Long-time rider, not yet a folder, but...
 

there are good reasons to change that. After years of roadie life, now I mainly commute (20 miles 1-way, carry stuff in a messenger bag) but still do up to 100 with friends on occasion. I’ve been interested in fast riding folders for years but have never pulled the trigger, now I’m in a lower budget range.

In short I’d love to find a very fast rider, under $2000 if I have to go new. Doesn’t need to fold quickly or be super compact. Wide gearing not needed. But does need to fold and carry speed.

The Pocket Rocket is too pricey, but the Dahon Dash X-20 speaks to me and I could overshoot for the cost ($1800?). But Dahon is so screwy, can’t even find an X-20. If I could just find something with the Dash frameset and the fast wheels I could set-up a nice drive train.

I know you experienced guys have good reasons for riding the brands and types you have. Anyway, it would be cool to pull the trigger, just haven’t found it yet. (and I’m in Utah, would love to try some but no folding bike retail shops.) Let me know if I’m missing anything obvious. Thanks.

Pacific reach, Birdie with drops,Bike friday,speed tt, carbon fibre dropped bar 20" mezzo (Supra)http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.d...m=251192943120 £3k though

a bike friday is what you describe. at your price point you could buy a very nice used BF and trick it out to suit your needs precisely.

example: http://eugene.craigslist.org/bik/3411447387.html

also:
made in oregon.
excellent customer service (even if you are buying it used).
easily upgradeable

dahon doesnt offer any of those.

BF's Tikit is their Folding Line , there are iso 349 Schwalbe Kojacks for the need for speed
if you go in for the season Tikit, the dropout design allows for an IGH or a Fixie..
unified rear , includes BB..

+ the dropout can be swapped out , to have a Derailleur hanger , and Etc.

they also make a welded on steel dropout rear portion, but those are not changeable.

Shimano Caprio is their small wheel cassette. a 9-26t .
but the hub accepts just that cassette and Visa versa

+1. I was just about to mention this. Not cheap (~300 for built wheel and cassette), But a 20" wheel with a 9T cog is equivalent to a 26.6" wheel (which doesn't exist) with a 12T cog.

Thanks for those suggestions. Wow am I behind the curve, I'm dazzled (confused) by the choices. Those suspensions look smooth, maybe even not too energy sapping. Will rigid models ride acceptably too? I'm not hearing much dahon encouragement. Reasons for that?

Swift, Airnimal, Moulton ..............................

If you want speed, here's a Bike Friday blog that might interest you...

have you checked the Tern folders?
http://www.thorusa.com/tern/tern.htm

The son from dahon started this company.

I went on a quest similar to yours after I discovered folders about 7 years ago. Ended up going through about 25 folders looking for something that could simulate my 17lb carbon road bike. The closest that I found was the Bike Friday Pocket Rocket and the Moulton TSR. I also used a Dahon SmoothHound as a roadie substitute for a long time, but it's not a folding bike. Each of these bikes are still heavier than my fast road bike.

The small wheels spin up faster, but don't hold speed as well. I think the small wheels are advantageous for climbing. I also think drafting is better with small wheels as you can get closer to the bike in front. I concluded that folding bikes will never replace a high-end road bike, but they certainly will give you a great ride and workout if you need the convenience of folding for transportablity or storage.

I've switched to recumbent riding now and have sold off all my upright bikes except for the Mouton TSR (with Capreo hub) and a Brompton. That Moulton space frame is superior in ride quality, comfort and stiffness. For a century ride, it's the perfect (non-recumbent) bike. They're beautiful, too :)

http://i39.photobucket.com/albums/e1...h/coast2-2.jpg

Did I miss it or did nobody suggest Swift? http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread...ighlight=Swift

You hear nothing about Dahon becouse they sense you want something a little different, not so many posting here ride high end Dahons. Being a strong rider you may want to stay away from the bikes with long seatposts and long adjustable (telescopic) stems, typical for Dahon. I like my Dahons but it is not the first bikes I would suggest for you.

Take a look at the Dahon smooth-hound and the two dash models. http://www.dahon.com/bikes/2011/smooth-hound

So as an addendum to someone that had mentioned Tern -- I think one of the other reasons why people haven't mentioned Dahon much is that where available, it has been superceded by Tern in a way. Tern wasn't just started by the son of the founder of Dahon, it was broken off of Dahon by the son (and mother/wife) in a complicated set of agreements that is now being litigated in California courts.

Long story short, it is my guess that Tern now has the rights to much of the newer frame designs and technology (the Dahon brand new 30th Anniversary bikes are being built on the older Mu frame as opposed to the newer hydroformed Tern Verge/Dahon Vector frame).


Anyway, I ride on the Tern Verge x10, and for a 1x10 bike, it is a fast and competent bike. If you want a greater gear range and a racing ride position, then I would recommend the Tern Verge x30, which MSRPs at the $2,000 limit you posted. Both bikes share the same brand new (came out last year) stiff, hydroformed frame.

