sillymcnasty

Hello:

Long time lurker, first time poster. So I know about the whole search tool function, lol. I think I have a bit of a very specific question so I made a new account. Anywho.

I've been biking to work for about 3-4 years now with a hybrid bike from Walmart. As you can expect, it has been a miserable experience throughout. I initially got it because it was a small investment to see how often I'd use the bike. Turns out, I bike about 4x a week if the weather permits.

I would like a fast bike, maybe a road bike. I live in NYC and I bike up the 59th st bridge and go all the way across town (for anyone that's familiar with NYC). The thing is, I honestly do not like drop bars. Since I'm biking in NYC I need instant access to my brakes. I used my friends road bike once with drop bars, and it took me longer to get home because I was afraid to go at higher speeds because I wouldn't be able to reach the brakes in time.

Also, since I'm only used to department store bikes (2008-2011 Diamondback Mountain Bike, 2012 to present Walmart hybrid), I'm not sure whether to go hybrid or road. I'm sure a decent brand name hybrid would blow my current bike out of the water. I'm wondering if it would be overkill to get a road bike when my general commute is ~6 miles each way. I've read on this forum that once you get a hybrid you'll want a road bike and invest in one anyway, so to skip the hybrid and go straight for the road bike.

I would honestly say that even though it is a short commute, speed is important to me. Maybe its my competitive nature coming out but I hate pedaling as hard as I can and going nowhere. Or seeing someone on a nice bike barely pedaling and going very fast lol. I know it's entirely the bike, and not me as a rider. Because uphill I can pass anyone going up the bridge, but once it levels out I always trail behind the people that I passed on the way up.

My average speed per ride is about 11mph and that includes stopping for red lights/traffic, etc. My top speeds generally don't go over 14mph. I'm wondering, assuming I'm a decent rider, what kind of speeds I can hope to get on a hybrid? Or a road bike? In my mapmyride app I've totaled 1800 miles logged for the past 2-3 years with 2 knee surgeries in between, if that is any indication.

Also, in terms of shopping. It's damn near impossible to get a deal because LBS are all mom and pop shops and they can't quite compete with prices.. so any idea on what to do regarding that? I prob want to spend around 5-600 on a bike.

Thanks!

chasm54

1. The brakes are instantly accessible on a drop-bar bike when riding in the drops or on the brake hoods. Obviously it would feel strange at first.

2. It isn't "overkill" to use a road bike for a short commute, especially if you ride for pleasure at weekends.

3. Nobody can tell you whether you'd prefer a road bike to a hybrid, you have to try some and see.

4. Answer number 3 is one reason to use a LBS, they'll let you try before you buy. And it can be useful to have a relationship with a LBS even if it initially costs you a few dollars on the price of the bike. However, if you get sure of your size and what you want there are plenty of deals to be had online. Even LBSs might have deals on 2015 models now that their new 2016 stock has arrived. Ask them.

5. I have no idea how fast you might get. 1800 miles over 3 years isn't very much, there's probably a lot of room for improvement if you put in more time on the bike. But you'll typically get 1-2 mph more out of a road bike than a hybrid.

Jarrettsin

You can get a fast nice quality Hybrid for that budget. Trek FX7.3, Cannondale Quick 5, and Specialized Sirrus Sport all fall into that price range and kick ass compared to the Wal-Mart Bike. All good bikes for city riding. I like sitting up a little more in the city need to watch everything going on.

sillymcnasty

Thanks. Remember I had 2 knee surgeries over the span so I spent a few months each time not riding. Plus when the roads are icy/snowy I tend to not bike as well. I will look into the LBS for last year's models.

My cousin has the quick5 and recommended it, but I haven't tested it. What kind of speeds do you get on your Quick4?

Maelochs

There are tons of flat-bar road bikes out there. They might be called different things, but what to look for, pretty much: skinny tires, carbon fork, Al frame, small, skinny seat.

If you are looking at a bike with wide tires and a big, overpadded seat you are looking at more of a cruiser/hybrid/gravel bike. A gravel bike/cyclocross bike might be good for NYC---never rode there so I don't know about thew pavement---but if you like to go fast you don't want a bike more geared towards dirt trails and gravel, i'd guess. Also, if you commute, you will want to look for rack mounts, and maybe fender mounts---which might be harder to find on a road bike.

it is matter of compromise---you want a lower-cost bike which isn't really heavy, can still take some abuse, and can carry lunch and work clothes (I assume.) I also assume since you have been riding you can do basic maintenance and know what size frame you are looking for.

