Go Back  Bike Forums > Bike Forums > Framebuilders
Reload this Page >

Help with brazing cable housing stops

Notices
Framebuilders Thinking about a custom frame? Lugged vs Fillet Brazed. Different Frame materials? Newvex or Pacenti Lugs? why get a custom Road, Mountain, or Track Frame? Got a question about framebuilding? Lets discuss framebuilding at it's finest.

Help with brazing cable housing stops

Old 03-04-21, 07:54 AM
  #1  
RichinSC1
Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jan 2021
Location: Charleston, SC
Posts: 46
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 26 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 12 Times in 5 Posts
Help with brazing cable housing stops

Specifically what type of flux and filler do I need for brazing aluminum cable housing stops to a Reynold 520 Cromoly frame?
Also I am modifying a rear derailleur hanger. I am adding a small bar to the hanger to keep it properly aligned. The hanger is aluminum. Should I also use aluminum for the bar or a different metal? Then what flux and filler for the hanger?

Thanks
RichinSC1 is offline  
Old 03-04-21, 08:09 AM
  #2  
guy153
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2019
Posts: 558
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 204 Post(s)
Liked 111 Times in 90 Posts
Originally Posted by RichinSC1 View Post
Specifically what type of flux and filler do I need for brazing aluminum cable housing stops to a Reynold 520 Cromoly frame?
Also I am modifying a rear derailleur hanger. I am adding a small bar to the hanger to keep it properly aligned. The hanger is aluminum. Should I also use aluminum for the bar or a different metal? Then what flux and filler for the hanger?

Thanks
I will be interested in the answer to your actual questions too But why not just use steel cable housing stops? They're very easy to braze onto a steel frame.
guy153 is offline  
Likes For guy153:
Old 03-04-21, 08:16 AM
  #3  
Nessism
Senior Member
 
Nessism's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Torrance, CA
Posts: 2,865

Bikes: Homebuilt steel

Mentioned: 7 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 191 Post(s)
Liked 44 Times in 39 Posts
Aluminum cable stop brazed to a steel frame? Didn't think this is possible.
Nessism is offline  
Old 03-04-21, 08:22 AM
  #4  
RichinSC1
Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jan 2021
Location: Charleston, SC
Posts: 46
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 26 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 12 Times in 5 Posts
Where can I get steel cable housing stops?
RichinSC1 is offline  
Old 03-04-21, 09:07 AM
  #5  
Cynikal
Team Beer
 
Cynikal's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Sacramento CA
Posts: 6,168

Bikes: Too Many

Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 66 Post(s)
Liked 61 Times in 44 Posts
Originally Posted by RichinSC1 View Post
Where can I get steel cable housing stops?
https://www.cycle-frames.com/
Cynikal is offline  
Old 03-04-21, 09:19 AM
  #6  
Nessism
Senior Member
 
Nessism's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Torrance, CA
Posts: 2,865

Bikes: Homebuilt steel

Mentioned: 7 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 191 Post(s)
Liked 44 Times in 39 Posts
Originally Posted by RichinSC1 View Post
Where can I get steel cable housing stops?
There is a pinned thread at the top of this forum that discusses frame building component suppliers. Lots of options.
Nessism is offline  
Old 03-04-21, 09:21 AM
  #7  
unterhausen
Randomhead
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Happy Valley, Pennsylvania
Posts: 21,157
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
Liked 1,048 Times in 765 Posts
There is a supplier sticky at the top of this forum.

I would consider bike fab supply or framebuildersupply
https://framebuildersupply.com/collections/braze-ons
unterhausen is offline  
Old 03-04-21, 09:36 AM
  #8  
Andrew R Stewart 
Senior Member
 
Andrew R Stewart's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Rochester, NY
Posts: 14,619

Bikes: Stewart S&S coupled sport tourer, Stewart Sunday light, Stewart Commuting, Stewart Touring, Co Motion Tandem, Stewart 3-Spd, Stewart Track, Fuji Finest, Raleigh Pro, Trek Cycle Cross, Mongoose tomac ATB, GT Bravado ATB, JCP Folder

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2807 Post(s)
Liked 1,018 Times in 725 Posts
I have a good stash of various braze on bits including cable stops in a few configurations. Feel free to PM me if I can help you out. Andy
__________________
AndrewRStewart
Andrew R Stewart is offline  
Old 03-04-21, 11:25 AM
  #9  
guy153
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2019
Posts: 558
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 204 Post(s)
Liked 111 Times in 90 Posts
Originally Posted by Nessism View Post
Aluminum cable stop brazed to a steel frame? Didn't think this is possible.
I think you can braze aluminium to steel using something something like an aluminium bronze rod.

