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Keto?

Old 10-25-19, 11:37 AM
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Keto?

I finally gave in and tried keto, based on all the great things everyone has to say about it. But my grandmother is still dead, does this mean I'm eating the wrong kind of carbs? Or am I not crying hard enough when somebody has a bagel?
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Old 10-25-19, 11:38 AM
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Also, I tried to choke the neighbor's dog using the force this morning, like Darth Vader, but it didn't work. Really disappointed in this diet.
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Old 10-25-19, 11:49 AM
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Low carb I tried it had zero energy, couldn’t think straight, was a grumpy SOB. I was kayaking at the coast was dizzy and disoriented. I found the first Pizza Hut I could find I ate as many carbs I could. My life returned! I believe cutting out major food groups you lose too many nutrients. I can see these diets for people with medical conditions but for a healthy active person keto/low carb makes no sense. Cutting out butterfingers, twinkys and ding dongs I can see. But don’t take away my whole wheat bagel with ham and cheese.

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Old 10-25-19, 09:43 PM
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I went through it. There’s the initial stage where you’re like “omg I can eat as much bacon and cheese as I want??”, but after a while you need to get back to eating healthy. Fish, chicken, veggies, healthy fats. I certainly don’t do (enough) long rides, but as far as mental energy goes, I felt as sharp as a tack. If you’re doing it right, I can’t imagine you can’t translate that over to riding. With preparation and the right (keto) diet, the idea is that your body doesn’t need those carbs to reach the same stamina etc.

The idea that we’ve only been eating carbs (grains, etc) for the last 10% of our existence always resonated. But hey, who knows!
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Old 10-25-19, 11:20 PM
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We've probably only been eating large quantities of cereals for the last 10,000 years or so, but early humans would have eaten anything edible they could get their mouths on, and that would have included a lot of other carbs. Fruits and vegetables grow all over the world. Dental remains make it clear people in some Pacific islands suffered a lot of cavities from sugar in all the melons they ate. (People settled Australia 60,000 years ago.) Our ancestors were clearly eating fruits and berries, along with everything else they could, millions of years ago, before there were **** sapiens.

Isn't glucose the only fuel our brains can run on?
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Old 10-26-19, 12:58 AM
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I tried it in college. My vegetarian friends were horrified whenever we ate in the caf together.

I did lose some weight and the mental clarity was nice once my body adjusted, but it was too hard to stick to for this carb-lover.

Originally Posted by Seattle Forrest View Post
Isn't glucose the only fuel our brains can run on?
No.

Last edited by ThermionicScott; 10-26-19 at 01:02 AM.
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Old 10-26-19, 01:28 AM
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Originally Posted by ThermionicScott View Post
I tried it in college. My vegetarian friends were horrified whenever we ate in the caf together.

I did lose some weight and the mental clarity was nice once my body adjusted, but it was too hard to stick to for this carb-lover.



No.
Well you're two for two but unfortunately they're both wrong. First, if there's a change in mental clarity then you're likely consuming something that should have been left alone in the first place. And second. glucose IS brain food.

Now, are you taking this seriously SF or is this just one of your Foo (pseudo topic) discussion?
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Old 10-26-19, 08:20 AM
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I really couldn't even tell you what Keto is. I've seen people talking about it and I'm pretty sure it's another one of those fad diets.

Over the years I've learned what appears to be good for me and what isn't. I eat to feel good. Sure, a bag of chips and a coke might not be the perfect lunch... but when the feeling grabs me I go with it. It's not just diet, it's exercise, it's getting out and socializing, it's... doing what makes you feel good. Staying active and involved is half the battle.
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Old 10-26-19, 01:10 PM
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Originally Posted by KraneXL View Post
Well you're two for two but unfortunately they're both wrong. First, if there's a change in mental clarity then you're likely consuming something that should have been left alone in the first place. And second. glucose IS brain food.
Spoiling for a fight, are you?
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Old 10-26-19, 01:29 PM
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Originally Posted by TakingMyTime View Post
I really couldn't even tell you what Keto is. .
Not a what... a who

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Old 10-26-19, 01:29 PM
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Alcohol is brain food also known as Dumb Dumb Juice

Diet debates never have an ending there is a lot about humans we don’t fully understand.

