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Anyone have success drilling and taping frame?

Old 03-31-16, 01:49 PM
  #1  
HamptonT
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Anyone have success drilling and taping frame?

I want to add a steering stabilizer to my Surly Ogre with front rack and dual stand. The one i bought is for the braze on mount. I'm thinking about drilling and taping a threaded hope for it.
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Old 03-31-16, 02:01 PM
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There is a framebuilder's forum, and the members there know a lot more about this than most of the posters on this forum. Ask the moderator to move your question there.
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Old 03-31-16, 02:02 PM
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Steel Bike tubing is too thin to simply drill and thread it.. The technique if you dont want to burn paint off to bare Metal
and Braze in a threaded Boss , then repaint that portion,

is to drill a Hole a little bigger and use a Riv-Nut. which expands into that hole. a Kin of the Poprivet.
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Old 03-31-16, 02:44 PM
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I had never heard of a steering stabilizer, so I looked it up, and it looks like many require no drilling.
bicycle steering stabilizer Archives - CyclingAbout CyclingAbout
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Old 03-31-16, 03:34 PM
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As fietsbob says, you will have no luck with drilling and tapping frame tubing as the metal is simply too thin.

You can take the frame to a frame builder and they can braze on a boss for you or look for some sort of clamp which is compatible with your stabilizer.
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Old 03-31-16, 05:19 PM
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I had a Hydraulic steering Dampener, Onza Made them.. patterned after motorcycle ones , But ..

I was Building the bike from a scratch built frame, so made Brackets for the Purpose in The framebuilder's shop.
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Old 03-31-16, 09:23 PM
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You don't want to drill your frame. The tubing is very thin and you won't be able to thread anything into it. Have a threaded boss brazen on instead. Much stronger.
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Old 04-01-16, 05:06 AM
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Or use a rivnut.
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Old 04-01-16, 05:40 AM
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The advantage of a rivnut in this application is that you wouldn't have to repaint.
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Old 04-01-16, 07:45 AM
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Originally Posted by HamptonT View Post
I want to add a steering stabilizer to my Surly Ogre with front rack and dual stand. The one i bought is for the braze on mount. I'm thinking about drilling and taping a threaded hope for it.
I am a retired Tool&Die Maker and would agree that drilling the frame is unfavorable.
However, if you decide to do so, I would give this advise---
Drill a 1/16 pilot hole and punch the hole larger with a thin punch. This pushes metal inside to allow for more threads.
You must be very careful as to what diameter hole you make with punch.
Sometimes a sheet metal screw will have more holding power then a machine screw.
I always use this method with thin metal.
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Old 04-02-16, 05:11 PM
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Well. I ended up using a Minoura mount to fix the down tube end of the stabilizer spring. The tension on the spring is pretty strong so it's probably best to have a solid mount. I still want to get a hold of some rivet nuts to experiment with. They are hard to come by in the M5 variety. I can order some on Amazon. It would be a much cleaner instal if the rivet nuts could hold the forces of the spring.
How do you add pictures on this forum?
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Old 04-02-16, 05:48 PM
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Picture

Originally Posted by HamptonT View Post
Well. I ended up using a Minoura mount to fix the down tube end of the stabilizer spring. The tension on the spring is pretty strong so it's probably best to have a solid mount. I still want to get a hold of some rivet nuts to experiment with. They are hard to come by in the M5 variety. I can order some on Amazon. It would be a much cleaner instal if the rivet nuts could hold the forces of the spring.
How do you add pictures on this forum?
Figured out how to add pics
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Old 04-02-16, 08:26 PM
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There's a special technique that doe exactly what the OP needs.

You "drill" holes into thin material like bicycle tubes using a bullet pointed carbide tip, rotating at high speed. Friction warms the steel to where it melts and as the "drill" enters the hole, it, along with surface tension pushes the semi-molten material to the sides forming a lip (think volcano), that can later be tapped. This is a rare, specialized technique, but machine shops that specialize in sheet metal for the electronics world may be familiar with it.

