This has been an interesting read. I'm thankful for whatever alternative transportation infrastructure we can get, and I try to be patient when sharing it with other users. I figure it's better to at least have folks out there moving around instead of home on the couch watching "Dancing with the Stars." That said, I guess I'm mellowing out in my old(er) age. I don't mean to be snarky, but "hating" multi-use paths seems to me to be the definition of a first-world problem. The grass is always greener, I guess; if you are lucky to live in an area that has lots of bike/ped infrastructure, I can see starting to compare your choices.

MUPs are a mixed bag. Here in NOLA, if it weren't for MUPs, I wouldn't be able to get in a good spin. The main ones which are paths along the levees are pretty good. There are just certain spots on them that get a little congested. We have one path that is a 2 mile loop around Audubon Park, and it is just ridiculous. I only go there when I want to marvel at rampant obliviousness. It can be funny and frightening at the same time. It's very clearly marked with 2/3 of it marked for peds and 1/3 of it marked for bicyclists. Even with that, it gets buck stupid.

A lot of people like to bad mouth California but it seems to me people here are more considerate (MUPs, on the road, on the street) than just about anywhere I've been.

Straw Man (n): A common form of argument and is an informal fallacy based on giving a false or exaggerated argument and then refuting or defeating that false argument ...

Yawn.

MUPs serve a limited purpose. Under the right conditions, riding them can be pleasant. Often, they can bridge across unrideable areas, linking us to better riding areas.

My primary objection to MUP riding is ponderous flatness and lack of challenge. I ride them sometimes, usually because my partner at that moment is afraid of road riding. Okay, whatever... Companionship trumps challenge today.

Depends on the MUP. I have a stretch of road that has MUP adjacent to it. Road is fresh newish white top as is the path. I refuse to use the path, why?

The idiots who designed that path have it crossing 4 residential blocks worth of residential driveways...in addition to about a dozen side streets. Funny note. In Nebraska, a cyclist who is hit by a car while riding his bike in a driveway or crosswalk cannot bring any charges against the driver. If I as a cyclist ride my bike in that MUP across a street and am hit and killed, the driver won't be charged with a crime.

Here is are a couple mild example I can readily find:

http://www.bikeforums.net/general-cy...l#post18279009

http://www.bikeforums.net/advocacy-s...l#post18095018

Real world example, I was using a MUP parallel to a busy road 4-lane road that functions as an exit to an interstate and a random passing cyclist blurts out "suicide-path!" This is part of my daily commute, I ride the road some days but on this day I was tired and not up to the combat. The MUP allows me to bypass the 3-way intersection that is the highway exit.

I ride 5,000 to 6,000 miles per year and I use roads and MUPs, it all depends on the conditions, the bike, and the rider. There are roads I ride to avoid the sidepath, and many bike friends think I'm nuts for being on 'that' road. I am no 'weenie' about riding the roads.

I don't understand universal dislike for MUPs, they have a place in the mix. And read the posts in this thread, you'll see a couple people that have universal hate (dislike) for MUPs. So, not really a straw man.

As a daily user of the Allegheny River Trail (lived 5 miles from Emlenton) I will say if you encounter more than 3 people in 26 miles on the ART, it's extremely busy.

I encountered maybe 8 people, and that may be a generous estimate. Most of them were heading north and were not that far out of Emlenton. Closer to the Franklin end there was no one except for one guy heading north.

Why? It's easier for me to just not ride on MUPs and leave those types of riders to it.

I prefer roads. My style of riding lends itself better to roads, and my area has a large selection of great cycling roads.

I don't ride them often, but no hate here. Just depends on the type of ride I'm doing, the particular MUP and the time of day. Some thoughts:

1. My wife prefers them, so when I'm doing an easy ride with her, we ride MUPs.
2. When I am out with the club or on my own riding fast, I'm on the road. I still appreciate the MUPs as the casual riders on the MUPs aren't on the road for me to deal with.
3. People seem to walk their dogs, kids, etc. in the mornings and/or late afternoon early evening. So midday on the MUPs isn't bad. I often ride home on the San Diego Creek trail after a club ride, it is midday at that point so the trail is not crowded, and the traffic thru Irvine is heavy with lots of looooong traffic lights. i can pick up the MUP and not have to deal with a traffic light for 5-8 miles and I can usually ride 18 mph most of the time.
4. Clubs and groups of hard core roadies should keep their peletons off the MUPs, my wife has been run off the MUP more than once by a bunch of jerks riding 4 abreast @ 20+ mph yelling at everyone to get out of their way. This scares and intimidates kids and their parents, and is just downright rude and inconsiderate.
5. If you see little kids on the MUPs riding their little bikes, slow down, smile and wave at them. Tell them they have a nice bike. They may become future cyclists if they get the impression that cyclists are nice people.

