will take to the new Curl-or any other sort of Brompton tuck up folding type bikes. I do now know now the passage of time when it comes to something that works out vs. something that cannot do so. Much like human relationships.

jur

I missed you very.

mulleady

Not all Dahons are that bad. And I've seen the Terns at an LBS and they have lovely frames.

You're a bit harsh on the LBS that have suffered from economic hardship and some of the online ones increase the competition, variety of choice and offer improved value for money. Some like my LBS Fudge Cycles do do both as does Brakemeister. Downtube have sold online for years and it was my first affordable folding bike and pretty decent for what it was!

Azreal911

I wouldn't lump the two together, the dahon hinges and the tern hinges are very different when i saw them at the LBS. Also their support levels are very different too with tern only wanting to modify the models up after at least three years and they keep major parts similar between models to help with their long term support. Josh has a good plan ahead, which is why he wanted to implement them and the only way to do it was to go out on his own.

mulleady

I totally agree +1

I assume you meant the op shouldn't lump them together.

brakemeister

enjoy your 50 lbs raleigh and your Brommy which obviously has absolutely no propriety parts on it....... great brakes, superlight, and and and ........ comparable to the Raleigh it actually is light ....

After 2 years this Dahon stuff still comes up, the behind the scenes poltics which mean absolutely nothing to the consumer, except a little more competition ( which Is a good thing ) and and and

thor

HGR3inOK

Having owned an F-frame Moulton for 40 years, I guess I might be dissatisfied with an imitation like the Raleigh 20. However, the Mazda Miata that I owned was much better for my purposes than the original Lotus Elan that inspired it.

-HANK RYAN-
Norman, Oklahoma USA

wahoonc

None of my Raleighs weigh 50# and I am still trying to find brake pads from my 1984 Dahon Classic III I can buy parts to fix a 50 year old Raleigh but can't find the canted brake pads for a 28 year old Dahon...

Aaron

Azreal911

ahhh my bad I was reading your sentence and my mind lumped them together. This was my undoing!

mulleady

I'll forgive you just this once lol! Higher end Dahons are much closer to Terns. I've no doubt my Dahon Jetstream EX was conceived by Josh Hon and not the old guard from Dahon. The hydroformed frames and hinge joints are consistently better on all the bikes I saw and that included Terns in the lower price range.

Foldable Two

Have never run into the couple who bought our 2005 Dahon Boardwalks, but grandson has been using my 2005 Boardwalk S1 as his main ride for the last year. We visited him this last Sunday at Univ of Oregon in Eugene where he is attending a 2-week Summer learning program. Kid were able to bring their bikes this year, and they go on several group rides. He has no problem keeping up with the faster riders.

We took our Fridays and went on a ride with him. Bottomline: My old S1 is still going strong.

(Attached pic was taken of him (and the S1) in front of house we owned 20-25 yrs ago when his mother and father were students at the U of O.)

Lou

folder fanatic

Me too. Where did I put my hankie?

I am not "lumping" anything together. I was simply cleaning out my hard drive's photographs and decided to take a few minutes from my busy life and reflect on where my limited bicycle dollar & sewing time for the various bags I sew for all of them was going in the past and will go in the present and into the future. I decided that if and when I need a bike (and anything else for that matter), I will check out the local Craigslist first before buying new. As for being a bit harsh, I am also a product of the "new" way of doing business. I have written more on this topic in other forums in the recent past and won't go into great detail here. The most important thing I have learned here on the Folding Bike Forum as well as the other ones is this: I don't have to put up with shoddy or questionable practices bike or any other shops anymore. I don't go to even one very often as it is. I live near plenty of them and can select another one if one proves to be less than what a good business (not just bike shops) should be-or go out of business like one did just a few months ago after almost 50 years of business. I have exercise the option to move on & it feels great not having to be a "nice girl" all the time-without getting upset or violating any laws. As for folding/separating bikes, I have as many as I need right now. I can go for years without getting into too much hassle with bicycles-or bike shops-now as it was with my old Dutch bike. That bike-and others hailing from that time period-was very easy to take care and maintain all by myself.

https://www.bikeforums.net/showthread...ght=Bike+shops

Last, but certainly not least of all, my Open Letter To My Now Former Bike Shop:
https://www.bikeforums.net/showthread...ght=Bike+shops

My-very heavy compared to present bicycle-old Dutch touring bike has been replaced 3 times over. I don't need to go into additional great expense for bicycles-new or used-now or in the foreseeable future. I simply wanted a certain type of bike that is not generally made anymore, most anywhere except at a very high price. Unlike it was 40 odd years ago. As for the weight concerns, I don't have them as the all 3 present bikes are wheeled around with a nice luggage cart when folded or separated up. Or stored in a car trunk/boot. Just like the Dahons were when I owned them. As for Dahon/Tern, I have a feeling that many others might be putting off buying-or have strong reservations at the very least-from either company because of their tiffs. With older bikes, you don't have that concern as most companies that made them don't even exist anymore.

