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Brooks saddle for minimzing constant road crack jolts?

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Brooks saddle for minimzing constant road crack jolts?

Old 05-20-15, 08:57 AM
  #1  
FrankHudson
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Brooks saddle for minimzing constant road crack jolts?

Yes, I know riding position and core strength is one answer to this. I have no problem lifting my butt slightly for the occasional jolt. I do lack the core strength and upper body strength to truly ride light like I did in my youth however.

Some trails and streets around here have near constant cracks, miss-matched expansion joints, and other imperfections. For short rides, this is tolerable, but for longer rides my butt takes a beating from the constant hammering.

I'm a Clyde, 240 lbs. I already ride larger tires (42) on my REI Safari for more air volume. Helps, but I'm afraid to lower the air pressure much for fear of pinch flats, double so when I'm carrying stuff on my bike's rack (shopping trips).

I tried a cheap Nashbar suspension seat post on two my bikes. This post works very well on my winter bike (a more upright hybrid) and ice ridges and small winter potholes under snow add to the problem. The same seat post on my Safari seems to not "suspend" as well (different seat tube angle) and worse yet, can't hold my saddle at the correct angle consistently. I want to ditch this seat post on the Safari. The Safari is a touring bike, typical bars at seat height, longer wheelbase geometry, but not a upright cruiser.

My current saddle is a Selle SMP. No issue at all except for the jolts on the longer rides. On smooth pavement it's great.

I'm thinking of trying a Brooks. I had a sprung Brooks (B66? Flyer?) on a Raleigh Sports that I transferred over and used on my mountain bike many years ago when I was lighter. Even then that saddle gave me perineal numbness on longer rides. So one option might be a Brooks Flyer, but I wonder about the numbness issue returning. Then there's the Imperial, without the springs, but with a cutout. Is the leather enough to dampen the jolts? And finally there's the Cambium, including the new "carved" model with a cutout.

For those who've ridden the Imperial and the Cambium, any difference in rough road jolt relief?
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Old 05-20-15, 09:06 AM
  #2  
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The safari comes stock with 700 x 48c tires: Novara Safari Bike - 2015 - REI.com

You can go larger than a 42c.

I'd start with tires. A larger volume tire run at a bit lower pressure will make a difference in ride comfort. You need to experiment a bit to see what works for you but those are pretty stout wheels.


If you google around, you'll find quite a bit of info on bicycle tire pressure.
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Old 05-20-15, 09:29 AM
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I believe brooks make an "imperial" version of the flyer. The imperial seems to help with numbness issues, at least for me. I just ordered one of these and will have it today. Home | Cirrus Cycles | Bodyfloat | Suspension Seat Post | Body Isolation Seat Post. I went this way due to a lower back injury that could be made worse if I hit a ridge or pot hole. I will put it on my long distance bike along with a well broken in Brooks Imperial.

Perhaps I will lose some pedaling efficiency but I have to do everything I can to keep my lower back from re-injuring. I have severe narrowing of the nuero foraminal channels at L5/S1. I also have two herniated disks. I just had epidural injections two days ago. Feeling pretty good and will resume short rides in a week. I am keeping my fingers crossed. I also went with 32 mm tires with flexible sidewals. It is a choice of doing all of this or never riding again without successful surgery.

Last edited by RISKDR1; 05-20-15 at 09:37 AM. Reason: add
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Old 05-20-15, 10:50 AM
  #4  
imi
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Oh grief! I misread the thread title
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Old 05-20-15, 11:10 AM
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OP, tire pressure?
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Old 05-20-15, 11:16 AM
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The ones with springs


at 240 pounds you are already too heavy for the superior thudbuster seat posts their reccomendated rider weight tops out at 250.


of course there is also a certain amount of HTFU , just ride the bike I stop wanting it to feel like a couch.


when I see rough roads ahead I get off the saddle and let the whole bike be suspended by my knees..

