Incomplete Brazing at ST&DT/BB, ST/Seatstays
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Incomplete Brazing at ST&DT/BB, ST/Seatstays
I have a Columbus SL track frame that I purchased a few years ago. I believe it was built in the late '70s by an amateur framebuilder.
After I received it, I did my usual thing at that time (which I probably wont do anymore) and treated the inside of the tubes with Corrosion X. I had a can of it from my father who has used it to treat tubes in light aircraft, so seemed like a reasonable thing to put inside of a bike frame. One feature of this product is that it wicks everywhere and creates a uniform film over time. A great thing, for sure in some circumstances, but after a bit of riding I started seeing it weeping out along some of the braze shorelines. My father never minded seeing it weep out at some locations on an airplane, because if it's still weeping out you know it's in there still doing it's job. A great thing in an old steel framed airplane.
In my case, however, that meant that the brazing was incomplete in several spots. It also didn't help that the frame is powdercoated white and it made an awfully ugly mess
So my actual question after my long-winded preamble is: would it be worth taking the frame to a local framebuilder to attempt to re-flow the joints, or is this a case of "the frame hasn't failed yet, so it's probably just fine"? The previous owner rode it extensively on the track and is of similar build as I am (and probably a lot stronger as well
).
My inclination is just to leave it alone, especially because if there is already some of this product inside the joints then it wont be a clean surface to accept new brazing material anyways. In that case I would try my best to soak the affected joints in acetone - the only solvent I've seen that has a chance of dissolving the Corrosion X - and then have the frame media blasted and refinished. There is obvious light surface rust underneath the powdercoat which was revealed from some light acetone application to try and clean things up so a refinish has always been my plan.
I appreciate in advance any advice.
Some pictures:

After I received it, I did my usual thing at that time (which I probably wont do anymore) and treated the inside of the tubes with Corrosion X. I had a can of it from my father who has used it to treat tubes in light aircraft, so seemed like a reasonable thing to put inside of a bike frame. One feature of this product is that it wicks everywhere and creates a uniform film over time. A great thing, for sure in some circumstances, but after a bit of riding I started seeing it weeping out along some of the braze shorelines. My father never minded seeing it weep out at some locations on an airplane, because if it's still weeping out you know it's in there still doing it's job. A great thing in an old steel framed airplane.
In my case, however, that meant that the brazing was incomplete in several spots. It also didn't help that the frame is powdercoated white and it made an awfully ugly mess

So my actual question after my long-winded preamble is: would it be worth taking the frame to a local framebuilder to attempt to re-flow the joints, or is this a case of "the frame hasn't failed yet, so it's probably just fine"? The previous owner rode it extensively on the track and is of similar build as I am (and probably a lot stronger as well

My inclination is just to leave it alone, especially because if there is already some of this product inside the joints then it wont be a clean surface to accept new brazing material anyways. In that case I would try my best to soak the affected joints in acetone - the only solvent I've seen that has a chance of dissolving the Corrosion X - and then have the frame media blasted and refinished. There is obvious light surface rust underneath the powdercoat which was revealed from some light acetone application to try and clean things up so a refinish has always been my plan.
I appreciate in advance any advice.
Some pictures:


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The "cracks" and rust are where I would expect to see them on a less then best paint job and with time and exposure. Are you sure the rust preventative stuff is leaking out? Andy
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I can see doing the "just ride it and see" program, but no way I'd invest in a new paint job. It'll just crack again. Unless there's sentimental value, that frame should be considered toast and retired rather than repainting. It's your money, but that's what I would do. Maybe rattle-can over the area or similar low-cost approach, but a real ($$) paint job will most likely result in unhappiness.
I'd definitely say trying to flow brazing filler in there would be a losing proposition, very low chance of success now with all that rust in there.
Mark B
I'd definitely say trying to flow brazing filler in there would be a losing proposition, very low chance of success now with all that rust in there.
Mark B
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I have come to the conclusion that seat stays with joint cracks like that need to be replaced or it's going to happen again. Especially if it was originally silver, which I'm guessing is true given the way that joint looks. If it was brass, then you could make an external fillet that would probably hold. The bb shell is too hard to tell because of the rust. It's probably cracked. I would say that frame is dead.
I think if you really wanted to save it, the first step would be to strip the frame and have it sandblasted. A minimum would be to have those areas sandblasted. I don't think that would cover over any cracking so you could assess the damage
I think if you really wanted to save it, the first step would be to strip the frame and have it sandblasted. A minimum would be to have those areas sandblasted. I don't think that would cover over any cracking so you could assess the damage
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I can see doing the "just ride it and see" program, but no way I'd invest in a new paint job. It'll just crack again. Unless there's sentimental value, that frame should be considered toast and retired rather than repainting. It's your money, but that's what I would do. Maybe rattle-can over the area or similar low-cost approach, but a real ($$) paint job will most likely result in unhappiness.
I'd definitely say trying to flow brazing filler in there would be a losing proposition, very low chance of success now with all that rust in there.
Mark B
I'd definitely say trying to flow brazing filler in there would be a losing proposition, very low chance of success now with all that rust in there.
Mark B
Although my affection for it certainly diminished when I realized I can't ride it on our closest velodrome - they have a 11" minimum BB height requirement and this is about a half inch too low

I have come to the conclusion that seat stays with joint cracks like that need to be replaced or it's going to happen again. Especially if it was originally silver, which I'm guessing is true given the way that joint looks. If it was brass, then you could make an external fillet that would probably hold. The bb shell is too hard to tell because of the rust. It's probably cracked. I would say that frame is dead.
I think if you really wanted to save it, the first step would be to strip the frame and have it sandblasted. A minimum would be to have those areas sandblasted. I don't think that would cover over any cracking so you could assess the damage
I think if you really wanted to save it, the first step would be to strip the frame and have it sandblasted. A minimum would be to have those areas sandblasted. I don't think that would cover over any cracking so you could assess the damage