Some frame makers in Italy have used the method, who's results can be recognized by the very small raised lips surrounding the tapped hole, rather than the broad flat brazed on boss.
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Old 04-03-16, 06:37 AM
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Originally Posted by BobbyG View Post
I had never heard of a steering stabilizer, so I looked it up, and it looks like many require no drilling.
bicycle steering stabilizer Archives - CyclingAbout CyclingAbout

Excuse my ignorance, but why would one need such a thing?
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Old 04-03-16, 07:46 AM
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Originally Posted by indyfabz View Post
Excuse my ignorance, but why would one need such a thing?
What I learned was when parking a bike whose front wheel is under a heavy load, such as touring with panniers, front rack and handlebar bag, the front wheel wants to pull to the side, which can cause the bike to fall, especial with a side stand, or even when leaned against a wall. A dual-leg center stand can help avoid this, but not always.

Also a heavily loaded front wheel can be prone to shimmy at high speed, especially on long downhills, where unchecked oscillations can lead to instability and loss of control (i.e. crash).

In addition, off-road racers often employ steering dampers to reduce steering kickback from roots, rocks, irregular surfaces, etc.

In all cases steering stabilizers help keep the front wheel centered. There seem to be two main flavors; an "under the downtube" design that attatches from under the downtube to the steering fork using a spring, solid elastometer, or hydrualic cylinder. There is also a design that attatches from the handlebars to the top tube, which seems more prevalent amongst off-roaders.

Most dampers are adjustable to provide the amount of resistance desired.

Many motorcyles use these as a front motorcycle assembly, especially with a fairing can be very heavy.
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Old 04-03-16, 08:17 AM
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Originally Posted by BobbyG View Post
What I learned was when parking a bike whose front wheel is under a heavy load, such as touring with panniers, front rack and handlebar bag, the front wheel wants to pull to the side, which can cause the bike to fall, especial with a side stand, or even when leaned against a wall. A dual-leg center stand can help avoid this, but not always.

Also a heavily loaded front wheel can be prone to shimmy at high speed, especially on long downhills, where unchecked oscillations can lead to instability and loss of control (i.e. crash).
More than 15,000 loaded touring miles with big front loads and it's never bothered me.

But I could see one for off-road racing.

Thanks.
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Old 04-03-16, 10:02 AM
  #17  
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Originally Posted by fietsbob View Post
Steel Bike tubing is too thin to simply drill and thread it.. The technique if you dont want to burn paint off to bare Metal
and Braze in a threaded Boss , then repaint that portion,

is to drill a Hole a little bigger and use a Riv-Nut. which expands into that hole. a Kin of the Poprivet.
This is ALMOST universally true, but not quite. I've installed a lot of Riv-nuts in bike frames, but when it came time to mount bottle cages on my old Schwinn tandem, the frame tubing was thick enough to tap in 3 full threads at m5 x .8. It's been holding two bottles securely for years.
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Old 04-03-16, 10:07 AM
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yea flash welded US Made Schwinns did use some pretty substantial tube wall steel . not trying for light weight.
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Old 04-03-16, 02:06 PM
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Update....
first attempt with the Minoura clamp has failed. I used black electrical tape under the band to protect the frame. The location of the band clamp was also right over the SURLY stickers. I noticed today that the band clamp was slowly inching it's way forward. Messed up the SURLY stickers. Oh well.
One thing is for sure. Having the steering stabilizer is a must. It made a huge difference.
Options going forward are the rivnuts with but if Jiles suggestion to start with a smaller hole and ream it out to size. Or I could try the Velo Orange model that comes with a more substantial wrap around clamp.
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Old 04-08-16, 04:52 PM
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Riv-nuts and tool arrived today. Wish me luck....
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Old 04-08-16, 07:08 PM
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So far a big success. These rivnuts are pretty cool! Makes for a very clean install.
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