Plus thor (thorusa) and nycewheels do sell and ship the Terns so there's that.

This post contains lots of interesting things that I did not know. Thanks!

http://www.thorusa.com/tern/vergex10.htm

I was just saying a x10 would be a cool choice .....

A Dahon Vector P8 is a bargain right now..... add a jetstream short one piede handlebar stem ( if you dare ) to make it much lower in the front and much stiffer.... maybe wait until I have some ultrafast 20 inch wheels available ... add a 2nd chainring .... and you would have a hydroformed frame for a low entry level price ... than start modding with change to spare ...
http://www.thorusa.com/dahon/current/vector8.htm

Just sayin ...:-)
thor

I've been into folding bikes since 2003 and, like S/Crunch, have gone through a few .. the fastest (which for me includes high speed stability over less than perfect roads), has been the Moulton (separates instead of folds), the Pacific Reach, and the Airnimal .. the Moulton and the Reach are the most compliant .. speed mostly depends on the engine, and comfortable fit with the ability to get into an efficient riding position.. tires make a noticeable difference at the extreme ends of the spectrum ..

http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x...s/DSC03342.jpg

http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x...fe20191eb7.jpg

http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x...e39f21ec_b.jpg

Get a second-hand Bike Friday. They are relatively easy to work on and modify.

My thoughts on a bike.

That's a nice read. Thanks for the post. :)

I could research these bikes all day, lots of interesting stuff, thanks for the ideas. A bit more detail on my ideal target would be: fast/rolf type wheelset; drop bars or maybe bulhorns; double chainring, mega-exo bb, 10 or 9 speed cassette, sram force or ultegra level.

There are a couple of nice bike fridays on craigslist. Amazon has some (2010?) hammerheads with the fast wheels for $1370 but only size medium, specs say those above 5'6" need size L (I'm 5'11").

Stupid question time: Would it hurt these bikes to bunny-hop the 2 or 3 obstacles that I hop over daily? (my roadbike = c-dale six-13 with rolf vigors)

I'm not sure if Rolf makes 20" rims? (Anyone know?) I do know that Velocity makes 20" V rims and Aerospoke also makes streamlined (although heavy) 20" wheels.

In my humble opinion, the occasional bunny-hop on folding / separable bikes is fine, as long as the bike in question has suspension (like most you are considering). However, many Terns and Dahons do not have suspension, therefore I believe a bunny hop would apply considerable stress to the folding hinge mechanism. (Again, just my opinion... not meant to be a slam on Dahon or Tern by any means.)

Oh yeah... I forgot to mention. You will likely find more info on fast 20" wheels in forums dedicated to recumbent bikes, as there are more "'bent riders" looking to go fast compared to "folder riders".

I know Bike Friday sells 20" Rolf Prima wheels from time to time. From memory, I think that Rolf is another Oregon company such that Bike Friday gets special wheels from time to time. But it's not my style.

If you're going with a "fast" bike with index shifting, then you should stick with a Capreo type hub/cassette. The default is 9 speeds but there are (expensive) 10-speed options out there.

Whether you can get away with bunny hops probably depends on the wheelset and the headset. If you're going with fancy wheels, then you'll have a better idea what they can handle. Although I will mention that for a given spoke count, 20" wheels are much stronger. Mine have withstood some extraordinary events -- a pedal strike that sent me up and to the side including a sideways skid -- that were fixed with a quick truing.

I'd be worried about the headset over a long period of time. The stem post is a giant lever and one would think that it would put a lot of stress on the headset. However, Bike Friday and Airnimal make MTB specific folding bikes. So I suspect that whether a folding bike can take repeated bunny hops depends on the make and build.

Not too clear why you need a folding bike, as this is often what steers the model. For those types of rides, it sounds like you have already what you need.

More important is deciding, when you need to fold, what type of riding you'll be doing. That determines how compact bike is, how fast you'll be going there, etc.

Holy crap, I didn't realize carbon fiber folders were made... does anyone have any experience or info on this Ori Supra? Not to thread-hijack, but that thing look like a work of beauty... I had previously considered getting a custom Swift with drops, but this might take the cake.

+1. I missed that!

Good point. For me, is a folder a solution looking for a problem? For family day trips or vacation road trips we don’t travel light, 5 kids, so originally I was thinking of a folder that I could just pack inside the minivan, stay low profile in a few ways. Maybe find a club ride wherever we happen to be, or ride along our route and get picked up. And they are cool so why not use it on my commute? Might be best to stick with my roadbike for my commute and either rack the van or down spec my folder requirements in case it doesn’t see that many miles.

Maybe I should do two things for now: 1- spend time lurking here, go thru old posts and other research; 2- watch for retail specials and used machines.
Thanks for all the input. I’ve learned that I have a lot to learn about folders.