You can even weld aluminium to steel but only by using high explosives. Probably not a good idea to attempt this in your garage.

https://www.sciencedirect.com/scienc...24013618302899
guy153 is offline  
Old 03-05-21, 10:36 AM
  #10  
cuevélo
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Maine
Posts: 190

Bikes: '20 Scott Addict RC 30, '13 Trek Soho Deluxe, '91 Greg Lemond Maillot Jaune, Mid '70s Cuevas

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 21 Post(s)
Liked 20 Times in 13 Posts
Originally Posted by guy153 View Post
I think you can braze aluminium to steel using something something like an aluminium bronze rod.
What alloy? The melting point of aluminum bronze alloys I'm seeing is considerably higher than the melting point of aluminum alloys.
cuevélo is offline  
Old 03-05-21, 12:05 PM
  #11  
guy153
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2019
Posts: 558
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 204 Post(s)
Liked 111 Times in 90 Posts
Originally Posted by cuevélo View Post
What alloy? The melting point of aluminum bronze alloys I'm seeing is considerably higher than the melting point of aluminum alloys.
Yes you're right... You could use aluminium as a filler metal to braze the brazing rods together.
guy153 is offline  
Old 03-05-21, 12:08 PM
  #12  
dabac
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 8,453
Mentioned: 45 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1000 Post(s)
Liked 196 Times in 147 Posts
There are a couple of products for aluminium soldering. These will usually wet on steel too.
dabac is offline  
Old 03-05-21, 02:00 PM
  #13  
unterhausen
Randomhead
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Happy Valley, Pennsylvania
Posts: 21,157
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
Liked 1,048 Times in 765 Posts
It makes no sense to do this with aluminum when steel parts are easily available. Joining dissimilar metals is always going to be an experiment best left to people that really need to do it.
unterhausen is offline  
Likes For unterhausen:
Old 03-05-21, 07:52 PM
  #14  
Andrew R Stewart 
Senior Member
 
Andrew R Stewart's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Rochester, NY
Posts: 14,619

Bikes: Stewart S&S coupled sport tourer, Stewart Sunday light, Stewart Commuting, Stewart Touring, Co Motion Tandem, Stewart 3-Spd, Stewart Track, Fuji Finest, Raleigh Pro, Trek Cycle Cross, Mongoose tomac ATB, GT Bravado ATB, JCP Folder

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2807 Post(s)
Liked 1,018 Times in 725 Posts
Originally Posted by unterhausen View Post
It makes no sense to do this with aluminum when steel parts are easily available. Joining dissimilar metals is always going to be an experiment best left to people that really need to do it.
And understand galvanic corrosion. Andy
__________________
AndrewRStewart
Andrew R Stewart is offline  
Old 03-06-21, 02:14 AM
  #15  
guy153
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2019
Posts: 558
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 204 Post(s)
Liked 111 Times in 90 Posts
Originally Posted by Andrew R Stewart View Post
And understand galvanic corrosion. Andy
Yes steel and aluminium resist all attempts to stick together when you want them to but are very good at it when you don't. The best way to attach the braze-ons might be to corrode them on
guy153 is offline  
Old 03-06-21, 05:14 AM
  #16  
dsaul
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: South Jersey
Posts: 1,864
Mentioned: 14 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 567 Post(s)
Liked 377 Times in 272 Posts
Just buy some steel braze ons and some 50 - 56% silver solder and the appropriate flux. I would stick with ordering the stops from Bikefabsupply or Framebuilders Supply, because NOVA will kill you on shipping for small parts.
dsaul is offline  
Old 03-06-21, 09:35 AM
  #17  
unterhausen
Randomhead
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Happy Valley, Pennsylvania
Posts: 21,157
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
Liked 1,048 Times in 765 Posts
Is that still true about Nova? In the past they would send a different way if you called, I did that once.
unterhausen is offline  
Old 03-06-21, 11:01 AM
  #18  
Cynikal
Team Beer
 
Cynikal's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Sacramento CA
Posts: 6,168

