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-   -   I Think my LBS is Doing Something Really Shady (https://www.bikeforums.net/general-cycling-discussion/1073900-i-think-my-lbs-doing-something-really-shady.html)

puma1552 07-25-16 05:16 PM

I Think my LBS is Doing Something Really Shady
 
So I stopped off at my LBS just now after work to see if they had any '17 Specialized Sirruses on the floor yet, I mainly wanted to see colors in person. '17s went up on the Specialized website last week.

For those that don't know, the Specialized website shows the Sirrus base disc in bright orange for 2016 and a price of $600. The '17 is only available in blue according to the site, and got a price drop to $550.

Well, my bike shop has several orange base discs selling for $600 - the problem is, the big price tag on every one clearly calls them out as '17s.

It's not just the base disc either, but also the base model. The base model is available in an identical black color scheme for both 2016 and 2017, but the 2016 is $520 and the 2017 is $500. Yet they had a bunch of black base models for $520, and listed as 2017s. Note they had neither of the new for '17 colors on the floor (silver and lime) for the base model either, just the black which is further suspicious.

I suspect in both of these cases, unless I'm missing something, they are dishonestly retagging their '16 Sirrus Base/base disc models as '17s. They had at least 4-5 of each.

Note this isn't the case on all models - the '16 Sirrus sports are correctly labeled as '16s, and they are selling '16 Sirrus Elites at a discount.

Am I missing something or is my LBS shady? The guy did tell me that they don't get '17s in until 2 to 4 months after they go up on the website, despite standing right in front of supposed '17s...I'd hate to name the shop (it's a chain), but hard to support my LBS if they are doing something dishonest...

10 Wheels 07-25-16 05:22 PM

Did you show him your badge.

How does one become a model police?

dieselgoat 07-25-16 05:27 PM

Never know till you call them on it. Just tell them you saw on the web where '17s only came in blue.

MRT2 07-25-16 05:33 PM

There might be a reasonable explanation.

puma1552 07-25-16 05:37 PM


Originally Posted by MRT2 (Post 18938068)
There might be a reasonable explanation.

And that's what I'm hoping - I don't know if Specialized has some bizarre policy where beyond a certain manufacture date a prior model year gets tagged/updated to be sold as a current model year? Or something to that effect. Again, anything I looked at other than the base or base disc was correctly tagged as a '16, like Specialized's site.

MRT2 07-25-16 05:45 PM


Originally Posted by puma1552 (Post 18938074)
And that's what I'm hoping - I don't know if Specialized has some bizarre policy where beyond a certain manufacture date a prior model year gets tagged/updated to be sold as a current model year? Or something to that effect. Again, anything I looked at other than the base or base disc was correctly tagged as a '16, like Specialized's site.

Honestly, I don't see what the big deal is.

Doctor Morbius 07-25-16 05:48 PM

I'd let them know you've done a bit of browsing on Specialized's site and were pretty certain they only came in blue with an MSRP of $550. See what they have to say.

If you find out they're lying about the model year, don't do business with them. If that's what they are doing, then it's a pretty unethical business practice.

making 07-25-16 05:53 PM

Be careful, the bike shop might put out a hit on you. Seriously though, if you got the serial number off one then reported them to the manufacturer might be all you can do. I can see how Specialized might get upset about it.

Doctor Morbius 07-25-16 05:53 PM


Originally Posted by MRT2 (Post 18938097)
Honestly, I don't see what the big deal is.

I found my neighbor's wallet in the street the other day. Naturally, I kept the $300 that was in it. I don't see what the big deal is. Finders keepers, right?

BlazingPedals 07-25-16 06:18 PM

Usually when a model is cost-reduced, you see it in the component specs. Are blue and orange bikes at the same component level?

puma1552 07-25-16 06:25 PM


Originally Posted by BlazingPedals (Post 18938175)
Usually when a model is cost-reduced, you see it in the component specs. Are blue and orange bikes at the same component level?

