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Soma Smoothie Stainless

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Soma Smoothie Stainless

Old 04-05-13, 08:17 AM
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David Tollefson
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Soma Smoothie Stainless

So I dropped by my moonlighting shop last night on the way home from my day job, and the owner (and my boss) handed me a brochure and said "this is what I want now". It had a Soma Smoothie frame on the front, stainless steel tubes... and brass fillets! So I'm wondering what the deal is -- I didn't think brass and stainless steel played well together. I mentioned it to the owner, who then said that maybe they do the initial join with silver, then filled with brass (a thermal impossibility, as far as I can surmise).

Any one with something to say about this? Howdaheck do they make that work? Some kind of slight-of-hand at work here?

Inquiring minds want to know (and maybe are a bit lazy to do the grunt-work)...
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Old 04-05-13, 08:41 AM
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calstar 
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Yep, thats what Soma says from here:

https://somafab.blogspot.com/2012/09/...from-soma.html

3. Triple Cross (Pictured - sort of): We are doing a limited run of a KVA stainless steel cyclo-cross frame. Disc only. It will be mirror polished, not painted as pictured. It will probably be fillet-brazed and not TIG'd.

How does that work?? Brian
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Old 04-05-13, 08:52 AM
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ksisler
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TIG'd first and then put whatever over it to make it pretty I would guess? The brass fillets could even be just cast or machined "bracelets" that get glued on after the fact. Why I have no idea. Only the shadow knows. Hopefully some poster will know what the secret sauce is...but I agree with yours that SS is not supposed to work with braze.

I have done fillets over tig on steel and lugs over tig on steel (using silver or brass). But I don't have the time nor patience to fool around with AL, CF, Ti, bamboo or SS. Never found the results worth the effort required.

I guess should ask if it is really SS tubes? One can polish up regular steel tubes to a nice finish and then clear coat them to look stainless... Just a thought.
/K
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Old 04-05-13, 09:45 AM
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Silver solder used for brazing is not silver, it looks quite a bit like brass and has a yellow/gold-ish color. There are special formulations of silver specifically used for fillet brazing stainless that are not this color and are closer to silver in color, but I've only seen high end builders use that. So, I can almost guarantee you that it's regular silver brazing material fillets. Probably also has TIG tacks.
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Old 04-05-13, 10:02 AM
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The Soma is made with nickel silver (aka nickel bronze, german silver). I don't think a price sensitive company like soma would use a fillet-capable silver like filletpro. Plus, you can see pits in some of the pictures, I don't think silver will do that. There are a couple of companies in Tiawan that do nickel silver fillet brazing. I have used quite a bit of nickel silver since that's what Trek used instead of bronze BITD. It wets out pretty nicely on stainless. I made some fixturing with it a while back and I was surprised how well it wets out.
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Old 04-05-13, 10:06 AM
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I know that nickel-silver (it's brass with less Zn and ~10 % Ni) bonds with stainless. But the colour is distinct. More yellow/gold than silver, but less so then brass. I've seen stainless filleted bikes (Colossi and a French Co.) with what really looks like brass. No idea what the filler is. As mentioned there are thicker silvers appropriate for filleting. So it's possible!

(edit: Unter beat me to it. Maybe the polishing accentuates the difference between SS and filler and makes it look more yellow)

Last edited by tuz; 04-05-13 at 10:27 AM.
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Old 04-05-13, 05:46 PM
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I have no doubt it's nickel silver. Even Ag will look pretty much like that on stainless. You can get brass to wet out on stainless, but I'm pretty sure nobody would do that. I was looking for an Anderson stainless nickel-silver fillet brazed, but I didn't see one right off the bat on his site
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Old 04-05-13, 05:58 PM
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All-state 11FC is the stuff I use and it sticks to many different metals, quite handy actually and it flows rather nice in my estimation.
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Old 04-05-13, 06:00 PM
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tuz
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I found some pics here. The colour looks different but they aren't polished. I use SS only for racks (non-polished) and that is how it looks.

Allstate 11 is Ni-Silver, but it seems they have a nicer formula. I should give it a try!

Last edited by tuz; 04-05-13 at 06:03 PM.
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Old 04-05-13, 06:23 PM
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I'm not sure that it contains any Ag or not since the package doesn't have a breakdown, it was pretty cheap too, 30$ for a lb at air-liquide.
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Old 04-05-13, 06:37 PM
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tuz
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Yeah it's one of those unfortunately named alloys. No silver content. It's a type of brass/bronze (RBCuZn-D), and rightfully called Nickel bronze elsewhere! (via Falanx in the UK)

Last edited by tuz; 04-05-13 at 07:04 PM.
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Old 04-05-13, 07:17 PM
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good find, Tuz. When that oxidizes a little, the brass color will come out more

I saw an earlier pic on the soma blog, and it really looked like nickel silver to me. It was on a post called something like "teaser"

If you look at this fillet pro thread, you'll see that silver looks yellow too.

Triple cross product page. I might be convinced that it's put together with fillet pro

Last edited by unterhausen; 04-05-13 at 07:29 PM.
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