Last edited by fietsbob; 05-20-15 at 11:21 AM.
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Old 05-20-15, 11:16 AM
  #7  
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Unless you go for a Brooks Flyer, I wouldn't expect much in the way of shock absorption.
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Old 05-20-15, 12:22 PM
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Originally Posted by Leebo View Post
OP, tire pressure?
55-62 psi rear. I try to make sure I'm near the top of that when I'm doing a shopping trip when I've to two panniers packed full.
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Old 05-20-15, 12:25 PM
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Try a bigger tire? I'm 235 lbs with a light load and run 55 front and about 60 psi rear. 700 x 35 tires. Could you fit a 2" tire?
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Old 05-20-15, 12:38 PM
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Originally Posted by fietsbob View Post


of course there is also a certain amount of HTFU , just ride the bike I stop wanting it to feel like a couch.


when I see rough roads ahead I get off the saddle and let the whole bike be suspended by my knees..
I'm off the saddle for sections of rough stuff too. The issue occurs more when it's not sections, but a few miles of rough stuff, with constant issues (like expansion joints every few yards) or constant heaves and cracks on some paved woods trails.

I'm currently more of a regular utility rider with longer rides once or twice a month. I'm now moving into retirement years, and I'm hoping to increase those longer rides in frequency and distance.

Sub 5 mile rides are no problem. As I'm getting more biking in and my ability to ride longer is coming back, I'm thinking of more and longer rides, and I don't want to limit the rides to well maintained roads or trails.
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Old 05-20-15, 12:43 PM
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Brooks Flyer Imperial it is! There is a good deal of shock absorption vs the B17.




Too bad the Brooks B190 wouldn't work, thats like sitting on an @ss hammock. Your butt thinks it's on vacation in Maui.
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Old 05-20-15, 01:36 PM
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Sprung Brooks have a separate wire spreader frame, rods between the nose and the rear , not far below the shaped leather ,

I've seen old sagging leather draping over those wires when let stretch and probably got wet then ridden ..

definitely wont be comfy then..
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Old 05-20-15, 02:00 PM
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Originally Posted by HauntedMyst View Post
Too bad the Brooks B190 wouldn't work, thats like sitting on an @ss hammock. Your butt thinks it's on vacation in Maui.
One of these ought to work with the B-190:



Breezer double-rail adapter for Brooks saddles and one-bolt seat posts
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Old 05-20-15, 03:39 PM
  #14  
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I find the Cambium C-17 carved to be quite comfortable over rough roads. I weigh 1/3rd less than you, though, and don't do grocery runs on my bike, so I don't know how it would feel for you. After initial break-in, either the Flyer or B-67 should do the job as well as any saddle on the market.
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Old 05-21-15, 07:25 AM
  #15  
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Originally Posted by Leebo View Post
Try a bigger tire? I'm 235 lbs with a light load and run 55 front and about 60 psi rear. 700 x 35 tires. Could you fit a 2" tire?
Thinking about that, but my current tires are as wide as my current fenders allow. Fenders are cheap though.
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Old 05-21-15, 07:28 AM
  #16  
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[QUOTE=HauntedMyst;17822790]Brooks Flyer Imperial it is! There is a good deal of shock absorption vs the B17.



QUOTE]

Hmmm. That might do the trick if I can find one to buy. Is it the same saddle size as the regular B17?
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Old 05-21-15, 07:33 AM
  #17  
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Originally Posted by fietsbob View Post
Sprung Brooks have a separate wire spreader frame, rods between the nose and the rear , not far below the shaped leather ,

I've seen old sagging leather draping over those wires when let stretch and probably got wet then ridden ..

definitely wont be comfy then..
Thanks!

That may have been the problem with the sprung non-cutout Brooks I rode 30 yeas ago. It was used when I bought it (on my still extant 51 Raleigh Sports) and it saw rain during my use of it (didn't know about rain/Brooks saddle issues back then).
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Old 05-21-15, 09:28 AM
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Thudbuster?
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Old 05-21-15, 10:07 AM
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[QUOTE=FrankHudson;17824679]
Originally Posted by HauntedMyst View Post
Brooks Flyer Imperial it is! There is a good deal of shock absorption vs the B17.



QUOTE]

Hmmm. That might do the trick if I can find one to buy. Is it the same saddle size as the regular B17?


Yes, it is the same top, just the spring base.
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Old 05-21-15, 10:10 AM
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Originally Posted by JohnDThompson View Post

It will but on a standard bike, the B190 is just too huge. It's best for a cruiser style bike or an Electra Townie
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Old 05-21-15, 01:45 PM
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Go tubeless and dial the psi down until you get comfortable. With tubeless you will get no pinch flats.