Just as a starting point: This $450 Fuji from Nashbar (Fuji Absolute 1.3 Flat Bar Road Bike - 2013) looks alright. It apparently doesn't have racks or fender mounts, so I wouldn't get it for a commuter bike, but this is the kind fo thing you might want to consider.

This Liberty (a Giant copy, they claim) from Bikedirect is $500 and looks really nice---it can accommodate very big tires, and seems to have rack mounts. (Save up to 60% off new Flat Bar Road Bikes - Gravity Liberty FB | Save up to 60% off new road bikes)

I am NOT recommending either bike---just throwing these out there to give you some idea of what's available. I would do a lot of online searching, and decide very carefully. Also, if you scan Craigslist you might find even better deals. And check the websites of the major manufacturers. Everyone makes a ton of different bikes today.

I suggest the online option and Craigslist assuming that you could assemble a bike in a box or do your own tune-ups and adjustments and minor repair if you bought online or used. I also assume you know what size frame you need. if you have been riding Wal-Mart, you Have to have been wrestling with maintenance adjustment issues way too often.

For $500-$600 you should be able to get a quick, comfortable, durable machine which will keep you smiling for many years to come.

EDIT: As others have said, don't ignore the possibility that a drop-bar road bike might fit your needs. The flat bar forces you to suit up taller most of the time which can be good in traffic, but you have to fight the wind more. You can find road bikes with fender- and rack-mounts and drop bars just as you can find them with flat bars--or maybe you don't even care about racks and fenders. You might also look into touring models---they tend to have longer wheelbases so they aren't quite so snappy in the turns, but are great if you are hauling a lot of gear to work and back.

But yeah, drop bars are no less safe. I have commuted for many thousands of miles on flat- and drop bars. Safety is mostly the rider, not the bike.

chasm54

You aren't getting it. How fast the rest of us are on a particular bike has no bearing on how fast you'll be. The rider, not the bike, determines the speed.

sillymcnasty

You hit the nail on the head with the maintenance on the Walmart bike haha. Such a nuisance.

I don't really go off road so I will look into the cyclocross. I don't need work clothes or to really carry anything. I have a bag I wear around my back, and I keep a change of clothes at work. I'm lucky to work at a college where I can shower and everything when I get here. Regarding bikedirect, even on this forum I've seen people write that they make up fake prices to make the discounts look outrageous. Or that they aren't the genuine bikes and the quality difference can be told from the originals? Confused because so many people have been recommending them.

As far as tires, I think I'd want 700cx28 maybe. Not the thinnest but not the thickest.

Thank you, you have been very helpful.

I get it completely. I even stated it in my first post. I'm just gauging other people's experiences with the bike they own. There's nothing wrong with that. Additionally, his location lists NYC so his input might have some relevance since he will be commuting under the same conditions. But thanks, anyhow.

badger1

@chasm54 pretty much nailed the main points above.

Risking repetition: any 'decent' road bike -- drop or flat bar, and properly fitted -- is going to feel somewhat lighter/quicker than your WMart hybrid. Choice of bar is down to personal preference, but neither type will be problematic where braking is concerned. Some find (I'm one) that flat bars work best for them; others drops. Whatever works. If you plan to do long(er) road rides and/or ride with a road group you should at least consider drops -- give both a real test before making a purchase.

chasm54 is also right about 'fast'; that's down to you. What anyone on here (BF) claims is their "average speed" etc. is a) to be taken with a very, very large grain of salt, and b) will anyway tell you/predict nothing at all about how 'fast' you will be, even on an identical bike.

sillymcnasty

What would be considered a long trip? The furthest I've gone is 13 miles and I had to stop because I would have ended up in New Jersey lol. This was on the walmart bike lol.

The main point in the hybrid vs road bike is that I've seen plenty of times here that people who get a hybrid will generally end up wanting a road bike soon after. I know it's preference, but if that's the general progression, wondering if I should just put a little more and get a road bike instead of needing to get a whole new bike in the not so distant future.