Every town and neighborhood has the neighborhood butthead who’s house always gets egged by the kids

That is all I have to say
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Old 10-26-19, 03:29 PM
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There's nothing magical about the European diet. Americans are fat because we eat (fast food) too much, but mostly because we're lazy. Our automated lifestyles is the opposite of what humans need to stay strong and healthy. If we don't use our muscles they will atrophy. We love eating, but we hate to exercise.

Keto is a fad diet (low to no carbs) designed primarily for those that are extremely overweight or obese to lose a lot of weight quickly and get a jump-start of their weight loss. It is a temporary diet and should not be used long-term.
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Old 10-26-19, 04:14 PM
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Originally Posted by mtb_addict View Post
i cant recall seeing any fat people over there.
they say French people dont have heart disease but they eat alot of fatty foods.
Instead of inhaling a fast food burger in two minutes, the french take the time to enjoy GOOD food. By learning to enjoy fresh, seasonal foods in small portions and drinking lots of water by example, french children establish mindful eating habits early on. My eating habits are far from typical american ones and i’m much healthier because of it. I do enjoy the fresh produce from our many year round farmer markets and still drink french mineral water or a glass of wine with every meal. That along with good exercise means i have no need for fad diets......
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Old 10-27-19, 09:22 PM
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Keto is nothing new. Just a new name and a little less pseudo-science attached to a practice that dates back at least a century. We were doing it in the 1970s training for amateur boxing.

Ketosis is so extreme and uncomfortable for most folks it's a recipe for failure, like any regimented diet. Been there, done that, along with almost every boxer, wrestler and martial artist struggling to make weight. Same with competitive cyclists.

Ever wonder why so many retired pro and serious amateur athletes pack on the pounds and look like "normal" folks after they retire? It's damned difficult to maintain a keto diet. Especially for working stiffs who have little time to fuss over diet. On the plus side it's easier nowadays to maintain those niche diets. Decades ago you had fewer choices, and "weight loss" diets were based on bad science skewed by researchers with an agenda funded by special interest groups like agribusiness lobbyists.

In optimal condition in my teens and 20s I boxed at lightweight to welterweight, around 135-147 lbs. Now at age 62 I weigh 150 lbs. I have a little belly pudge, not enough to worry about.

After my neck and back were broken in 2001 (my compact car was t-boned at highway speed by a full size SUV that ran a light), I could do little more than walk with a cane -- slowly and not very far. I got up to 205 lbs, which shocked me. I gain weight so evenly distributed it wasn't obvious. No big pot belly. Just bigger overall.

I reviewed my eating habits and knew I needed to cut back on the sugar and beer. That's all. No special diet, no big sacrifices. I quit buying ready made bakery stuff. I bought baking ingredient. If I wanted cookies, muffins, etc., I'd bake them myself. That alone cut way back on the sugar intake. I stopped using sugar in iced tea. I use a little in coffee but less than I used to eat. I cut way back on the beer.

That alone cut my weight from 205 to 175, which I maintained for years. I was still walking with a cane until 2014, although I'd managed to get up to 5 miles or so a day some days. But walking really doesn't burn calories.

In 2015 I resumed cycling. It was a long, slow, sometimes painful slog, but my weight dropped to 150 by 2018. I've kept it there using the same approach: less sugar, less beer.

Other than that I eat whatever I want and eat until I'm satiated. Right now I'm eating pizza, and it's after 10 pm. And I'm drinking a beer, my first in two weeks. But I rode 33 pretty hard miles this morning, ate very little all day. My usual habit is to eat one meal a day and eat as much as I want of almost anything I want. But I usually go another 8-12 hours before eating again. I don't consciously do intermittent fasting, it just happens to work out that way.

Some folks, especially family, who've observed my eating habits ask how I can eat so little and so seldom. But from the time I was a teenager and amateur boxer I learned the difference between mild hunger pangs and actual signals that we need to refuel. Drinking plenty of water or favorite fluids (other than soda and beer) helps control hunger. The stomach just likes feeling pleasantly full. Water and low-calorie, low sugar snacks can do that just fine.