FYI - I have ridden over 1,500 miles on gravel this year tubeless at 40 psi with no problems and I am at your weight

FWIW - I have American Classic Hurricane wheels with non tubeless specific cyclocross tires at 35 mm (I use Orange Seal). I have also been told the max psi on non tubeless specifice tires is 40 psi. Not all wheels and tires will work for this application.

Rather than run non tubeless specific tires, I would get tubeless tires and go as low as you can



YMMV
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Old 05-21-15, 04:10 PM
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That was my thought too.

I have been riding 35-559 Kojak tube type slicks as tubeless at 60psi. (95psi rating). They feel very smooth and very fast.

What was your source for the 40 psi maximum? I couldn't find clear & comprehensive technical guidelines on maximum tubeless pressures though there is a lot of anecdotal advice.

The main technical reason I found for low maximum pressure recommendations when running tubeless was that with fat mountain bike tires (say 2" (50mm) and larger), the tipping forces on the tire when cornering could momentarily break the bead seal causing abrupt deflation when running without a tube.

It seemed to me with 35mm tires, this was most unlikely to be a problem for the following reasons:
  • The bead tension would be about half that of a 50mm tire as the tire cross section area is about 50%.
  • Due to the narrower width, the offset between the normal road contact point on corners and the centerline of the tire would be much less and the line of force would rarely if ever be outside the rim thus tipping should not be a factor.
  • If there is a lateral bump from hitting a rock, its tipping action on the tire would be less due to the smaller cross section dimension (35 vs 50)

I'm not sure if there is a problem that I've not identified, but it seems to me that the appropriate maximum pressure when running tubeless will vary quite a bit according to factors such as tire crossection, bead construction and shape, tire pressure rating, rim width, and rim profile.

Last edited by energyandair; 05-22-15 at 11:39 PM. Reason: clarifications
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Old 05-22-15, 02:57 PM
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Originally Posted by energyandair View Post
That was my thought too.

I have been riding 35-559 Kojak slicks tubeless at 60psi. (95psi rating). They feel very smooth and very fast.

What was your source for the 40 psi maximum? I couldn't find clear & comprehensive technical guidelines on maximum tubeless pressures though there is a lot of anecdotal advice.

The main technical reason I found for low ratings was that with fat mountain bike tires (say 2" (50mm) and larger), the tipping forces on the tire when cornering could momentarily break the bead seal causing abrupt deflation when running without a tube.

It seemed to me with 35mm tires, this was most unlikely to be a problem for the following reasons:
  • The bead tension would be about half that of a 50mm tire as the tire crossection is about 50%.
  • Due to the narrower width, the offset between the normal road contact point on corners and the centerline of the tire would be much less and the line of force would rarely if ever be outside the rim thus tipping should not be a factor.
  • If there is a lateral bump from hitting a rock, its tipping action on the tire would be less due to the smaller cross section (35/50)

I'm not sure if there is a problem that I've not identified, but it seems to me that the appropriate maximum pressure when running tubeless will vary quite a bit according to factors such as tire crossection, bead construction and shape, tire pressure rating, rim width, and rim profile.
I was referring to running non tubeless tires as tubeless

There are those around me who have much more experience than I with running non tubeless tires as tubeless. I am just telling you what they told me. I would suggest if you want a better explanation for 40psi post your questions on the Tubeless Solutions facebook page.
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Old 05-23-15, 10:01 AM
  #24  
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I agree with some of the posts, if road jars are bothering you then use aluminium cans...just kidding.

The least expensive thing to do is to go with the widest tire that will fit your rim and frame and thus you can lower your air pressure. See this PSI calculator using the second one, Bicycle tire pressure calculator

A spring loaded seat is one way but they're heavy you probably would be better off with a suspended seatpost attached to a regular Brooks or Selle Anatomica saddle which I now think may be better at least price wise, and use a TI seat rail for some vibration control. USE Vybe makes a really good suspension seatpost but is expensive, see: wiggle.com | USE Vybe Suspension Seatpost | Seat Posts
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Old 05-23-15, 10:25 AM
  #25  
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Enter the 4" wide tired 'Fat-Bike' ... https://beaconcycling.com/merchant/11...zoom/69444.jpg
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