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moving to Holland?

Old 01-18-07, 04:24 PM
  #26  
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Originally Posted by botto
they ban smoking in public spaces, like italy, spain, ireland, scotland, in 2008.
Schipol is mostly non-smoking, but been there recently?
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Old 01-18-07, 05:40 PM
  #27  
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Originally Posted by AdrianB
It's not the south either. With respects to 'romantic' I mean the picture postcard stuff. Edam, Gouder, Zoest, Amsterdam etc.




So is my mother, but if she came over when she was young in the 1950s (about right for someone the OPs age) she probably was not proud of being a 'wog' unable to speak English in the extremely British 1950s Australia. If on the other hand she participates in the strong Dutch community in Australia it's entirely different than living in the Netherlands. It's not all rollmops and droop.




I agree with you - but compared to Australia it's not casual. Thongs (flip-flops), tanktops, shorts on Kalverstraat wouldn't be the usual attire of a respectable Dutchman - it would be the attire of American tourist.




Winter in Perth is 18oC and blue skies. It's in serious drought. Water restrictions have been in place since 2001. 10oC with wind and rain is 'bitterly cold' to a Perth-ite.


Don't get me wrong, I love Netherlands - it's a great place. It doesn't however suit all people. If you don't understand the importance of 'gezellig' and ensuring you're not 'aso' it may not be for you. What's would make someone 'asociaal' in Netherlands would be acceptable in many parts of Australia.

THanks everyone!

What is 'gezeling' and 'aso'
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Old 01-18-07, 05:43 PM
  #28  
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'Gezellig' is a Dutch word meaning everything that makes something nice and cosy to be. It doesn't really have a direct translation. When a room is comfortable, relaxing, happy and just plain nice to be in its 'gezillig'.

'Aso' is an abbreviation (the Dutch love them!) for antisociaal. The neighbour who tunes their V8 while revving the engine, the scrag with a cigarette dangling from her mouth, that play loud music or the ones who don't maintain their garden. They are asos. Think of them like 'bogans' or 'a**holes'
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Old 01-18-07, 05:53 PM
  #29  
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t' Is niet gemakkelijk om Nederlands to leeren praaten.
If you want to speak Dutch, just put a very hot potato in your mouth and try to talk . . .
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Old 01-19-07, 02:50 AM
  #30  
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Originally Posted by AdrianB
Don't get me wrong, I love Netherlands - it's a great place. It doesn't however suit all people. If you don't understand the importance of 'gezellig' and ensuring you're not 'aso' it may not be for you. What's would make someone 'asociaal' in Netherlands would be acceptable in many parts of Australia.
When I moved to Denmark, I heard a lot of the same 'warnings': The Danes are introverted, the Danes won't welcome you into their homes, you'll feel like an outsider. The only difference is that Danes use the word 'hyggeligt' as their 'untranslatable' word for comfort, cozy, closeness.

But in the end, like all Western states, Denmark has people of all types, from the people who won't make eye contact to the people who rev their cars at the stop lights. Maybe in different proportions than America, but they're all here nonetheless (many fewer Bible-thumpers, though).

Look, OP, you're going to stand out simply because you don't speak Dutch. No one will hold it against you, but, nevertheless others will notice it, and you'll notice it. Every time I go into a shop, I end up speaking English (I try Danish, but it's a very difficult language), and it's always a little embarassing. And I wear shorts on Strøget -- but who cares? It's probably better than trying to pull off what passes as 'fashion' in Copenhagen...

Anyway, the point is you're young, you have few encumberances (yes?). The Nederlands is not _that_ different that you can't get along. It's a long way away from Perth, but Europe is a terrific place.
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Old 01-19-07, 04:53 AM
  #31  
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Originally Posted by AdrianB
Schipol is mostly non-smoking, but been there recently?
schiphol? a week ago. why?

Originally Posted by AdrianB
I agree with you - but compared to Australia it's not casual. Thongs (flip-flops), tanktops, shorts on Kalverstraat wouldn't be the usual attire of a respectable Dutchman - it would be the attire of American tourist.
I realize that you're Australian, therefore very well balanced with a chip on each shoulder, but maybe you should take a look at yopur fellow comapatriots next time you're abroad. Not exactly the definitition of classy tourist either.