And as the body adapts to burning fat it also tends to control hunger. But that doesn't work for everyone. Appetites, cravings, etc., are inextricably linked to our emotions. It's not practical or practicable to expect people to consistently practice keto or extreme diets without regard to their stress, anxiety, sleep patterns, etc. Our metabolism, ghrelin, leptin, cortisol and other body chemicals can thwart our best intentions if we aren't handling stress well. Which just leads to more stress and anxiety.

For many folks comfort food is a substitute for self medicating with booze and dope. Many people could do a lot worse than put on a few pounds from overeating sugar and junk carbs. Many of the overweight folks I know are otherwise well adjusted, decent, hard-working people. They're way ahead of the game compared with the alcoholics and junkies I've known who indulge in self-destructive stuff to cope with their stress, anxiety and pain.

Some folks I know controlled their obesity by eating a lot more meat, including fatty meat. They found it satiated their appetites and cut the cravings for sugar and junk carbs. Some of them occasionally eat nothing but meat. I'd find that boring, so I eat salads a few times a week, bananas and oatmeal most days -- as much for the fiber and GI comfort as anything else. But I'd agree that meat, including fatty beef, is so satisfying that it'll curb my appetite for 12 hours or longer so I'm less likely to snack around or crave sugar.

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Old 10-27-19, 09:51 PM
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Originally Posted by mtb_addict View Post
Ketogenic is just a fancy, sciency name for Atkins diet.
For what it's worth, ketosis is a biological process, sort of like a starvation response. The keto diet is meant to put people into ketosis. You can pee on special sticks to know if your body is in this state. It's actually helpful for people with type 2 diabetes and epilepsy.

It's also a religion whose practitioners score extra ketones for converting the unfaithful.

If you've ever wanted to flavor your coffee with butter, keto might be for you.
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Old 10-27-19, 10:11 PM
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Originally Posted by KraneXL View Post
Now, are you taking this seriously SF or is this just one of your Foo (pseudo topic) discussion?
Not even a little. 🙂

I hoped the OP would make a few people laugh.

I don't think eating so much fat is healthy over the long term, and you can't get anaerobic exercise without carbs. Which is the high intensity fun stuff that gives people "runner's high" or follows a good bike ride with pleasant endorphins.

I might make a smoothie for dessert from raspberries and a little bit of milk.
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Old 10-27-19, 11:40 PM
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Originally Posted by KraneXL View Post
There's nothing magical about the European diet. Americans are fat because we eat (fast food) too much, but mostly because we're lazy. Our automated lifestyles is the opposite of what humans need to stay strong and healthy. If we don't use our muscles they will atrophy. We love eating, but we hate to exercise.

Keto is a fad diet (low to no carbs) designed primarily for those that are extremely overweight or obese to lose a lot of weight quickly and get a jump-start of their weight loss. It is a temporary diet and should not be used long-term.
I agree! We are fat and especially because we are LAZY!! Krane XL has nailed it! Automations in all phases of basic life has made humans FAT! That is all I have to say except all of you are FAT!!!
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Old 10-27-19, 11:45 PM
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BTW I use my remote on my Directv so I don’t have to get off the couch
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Old 10-27-19, 11:46 PM
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An older guy I worked with told me about the old days of having to walk across the building to the file room and back, several times a day, before we had connected databases and could get the same info without leaving our chairs. When you watch TV shows from that era, the fat people look like today's average.
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Old 10-27-19, 11:51 PM
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Old 10-28-19, 04:08 AM
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Whenever I hear someone talking about Keto (or before that Atkins) I've heard them talk about cutting out fruits because of the sugar, and cutting out some vegetables that have carbs. But let's be serious - in the U.S. most people who are overweight aren't that way because they're overeating fruits and vegetables. In fact if you swapped out the processed foods, fast foods, store-prepped foods, mindless snacks for bananas and pears and carrots and peas, people would lose weight without going on any "named" diet at all.
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Old 10-28-19, 05:38 AM
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Originally Posted by Seattle Forrest View Post
For what it's worth, ketosis is a biological process, sort of like a starvation response. The keto diet is meant to put people into ketosis. You can pee on special sticks to know if your body is in this state. It's actually helpful for people with type 2 diabetes and epilepsy.