I believe there are some changes, but I didn't look at the bikes close enough in person. I have gathered that the year is in Specialized's part/model number (last two digits in first number), but didn't think to look close at the manufacturer's tag on the bike...but don't really have any good reason to think they wouldn't say 2016.

deapee 07-25-16 06:26 PM

You know honestly, I always suspect that -- and any time I've bought a bike, I've always double checked on the manufacturer's web site for color scheme and components as they change.

But yeah dude, that sounds pretty dishonest and sketchy as heck.

puma1552 07-25-16 06:54 PM

I emailed Specialized to inform them of the situation, and to let me know if I'm missing something. Figured it didn't really help to ask the LBS since they will likely tell me something that may or may not be true, and I won't be able to know for sure. I figured Specialized is the one who will give me the answer straight - if the LBS is above board, Specialized will tell me and explain and all will be well for me and the LBS, no harm done, and if not, then Specialized will straighten things out with the LBS, as they should. Hard to imagine it would just be a mistake on the LBS's part, to be honest.

Will update this thread with what I hear from Specialized.

the_freewheeler 07-25-16 08:01 PM

Don't call them out on it until you've fully done your research. As others have said, getting the serial numbers would be the most definitive way to confirm, but at the very least you could take a couple photos and reach out to Specialized. If they confirm, I'd call the shop owner out and shame them on social media if they deny it.

Camilo 07-25-16 09:45 PM


Originally Posted by BlazingPedals (Post 18938175)
Usually when a model is cost-reduced, you see it in the component specs. Are blue and orange bikes at the same component level?


Originally Posted by puma1552 (Post 18938192)
I believe there are some changes, but I didn't look at the bikes close enough in person. I have gathered that the year is in Specialized's part/model number (last two digits in first number), but didn't think to look close at the manufacturer's tag on the bike...but don't really have any good reason to think they wouldn't say 2016.


So the only spec you looked at was color? That's about the least important spec. You should look at the components, and especially the crank and wheels because they're pretty common things to change (downgrade) to shave the MSRP some.

That, to me is how you should be looking at the bikes - and the model year - not color or even serial number because it's easier than looking for the S/N.

Tell us what you find out and then we might be able to answer your shadiness question.

Added:


Originally Posted by puma1552 (Post 18938252)
I emailed Specialized to inform them of the situation, and to let me know if I'm missing something. Figured it didn't really help to ask the LBS since they will likely tell me something that may or may not be true, and I won't be able to know for sure. I figured Specialized is the one who will give me the answer straight - if the LBS is above board, Specialized will tell me and explain and all will be well for me and the LBS, no harm done, and if not, then Specialized will straighten things out with the LBS, as they should. Hard to imagine it would just be a mistake on the LBS's part, to be honest.

Will update this thread with what I hear from Specialized.

You did this when you've only looked at the color? Go back and actually look at the bikes, you can figure this out for yourself!

smarkinson 07-25-16 09:47 PM

This is the 2017 model for $550 in blue?

https://www.specialized.com/us/en/bi...us-disc/118422



This is the 2016 model for $600 in orange or blue?

https://www.specialized.com/us/en/bi...us-disc/107451

There seems to be quite a difference in the components between the two.

I think marking a 2016 bike as a 2017 one is deceptive and would usually entitle the buyer to a refund as the goods do not match the description of the product (check your local laws). It can also lead to the customer over paying. If it was marked as a 2016 bike then the customer may try to haggle for a lower price (last years model and all).

puma1552 07-25-16 09:52 PM


Originally Posted by Camilo (Post 18938592)
So the only spec you looked at was color? That's about the least important spec. You should look at the components, and especially the crank and wheels because they're pretty common things to change (downgrade) to shave the MSRP some.

That, to me is how you should be looking at the bikes - and the model year - not color or even serial number because it's easier than looking for the S/N.

Tell us what you find out and then we might be able to answer your shadiness question.

You did this when you've only looked at the color? Go back and actually look at the bikes, you can figure this out for yourself!