Last edited by botto; 01-19-07 at 10:12 AM.
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Old 01-21-07, 04:37 PM
  #32  
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Don't worry Botto - there's not much I like about Australians.
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Old 01-21-07, 05:43 PM
  #33  
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Maybe the OP will run into this guy:

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Old 01-22-07, 12:04 AM
  #34  
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thanks guys. Read the Contract. Very low offer in terms of money. Will negotiate but not holding my breath.

Flattering to have the option though.
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Old 05-28-07, 01:59 AM
  #35  
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I ran into this topic on the keyword utrecht (where i live).
Funny to see all you non-dutch people commenting on us

Loved the sentence: "The guys explained hypotheekrenteaftrek. Thanks!" Hypotheekrenteaftrek has a great scrabble word value

What are the outcomes? Did you accept the job? It's 4 months later now so OR you didn't do it OR you are talking Dutch like hell I guess


oh and low in terms of money is relative. It's related to the prices in a country I would say. In Scandanavia you have to earn more than in Holland to do the same etc etc.
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Old 05-28-07, 02:58 AM
  #36  
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Just how low is it?

It's difficult to compare that sort of thing. Even locally there's a difference. e.g. UK salaries are higher, but cost of living is higher.

Unless there is a stark difference in money situations and you have a genuine reason for not doing it, I would have to say that if you refused this offer you need a serious face punch.

The opportunity you have is amazing. The concerns you raise are not worth concerning yourself with (at least in terms of making this decision).

If you come out before the end of June, I'm here and would gladly offer a helping hand. Though it would appear this move isn't going to be happening too fast.

p.s. Zoetermeer is a depressing soulless gulag of a new town - living there will surely drive you to hate the country. Try Leiden, Den Haag, Delft, etc. Best if you have some distance to work. In cycling utopia you need to make sure you have some good distance to ride every day.
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Originally Posted by KrisPistofferson View Post
Did you just say "minarchist?" I'm going to start a 10-page vaginathon because only Libertarians can define Libertarianism. Also, you're mean.
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Old 05-28-07, 03:10 AM
  #37  
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And ferchrissakes if you're living here for more than a couple of years learn the language. I am embarassed when I meet fellow expats who have lived here for 10 years and don't speak a word of Dutch.

Grammatically it's easy. In reality it's difficult - only because everyone speaks English thus it's hard to "immerse" yourself without someone responding in English.

Oh, and there's good food and drink to be had just an hour South, in Belgium.
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Did you just say "minarchist?" I'm going to start a 10-page vaginathon because only Libertarians can define Libertarianism. Also, you're mean.
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Old 05-28-07, 03:47 AM
  #38  
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Reason for their bad Dutch is we all speak English pretty good here
They often don't have a strict reason to learn Dutch other than pure interest.

btw i found out the job was rejected, he isn't living in Holland.

(oh and nico: stark is strong in het engels )
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Old 05-28-07, 04:34 AM
  #39  
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Originally Posted by leunkstar
Reason for their bad Dutch is we all speak English pretty good here
They often don't have a strict reason to learn Dutch other than pure interest.

btw i found out the job was rejected, he isn't living in Holland.

(oh and nico: stark is strong in het engels )
Yes, I would be curious to know how bad the offer is.

yendor, since you've already given us numbers (of which to be envious - or are those Aussie dollars so that's like only 50 European rubles?), what are the differences in offers?

And what's the difference in job possibilities? I would encourage the Dutch job largely for the experience you would gain from the travel, culture, contacts, etc doors that it opens. If the salary is lower but the job is more interesting then it's a trickier decision.

lekker feestdag, leunkstar
(if strong is sterk, what's stark?)
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Originally Posted by KrisPistofferson View Post
Did you just say "minarchist?" I'm going to start a 10-page vaginathon because only Libertarians can define Libertarianism. Also, you're mean.

Last edited by Nicodemus; 05-28-07 at 05:01 AM.
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Old 05-28-07, 05:46 AM
  #40  
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stark = grimmig
stork = ooievaar

en lekker vrij ja vandaag
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