Or my dad's UK made Mini Cooper. I know people like to tell me I am missing out on the "improved" new BMW Mini Coopers that are all over the roads around here. I tried them and I can say for certain I like my father's zippy "real" little Mini. It is real and very reliable-just like my Brompton & Raleigh has proven to be.

My experience exactly.

I might have kept the Boardwalk S1. But I decided to strip all the good parts off it for the Raleigh when I was restoring it. When I finished stripping if, most of the parts were transfer to the Raleigh. The Boardwalk was literally "half a bike." It was not worth buying extra parts for a bike that I probably not have any use for or take up valuable space (I only have space for 3 bikes). So it had to go.

folder fanatic

I am glad I made a trip down "Memory Lane" as far as those 2 bikes go. It is very important to tack these photo virtually up especially when I buy a car as that is at least around $20,000 US dollars now-a far more major purchase than any bike. The only thing would surpass a car would be a house. Especially now as money is tight in my own household and community. I already seen one local-a few blocks from my house-bike shop go belly up, one downsized vastly from a huge shop with several employees into a 2 man operation, and the rest running scared. This is the world I find myself in and record with these photos to remind myself to be extra careful. Whatever the world becomes, I still elect to keep bikes always in my life as you can see from my many, many past posts over the years.

As for changes in the world of product manufacturing and the like, the best I could not find a bike example so here is something equally as needful of a good mechanic/shop:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ExSnX...eature=related
And why I turn to Craigslist now.

To be fair, there were other bikes I had to give up besides the Dahons. Here is one below I parted with-and still miss-when my sister moved in our now crowded home 4 years ago now.

mulleady

@folderfanatic

Most people won't care about the Dahon tiff and Tern is now a separate company. I think it will live or die by the quality of its bikes & how Josh runs the business not by some family history known to s small minority. Why be so judgemental? I think you will find Tern is here to stay.

You also make the majority of bike shops sound quite nasty. As with all **** sapien sapiens, it's a numbers game but Im glad I have a choice of bike shops and I'm glad there is online competition as it improves prices & service.. Please stop grouping Dahon & Tern together and move on. As for Dahon they are part of folding bike history and made some lovely bikes and are not the worst. They just made too many models and Josh seems to be wise to this judging by the Tern range.

mulleady

Now now Thor God of Dahon thunder lol! Let's not get dragged into bike vs bike storms!!! FF has been a bit unfair and none of us agree on her views on this particular thread. As for the Brommie it is a great bike so let's leave that one out of it and older Raleighs are from another century now and classics at that.

Perhaps the Dahon God Thor was merely raising a storm against Ff's fleet lol?

Training.Wheels

Why even bash Dahon when you are no longer a customer? You seemed to have had no problems with your Boardwalk or Piccolo, and the Dahon/Tern separation didn't even affect you. You're criticizing the company based on stuff you've read, not personally experienced. Come on, now.

chagzuki

My 4 and a half year old Dahon Vitesse is still doing fine. The handlepost latch has worn a bit and will need replacing eventually but besides that it appears to be mechanically fine.
The Brompton rear frame hinge will need servicing in a year or so, that's a greater expense and greater PITA. I've applied boiled linseed oil (stand oil) to the inside of the rear frame tubes to inhibit rust; I've seen reports of it rusting through in an alarmingly short period of time.

brakemeister

You know that I love old restored moded to the gills Raleighs.... they are awesome and I have deep respect for folks who dont spare any expense and search low and high to get the bottom bracket redone, the bearings replaced.... and and and ...
Same as Brommies of course, they are nice without a doubt....just not my cup of tea.
Just this relentless Dahon /Tern bashing is getting old ...... one of this days I will ask the guys at Dahon what the real story is. Almost sounds like a disgruntled ex employee. Wouldnt surprise me.... very little does these days... lol