Thanks, I'm going to try out some bikes tomorrow.

Maelochs

"Long ride" is different for each person. The big difference between a "road bike" versus a "hybrid" is the road bike is more aimed at mostly paved roads, they tend to be lighter. Hybrids tend to be a little heavier to absorb the impacts of riding gravel, dirt, ruts, roots ... and generally have wider knobby tires.

if you are riding almost exclusively on the road, a road bike will give you what you need and not much you don't, where a hybrid will give you capacities you won't use riding just pavement. Road bikes are plenty tough enough to handle terrible pavement and even gravel and packed earth---but won't be comfortable there. But on the road, a road bike will not hold you back, where a hybrid will weigh you down a bit.

fietsbob

how many floors do you walk up to bring your bike inside?

FrenchFit 

Analysis is not your friend on this one. I own 12+ bikes, the two I ride most often would not make sense to anyone but me. My $3300+ carbon vunderbike has been hanging in the garage for 4 years in a garage, rarely used.

Buy the bike you like and have a passion for riding. If quick braking is a concern, put in-line brakes on the drop-bars -- they are magic. Pretty much every limitation can be addressed with a modest upgrade, unless you buy something as radical as a pure track or fat bike. So, trust your instincts.

badger1

Definition of 'long' or 'longer' rides varies. For me -- a dedicated recreational rider who rides solo -- a 'longer' ride is something, say, 50 to 60 kms (sorry, Canadian here); a 'long' ride would be 80k and up.

Your other topic is a little more vexed. I can again only give a personal view: part of the problem is the definition of 'hybrid'; a useless term in my opinion. What most people think of when they think 'hybrid' is the older 'cross between a mountainbike and a road bike'; i.e. heavy-ish build, wider/possibly knobby tires but 700c like a road bike, flat bars, wide-range mtb-based gearing; suspension, designed to be used both on and off-road. They can be very fine bikes, and there are lots of examples. In Europe these are often referred to as 'cross' or 'trekking' bikes'. The other main type of 'hybrid', though, is the flat-bar road bike. Completely different animal. If you are in a shop selling Specialized, for example, compare the Crosstrail with the Sirrus (or Giant, compare Roam and Fastroad): you'll see what I mean. In North America these are often, unfortunately, referred to as 'fitness bikes'. They are road bikes.

The difference in 'speed' between comparable flat-bar and drop-bar road bikes is real, but it is very small ... again, much like claims about 'average speed' the claims about the difference between flat and drop-bar road bikes on here tend to greatly overstate things. Over a longer ride, let's say 50 'real' miles on a course with a good few hills, the difference might amount to 1 to 2 mph. That's down almost entirely to the inherently better aero positioning afforded by drop bars, and to being able to use the drop position into headwinds and on descents. Again, I'm assuming proper fit on both and comparable quality.

If that difference matters, and/or if as many do you find drop bars more comfortable, go that way. If the difference doesn't matter (as it doesn't to me), and/or if you find flat bars work better for you, as they do (with bar ends) for me, go that way. In my opinion you should buy/ride what you like, not what the 'interwebz' say you should like. Fortunately, these days there's all kinds of choice out there. Them's my thoughts.

sillymcnasty

Thank you, that was a help.

I will look into that. Quick braking def a top priority for me.

Zero.

I ride on the road and the only things that would pop up would be shattered glass, potholes, typical city stuff.

fietsbob

Fixies or single speeds are popular.. though I like 3 speeds

$600 bike including state and city taxes? I got no suggestions

go into shops tell them your budget and work backwards from there.

habilis

Nice thing about these is, once they're set up to your liking, they need very little attention. If your commute is fairly level, extra gears are mostly just extra weight.

TenSpeedV2

For that kind of city riding, and considering that you aren't setting any land speed records, a single speed bike isn't a bad idea. I commute on both a fixed gear and geared road bike, and find myself a bit faster on the fixed gear. With my gearing, I can easily ride 19mph for extended periods of time on my commute. Now I don't live in NYC so the stop light situation is a bit different, but I do live in a smaller city so they are here as well as traffic.

sillymcnasty

Soft cap of 600. If it's slightly more I don't mind.