Color and price. I'm new to bikes and don't know my components by looks unless they explicitly say the model, lots of times they just generically say Shimano or whatever. If the 2016 and 2017 base disc were both listed as $600 on Specialized's site, then I could see the orange maybe just being a mistaken omission on Specialized's site for 2017 color options (I've seen several mistakes on their site such as the 2017 Sport lists a Zertz fork but the image is without), but if both the color and price are off, I suspect it isn't a website mistake.

In any regards, we'll see what Specialized says.

puma1552 07-25-16 09:57 PM


Originally Posted by smarkinson (Post 18938597)
This is the 2017 model for $550 in blue?

https://www.specialized.com/us/en/bi...us-disc/118422



This is the 2016 model for $600 in orange or blue?

https://www.specialized.com/us/en/bi...us-disc/107451

There seems to be quite a difference in the components between the two.

I think marking a 2016 bike as a 2017 one is deceptive and would usually entitle the buyer to a refund as the goods do not match the description of the product (check your local laws). It can also lead to the customer over paying. If it was marked as a 2016 bike then the customer may try to haggle for a lower price (last years model and all).

Correct, they had $600 orange bikes listed as 2017s, which you can see should only be available in blue and for $550 for 2017 according to that site.

Same deal with black base models, 2016s are $520 and 2017s are $500, but they had $520 black ones listed as '17s.

raceboy 07-25-16 10:30 PM

If your LBS is part of a chain, it is possible that they negotiated a special deal with the manufacturer for a build with different specs. I think they do this so that is hard to compare apples to apples. I think PC manufacturers use this technique all the time, too.

American Euchre 07-26-16 12:38 AM


Originally Posted by puma1552 (Post 18938025)
Am I missing something or is my LBS shady? The guy did tell me that they don't get '17s in until 2 to 4 months after they go up on the website, despite standing right in front of supposed '17s...I'd hate to name the shop (it's a chain), but hard to support my LBS if they are doing something dishonest...

If you're so far gone as to even consider a shop after something like this happens, then the only person to blame would be you.

deapee 07-26-16 05:50 AM


Originally Posted by raceboy (Post 18938654)
If your LBS is part of a chain, it is possible that they negotiated a special deal with the manufacturer for a build with different specs. I think they do this so that is hard to compare apples to apples. I think PC manufacturers use this technique all the time, too.

That sounds off to me...I'd be just ask skeptical as the OP...and I'd have walked out of there too.

puma1552 07-26-16 06:55 AM


Originally Posted by American Euchre (Post 18938783)
If you're so far gone as to even consider a shop after something like this happens, then the only person to blame would be you.

I took his comments to mean it probably takes 2-4 months for all models to be stocked in full, I assume it takes time for models to start trickling in bit by bit as they are made? In any regards, I did not test ride any bikes yesterday and left (though they did have a '16 Sirrus Elite marked down from $810 to under $700 that was tempting).

Juan Foote 07-26-16 06:59 AM


Originally Posted by making (Post 18938120)
I can see how Specialized might get upset about it.


The only thing Specialized cares about is receiving a check from the dealer on time. How they are sold and what is said to do it is pretty inconsequential.

indyfabz 07-26-16 07:07 AM

I'd hop on that deal. 2016 orange bikes are WAY faster than 2017 blue bikes.

mconlonx 07-26-16 08:27 AM

I see this listed on the Specialized website without a model year attribution, at $600: https://www.specialized.com/us/en/bi...us-disc/107451

So what's the problem?

If it is projected that there will be enough orange bikes still in stock with Specialized at the end of they year, the Orange bikes could very well be sold as "carry-over" models, and truthfully labeled as '17 bikes. Which decision might already have been made by Specialized.

Or it could easily be a simple mistake on the part of the shop.

Or it could be something nefarious going down, the shop purposely swindling the buying public by selling a bike at the online MSRP. The horror...

There is a very good chance the shop is doing nothing at all shady.


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