Bikes: Too Many

Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 66 Post(s)
Liked 61 Times in 44 Posts
Originally Posted by dsaul View Post
Just buy some steel braze ons and some 50 - 56% silver solder and the appropriate flux. I would stick with ordering the stops from Bikefabsupply or Framebuilders Supply, because NOVA will kill you on shipping for small parts.
With Nova under new ownership you may want to call them and see if that is still the case.
Cynikal is offline  
Old 03-06-21, 01:58 PM
  #19  
dsaul
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: South Jersey
Posts: 1,864
Mentioned: 14 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 567 Post(s)
Liked 377 Times in 272 Posts
Originally Posted by unterhausen View Post
Is that still true about Nova? In the past they would send a different way if you called, I did that once.
As a test, I put 10 cable stops in my cart and the shipping calculator shows $16.12 to ship to NJ. I don't know if they would put them in a padded mailer and send them USPS if you call, but I have an irrational aversion to calling places to ask about stuff like that. I know Andrew at Bikefabsupply will only charge me the actual cost of shipping and refund any difference from the online shipping calculator.
dsaul is offline  
Likes For dsaul:
Old 03-06-21, 03:34 PM
  #20  
unterhausen
Randomhead
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Happy Valley, Pennsylvania
Posts: 21,157
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
Liked 1,048 Times in 765 Posts
I don't like it either, but I think I did it before BFS and FS showed up. Henry James was the same way. Bad postage estimators.
Of course, now companies are a bit worried about using priority mail, but my experience with Paragon and priority mail has been good.
unterhausen is offline  
Old 03-10-21, 03:30 PM
  #21  
Bluegenes
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2021
Posts: 6
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 3 Times in 1 Post
Originally Posted by dsaul View Post
As a test, I put 10 cable stops in my cart and the shipping calculator shows $16.12 to ship to NJ. I don't know if they would put them in a padded mailer and send them USPS if you call, but I have an irrational aversion to calling places to ask about stuff like that. I know Andrew at Bikefabsupply will only charge me the actual cost of shipping and refund any difference from the online shipping calculator.
Andrew at Bicycle Fabrication Supply has partially refunded part of the shipping costs (to reflect the actual cost) on several of my orders. That sort of honesty is very refreshing.
Bluegenes is offline  
Old 03-10-21, 09:18 PM
  #22  
Andrew R Stewart 
Senior Member
 
Andrew R Stewart's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Rochester, NY
Posts: 14,619

Bikes: Stewart S&S coupled sport tourer, Stewart Sunday light, Stewart Commuting, Stewart Touring, Co Motion Tandem, Stewart 3-Spd, Stewart Track, Fuji Finest, Raleigh Pro, Trek Cycle Cross, Mongoose tomac ATB, GT Bravado ATB, JCP Folder

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2807 Post(s)
Liked 1,018 Times in 725 Posts
Originally Posted by Bluegenes View Post
Andrew at Bicycle Fabrication Supply has partially refunded part of the shipping costs (to reflect the actual cost) on several of my orders. That sort of honesty is very refreshing.
And what was the refund amount? Asking because I feel that some small amounts of doing business are not worth the efforts to save more on sometimes. Andy
__________________
AndrewRStewart
Andrew R Stewart is offline  
Old 03-10-21, 09:26 PM
  #23  
unterhausen
Randomhead
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Happy Valley, Pennsylvania
Posts: 21,157
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
Liked 1,048 Times in 765 Posts
You gotta pay someone to put the small order in a box and ship it, so I can understand why there is a floor at some companies. Don't really see it as dishonesty or honesty really
unterhausen is offline  
Old 03-11-21, 11:48 AM
  #24  
Bluegenes
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2021
Posts: 6
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 3 Times in 1 Post
Originally Posted by Andrew R Stewart View Post
And what was the refund amount? Asking because I feel that some small amounts of doing business are not worth the efforts to save more on sometimes. Andy
I don't recall the exact amounts. They were in the $5-10 range.
Bluegenes is offline  
Old 03-27-21, 11:37 AM
  #25  
preyj
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2020
Location: Wisconsin
Posts: 13
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 4 Times in 4 Posts
[QUOTE=guy153;21951987]I think you can braze aluminium to steel using something something like an aluminium bronze rod.

You can even weld aluminium to steel but only by using high explosives. Probably not a good idea to attempt this in your garage.

You can, but not for the home welder. You will need to use a bimetallic transition insert or coat the steel prior to welding / brazing.
preyj is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service - Do Not Sell My Personal Information -

Copyright © 2021 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.