Best Thor

mulleady

No-one has a right to judge the family or the brands involved and some legal business is an every day occurrence in other areas of business, take Apple & Samsung for example. I don't like to see wasteful litigation but the Dahon/Tern was about natural dispute resolution. Therefore, the legal rift had a greater impact on the Hon family than anything else and a temporary disturbance for Dahon. They have fought their battle and now Dahon & Tern exist. Good luck to both of them in providing us with a variety of new bikes into the future. The natural laws of competition will now prevail and it can only be good for us as consumers.

zebede

This seems to becoming a reoccurring theme around here. Pooh Poohing other brands. The analogy of Dahons with frame less sewing machines was uncalled for, not fair and not true. My Dahon has a chrome moly frame (Speed TR).

I think most would agree that constructive criticism is encouraged and promoted here. it helps us all even it can be a little painful to receive at the moment.

We are more likely to have Bike Envy for your fancy bike if you don't act like a snob.

zebede

Marketing 101: When a company paints the competitor as negative, consumers start to see the brand the company is promoting as negative. In other words, it backfires.

folder fanatic

Remember I simply was cleaning out my hard drive and came across those old photos. Now I could get rid of (delete) them and that will be that. But occasionally, I am still asked about the bike shops around here (which has no bearings to most of you) offline with other local cyclists. Online, I still add pages to my old Website as the need (via Private Mail) indicates: Brompton Easy Wheels Substitute Ideas, so I keep anything I happen to document. Or read about online. Or physically pass by when out cycling-i.e. the Dahon HQ periodically. I document-even old news like Dahon/Tern-as I review where my precious money & time should or could be better spent. Except for 1 special bike that I am strongly considering to be purchased in the near future (see Am-star-dam), my bike needs have been met.

I was not looking for agreement. I was looking for change within others. Not there yet.

I am a custormer at times-just not with their bikes anymore-just accessories. I had plenty of problems with those bikes. Even in the middle of a bike ride, I had to stop & tighten something, or address an problem. Nevermind about locating the replacement latches. With the 3 present bikes I have, nothing for 2 years. And the replacement screws are easy to come by in the local hardware store.

Who says I'm not a customer? I don't buy the bikes anymore, but I do sometimes buy their bags-and perhaps other accessories-either for myself or gifts for present Dahon owners. I don't live in a vacuum or choose my friends because they have different bikes than I do.


Oh, so you don't like my old Raleigh is that then? Matters little as I like it fine and that is enough for me. I do admit I don't ride that bike or any other one like I used to. Here in Los Angeles, the infrastructure is set up for cars-even older ones hailing from the 60s & 70s. Bicycles are in the way except for some limited recreational use. But the sole reason for having them has not changed and except for the Am-star-dam bike, they must all be ready to fold or separate up and go into trunks or hidden in bags. Or else out they go too along with the former Dahons-Terns or anything else that takes up valuable space without nothing in return.

Remember Thor, I have been around for a quite number of years in a hostile-to-bicycles environment, Los Angeles. I saw many wonderful bike shops go away or even close shop because their owners retire like my Flying Dutchman bike shop did back in 1980 or so or change hands. So will you do too when the time comes & probably disappear from this forum forever, no matter the promises you make, wish to make, or others make for you here even now. Because that is a fact of life. The only constant in business relationships is change. Rewriting history or wishing it away does not make is so.

And I don't forget my hard won lessons from that same shop all those years ago. Even today, I still am attracted to the bikes I have now or will soon because of that wonderful Dutch immigrant family and doing business with them. And I kept photographs gathered all over the Internet to remind me of those exact same bikes. Their strong points and their weaknesses. I did not dare to load up my Boardwalk with groceries which I can do with ease with my Jetstar. It's rear rack is in reality, part of the frame itself and can carry far more heavier loads that I need to. Even my non-cycling mother did not want me to put too much on the Boardwalk. She thought it would bend from the weight!

I also have seen my community flooded by way too many bike shops right now. And there is much back stabbing and in fighting going on. I choose to remove myself and go farther out into Suburbia all things bikes until the dust settles. Anything else is suicide-or being careless.

folder fanatic

It is interesting that after 2 years, the forum has not chainged much. When a new member like Skunkwise comes on with needs, how does this forum handle such a delicate question? By verbal attacks & name calling?:

I will be keeping all the photographs I did over the years. As a reminder to myself not to be pulled in by anyone ever again. And requested by others if needed.

And each bike when I decide to use it must be useful like this one below-or out it goes like the Dahons.