I think OP (and his supporters) are mis-stating the question they really want to ask, which is "Why would any bicyclist ever oppose a MUP?" That one's too easy to answer (the high probability, IME, that they'll be built poorly, maintained poorly, usable only for recreation and not transportation because of out-of-the-way routing, and only be usable by cyclists during off times). So proponents of MUPs have to re-state the question as, "Don't you like this one?" and only imply, "Why don't you support MUPs?"

I think a lot of this depends on riding style as well.

Going 20mph on roads seems a lot more reasonable than going 20mph on MUPs.

I'm more with RPK79 in that I like to run on trails like that. There are a lot of them at Minto Brown Park in Salem, OR. But when I bicycle, I'm almost always going somewhere and there aren't any MUPs going where I want to go. I don't think there ever will be. So I ride on lightly traveled roads. Very few road shoulders or bike lanes in my county, but a decent selection of low traffic roads.

I don't hate MUPs, but I hate riding on them. They are what they are; and what they are, are linear parks. If you're happy with riding up and down the same 5-mile stretch of hemmed-in, clogged-with-brush path to nowhere, over and over again, with a stop sign every block, then a MUP is right for you.

Here the major MUPs have no stop signs and usually go over or under roads.

OTOH, when I commuted 13 miles one-way by road I counted 10 stop signs and 24 traffic lights with only one right turn.

Ummm, okay. I think the MUP that goes through my neighborhood is about 35 miles long and still being expanded. Forget about the farms and lakes it passes and goes over. I do feel sorry for you as your MUPs must suck if they are as you describe.

And that may be the biggest difference in enjoying a MUP and not.

I would not ride on the roads around my house, country roads with no shoulder, no thanks. Farm equipment would not make it anymore fun. A road after a **** spreader has passed is bad enough driving through.

In this case, it seems option 2 - use the road - is applicable.

I am riding a lot more MUPs than I used to ride. I used to hardly ride on a MUP. Some of it is my age, some of it the distracted drivers, and some of it is the time of day. It has just become more difficult to go out into 5:00 traffic where running over me is the lesser of 2 evils for a lot of drivers.

That said, I have ridden on a Rails to Trails around Rancho Cucamonga/Upland that has stops just about every block and it drives me nuts. After 5 or 10 miles of start and stop I'm almost looking forward to getting run over.

The river trails around SoCal are nice as well as MUPs in Irvine, Newport... doing the Irvine/Back Bay/Shady Canyon loop with a mix of MUPs and roads is a pretty good ride.

But like everything else, timing is important.

John

We have a rail-to-trail official name is "Bike Trail" but effectively a MUP. During commute time it is much faster than the nearby road. Even off-hour there are numerous lights, driveways, etc on the road which would make riding it a pain (and I have never seen a cyclist on the road, maybe a couple of "transportation" cyclists on the sidewalk though illegal in that area). Speed limitation on the MUP is mainly due to poor surface condition in areas, not presence of other users or cross traffic (5 crossings in 13 miles).

scott s.
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Many popular ones are crowded with riders of varying speeds and experience. I've seen, and heard about teams using for training riding along at 25 mph. At the same time are mothers with children in strollers, walkers, runners, and cyclists at very unsteady 8 mph pace.

On other paths far away from conjestion, I almost hit a skaters leg. A group of several were pacelinimg and one didn't hear them call out I was coming. He did an exaggerated extension with his leg going right in front of me. I've seen crashes where some users stopped at signs and others didn't.

Overall unsafe for anyone riding over 10 mph on a nice weekend day. However that's not universal. I've been places where paths are nice and no one else is around

I like MUPs. They're a great place for people other than me to frequent.

As the OP, I must say, nicely stated. Thank you!

This post * and posts here on BF and comments I've heard on the road/trail have made me wonder why some people are so opposed to MUPs. MUPs are not the end-all-be-all for all bikes and trips; and roads are not the end-all-be-all either. We need a mix for all users and all trips. I would like to see people tone down the 'hate' for all MUPs and start to talk about bad implementation/design of MUPs.

* I HATE poorly designed MUPs, but I don't hate MUPs.

I'm really enjoying the dialog in the thread. Food for thought.

One reason to oppose them is that, once they're built, motorists EXPECT cyclists to be there instead of on the roads, even if the MUP doesn't go there.

Around here most MUPS follow abandoned railway right of ways so they tend to go from point A to point B by the most direct route.

This is a good point. I've had to many encounters with people in cars angrily, aggressively trying to force me to use the MUP when I'm on the road.