It's also a religion whose practitioners score extra ketones for converting the unfaithful.

If you've ever wanted to flavor your coffee with butter, keto might be for you.

"It is helpful"...needs massive doses of salt. Those studies are not confirmerd, and had high dropout rates. Of course, Atkins can make similar claims regarding certain neurological conditions:

https://sciencebasedmedicine.org/keto-diet/


Atkins ran its course...now the latest fad diet is Keto, it even has a sciencey name with pseudo-scientific implications. Even Atkins was only the latest in a long line of low-carb diets. Think of them as the non-round-chainrings of eating. Been around forever and keep getting re-invented and rebranded, because there's only anecdotal evidence they work.

Last edited by Marcus_Ti; 10-28-19 at 05:44 AM.
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Old 10-28-19, 06:12 AM
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Originally Posted by StupidlyBrave View Post
Not a what... a who

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Old 10-28-19, 07:42 PM
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Originally Posted by billyymc View Post
...But let's be serious - in the U.S. most people who are overweight aren't that way because they're overeating fruits and vegetables. In fact if you swapped out the processed foods, fast foods, store-prepped foods, mindless snacks for bananas and pears and carrots and peas, people would lose weight without going on any "named" diet at all.
Oh, it happens. Modern fruits and many vegetables have been genetically modified for higher sugar content. It's no different from eating candy. The body doesn't know or care whether it's sucrose, glucose, fructose, etc. It's all sugar. Unless we're elite level athletes using it carefully as fuel, it all turns to fat.

Years ago when my second wife was pregnant she decided to eat "healthy". That included lots of fruit and fruit juice. No candy or sweets. She actually gained weight. I didn't say anything but her OB doc did. He fussed at her for eating too much sugar, showing her a chart comparing the sugar content in fruit and juices with candy and desserts. Saved me from getting the stink-eye from her.

I've cut out most fruits and substituted more low-sugar veggies. I mostly eat bananas and occasionally grapes, which are very sugary. But I organize my consumption around bike rides and workouts to use 'em as fuel. And the bananas help with fiber. One problem with eating a mostly carnivore diet and little grain is not getting enough fiber. So I eat oatmeal most mornings. But I've cut way back on most grains, pasta, etc.
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Old 10-28-19, 09:25 PM
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Originally Posted by canklecat View Post
Oh, it happens. Modern fruits and many vegetables have been genetically modified for higher sugar content. It's no different from eating candy. The body doesn't know or care whether it's sucrose, glucose, fructose, etc. It's all sugar. Unless we're elite level athletes using it carefully as fuel, it all turns to fat.

Years ago when my second wife was pregnant she decided to eat "healthy". That included lots of fruit and fruit juice. No candy or sweets. She actually gained weight. I didn't say anything but her OB doc did. He fussed at her for eating too much sugar, showing her a chart comparing the sugar content in fruit and juices with candy and desserts. Saved me from getting the stink-eye from her.

I've cut out most fruits and substituted more low-sugar veggies. I mostly eat bananas and occasionally grapes, which are very sugary. But I organize my consumption around bike rides and workouts to use 'em as fuel. And the bananas help with fiber. One problem with eating a mostly carnivore diet and little grain is not getting enough fiber. So I eat oatmeal most mornings. But I've cut way back on most grains, pasta, etc.
Generally true, but not entirely scientifically accurate.Yes, it is all sugar. But there are some distinct differences in how each is processed and absorbed in the body.

For example, fructose is contained in fruit and since no one is going to eat a bag of apples or a bushel of bananas its not likely to get too much of it just from eating fruit. Of course there are ways around this such as dried fruit.

Table sugar (sucrose) on the other hand, is in drinks (and just about everything else) so its easy to OD on it. No chewing necessary. Fructose bought from the store might be a better choice if you consider that is almost twice as sweet as table sugar so you'll use less of it. Although its also a lot more expensive.

As mentioned, there is a way to circumvent any solution so none is perfect. In the end were right back to your initial claim if portions aren't kept within tolerance.

In the end, any advantage to one sugar choice can be voided if you just ignore all nutritional advice and do crazy stuff by consuming too much of any food. Its just easier to do that with sugar than anything else.
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