And they look pretty sweet too! My commute is level enough. No crazy hills. The only issue is going up the 59th street bridge because there's ridges in the concrete every inch or so. All that friction is annoying when you're on a piece of crap.

Thanks I will be trying out a bunch of bikes today lol

GeoKrpan

Bikesdirect is a great place to buy a bike.

Here's a great one for $699. What sets it apart are really good hydraulic discs. I got the Orange Crush color.

Save Up to 60% Off Disc Brake Road Bikes - Motobecane Omni Strada Trail

fietsbob

But, NB, they require the buyer to be the somewhat skilled mechanic.

Though at my LBS people have dropped off the BD boxes ..
& brought home a bike carefully adjusted and checked over for potential minor shipping damage..

for a modest charge..

Garfield Cat

Silly McNasty,

It may be the first impression of drop bars was not a very good experience. Maybe because the set-up was not for your hands and also that you're not accustomed to the way the brakes work.

Please don't eliminate drop bars as a possibility. One or five bad experiences on someone else's bike isn't the end of the discussion.

Because of what you wrote, many posts start to eliminate drop bars as a suggestion. I don't know what this logical error is called.

sillymcnasty

Fallacy, I believe.



The bike shop I'm looking at has a review of someone buying from there and them assembling it for $30. Not too shabby.


I suppose I'll look through it. Not sure how I feel about the "comparable to" aspect of their bikes. It's like buying bootleg cologne to me lol

Maelochs

Yeah, ignore the "comparable to ..." stuff. Fact is the frames are about as good as the average frames on bikes costing just a bit more ... I have heard various theories from the BikesDirect manufacturers buying over-runs from other manufacturers' production over-runs, to using the same tooling after a manufacturer has finished a run of frames ... but they are indeed quality frames, every bit as good as the big-name brands (the lower-to mid versions thereof) and are probably made at exactly the same factories by the same workers, and possibly with the same tooling.

The components are what they are. The same Shimano or Sram you would get on any other bike or through any merchandiser. Yes, there are some lower-end parts there too, but most manufacturers put some house-brand or cost-cutter parts into the build for the lower-end bikes---a good way to save cost without drastically compromising quality. (Fact is, no one who is serious about racing at a high level is buying Any of these bikes, or any low-to-mid-range major manufacturers' bikes either; those folks want Ultegre/Rival level stuff at least.)

I own and regularly ride a BikesDirect bike, and was part of a group tour which used them. They are just bikes. The same quality as a bike from a big brand costing a couple/few hundred more, because BikesDirect doesn't mess with marketing, R&D, new models ... it just takes whatever the big guys were doing last year and sells it this year.

Unless you are planning to seriously race--as in spend all your free time training and all your spare cash traveling to race ... a BD bike can be a great option. If the names on the decals matter to you, spend a couple/few hundred more.

BD bikes only get so good---once you get beyond about $2K (I'd estimate) it isn't worth trying to save a few bucks with any kind of compromise, but for someone looking to spend $500-$1000 it is a good option indeed.

These are not "knock-offs" or copies. They are serious bikes. There are some Chinese companies which make super-cheap carbon-fiber fakes of quality bikes, and those have earned a bad reputation,. But BD is not making cheap copies of better bikes. They are simply selling low-to-mid bikes for less because of low overhead. I didn't buy BD thinking I was getting a bike worth twice what I paid ... I knew I was getting a bargain price on a bargain bike.

But that is sort of what you are looking for.

Disclosure: I do Not work for and am in no way affiliated with BikesDirect. If they went out of business tomorrow I wouldn't care. But, for people bike-shopping on a budget, I make the suggestion.

sillymcnasty

Thanks, that was very, very helpful. I will take a more serious look at their stock now. Maybe I'd be able to get a slightly better bike on there using the same budget I'd use at LBS. Thanks, again.

Edit: Hm, not finding weight on any of the bikes listed... Sad face

GeoKrpan

I agree with most of what you say but I think you are short changing Motobecane. They recently came out with a titanium gravel bike with hydraulic road discs, tapered steerer tube, and Ultegra 11 speed for $2299! No one else has anything like it. I have not seen another gravel bike that I would want more, including the much ballyhooed and hyped Cervelo C5 with it's paltry 700x28 tire clearance and $4500-$9000 price tag. Motobecane also makes titanium fatbikes.

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