WizardOfBoz

I'm currently riding a CF bike and I love it. That said, I'd like to have a steel frame bike to ride. I've been looking at older LeMond bikes, with the idea of upgrading the groupset to to something modern (10 or 11 spd). Any downside to getting an older Zurich or Alpe d'Huez? If I understand correctly, these bikes were designed with a longer wheelbase than other brands of similar sized bikes. How pronounced is this? Can I overcome this with a shorter stem?

If you have one of these, how do you like it?

Bikedud

Not a longer "wheelbase", but a longer top tube. If you ride a 56cm frame, get a 55cm Lemond. I road a 98 Zurich for seven or eight years, loved the ride. One caveat you may want to be aware of- My Zurich was made during that time period when high performance road bikes were being manufactured with very little room between the fork and stays for larger tires. I never could get even 700x25's to fit without rubbing.

WizardOfBoz

Thanks, Bikedud. I'm thinking I'm going to get a 61cm frame - hopefully there is enough space in the rear triangle on a frame that size. But duly noted - many thanks!

jamesdak 

Well, one downside is you're not going to like your CF bike after getting the steel one.

Seriously though, the Lemonds are wonderful bikes so you should enjoy it. I have four of them. Two Trek era bikes and two earlier Greg Lemonds built in Italy. I can't say anything bad about any of them.

Most of my PRs over the years are still on the Zurich. I loaned it to a friend a couple of years ago and have yet to get it back. But the others are going strong in my stable.

Lemonds are built for speed but comfort. Like already mentioned, the top tube is a bit longer than you may be used to. The Zurich was usually considered the best deal of them all. Good components to price ratio and all that.

The Trek era bikes are good steel, Reynolds 853 and the like. The earlier ones from the best I can tell were various Columbus steel. They are harder to find and with less info on them.

I don't think you can go wrong with any of them.

Both of the Trek era ones below are easily under 20 lbs weight with bottle cages, pedals, etc.

2000 Zurich - Reynolds 853 frame/CF Fork and 9 speed Ultegra



2003 Tourmelet - Reynolds 853 frame/CF fork and built with a combo of Ultergra and Dura Ace parts



These two older Greg Lemond bikes are awesome. They were built by the Billato Brothers in Italy. They are heavier than the 853 bikes above.

1989 (or so) Ventoux - Columbus Cromor with a mix of Shimano parts. My favorite ride for centuries because it's so comfortable.




1989 (or so) Maillot Jaune - Columbus TSX with a full Campagnolo build. Just got this and haven't had a chance to ride it due to bad winter roads.




All of these will fit at least a 700 x 25c Continental GP4000s tire since I've done it. As you may know they actually run large to size. The Ventoux will run the same tire in 700 x 28c but the rear is really close. The Maillot Jaune cannot run the 28c tire. The problem isn't the frame it's that the Campagnolo brakes won't clear the tire.

Hope this helps. Once again, you just can't go wrong with a Lemond.

ClydeTim

I ride a 58 in most brands but a 57 in a Lemond was heaven for me. Partial carbon spine design. Out of all the bikes I have had over the 20 years, that was the most comfortable and even smoother than my full carbon bikes though not full carbon.

The 57 Lemond fit like a glove right out of the box, no swapping components etc.

FTR, 6'1, somewhat long torso but not real long arms.

mercator

My '98 Buenos Aries is a 55 but I could fit a 57 as well.
Love it.

mercator

Beautiful bike

Not too keen on those Rolf wheels though, the flanges seemed to be prone to failure.

gringomojado

Son -in-law has one and loves it!

Sangetsu

Le Mond bikes are the bees knees, very good stuff. I remember meeting Le Mond in his racing days when he came by the bike shop where I worked after winning his first Tour.

None other than Lance Armstrong killed off the Le Mond bicycle. Le Mond bikes were originally made by Trek, who had licensed the "Le Mond" name. Later, Le Mond designed the bikes, and they were built and distributed by Trek.

But when Le Mond had the gall in an interview to say in the same paragraph that Lance had either made the greatest comeback of all time, or been the greatest fraud of all time, Lance promised to put Le Mond out of business. Lance kept this promise, and used his influence at Trek to get them to drop Le Mond's bicycles. Le Mond was forced to formally apologize in writing to Armstrong, but Lance was not satisfied with the apology. He continued to push Trek, Trek stopped promoting Le Mond bicycles, and eventually stopped building them.

Lance's influence with Trek cost Le Mond millions, a fact made all the worse because Lance was indeed a fraud, and Greg Le Mond was a genuinely good man. For this reason I will never buy a Trek bicycle, and do not recommend anyone else buy them.

Recently Le Mond began making bikes again, and I hope him the best of success. If you do get one of his older bikes, you will be pleased with it. If you get one of his newer ones, I am sure he would appreciate the business.

Phil_gretz

Exactly this ^. Trek chose the low road and, for that, I will boycott all things Trek/Bontrager until I breathe my last. Shameful what they did.

jamesdak 

Sorta funny how prevalent this mindset is now. Before the truth come out so many people thought Greg was a whiner. Heck. I thought Lance had to be clean. I don't think any one person or company can be thought of as good or bad lately. I think all the top riders doped and still don't believe the sport is clean. Armstrong fooled a lot of people.

WizardOfBoz

So, I have a Schwinn Paramount. Unfortunately, not the one I originally custom ordered (531 DB throughout, a 16" frame, but with more vertical frame angles, because I'm a big guy and the lower compliance was balanced out by my 230lbs). Drunk hit me from behind, crumpled the rear triangle. I sent it back to Schwinn to fix and they were on strike (this would have been in about 1980) . Without checking, Rudy sent me a standard 26" frame of Columbus. Never fit right after that. Too long. Still POed at Rudy for that. Anyway, I'm pretty familiar with how great a good steel frame feels!

Having said that, when I got back into biking about 2 years ago, I ended up with Trek Domane Six Series. Pretty deluxe. The Domane frame (notwithstanding the LeMond-Armstrong issue, on which I'm sympathetic to Greg*) has some built in shock absorption which makes it very comfortable to ride. I have 58cm frame.

So I'm wondering if I want a 58cm or a 61cm Zurich.

Thanks for all the pics and personal experiences - kind of confirms that Greg's bikes were very well conceived, designed, and made.

* I was a grad student in Austin in the early 90s and one of my classmates rode with the club. Interesting gal: very sweet, cute, and seemingly innocent. Put her on a bike and she became a fire-breather. Really hard core. I liked her. Anyway, I recall how much she hated Armstrong from his rides with the club. A completely narcissistic sociopath a*****e. Alas, a lot of people apparently unwisely put their trust in him, and when you put your trust in narcisstic sociopath a*****es, you should expect disaster. Sigh. I don't expect Trek to apologize to Greg, but they should.

jamesdak 

Well, if it helps. I rented a Domane during the summer, put on my wheels and saddle and rode my basic course. I honestly felt that my Tourmelet rode nicer on the beat up chipseal roads. For certain, several of my steel forked bikes are more comfortable on the front end. Now that Domane didn't have the front isolator that some have now so maybe they are better now.

WizardOfBoz

james, I usually ride on a couple of pretty well-paved routes. Apparently, Fabian Cancellara rides his Domane on cobblestones and such! But one reason I'm looking at steel is for the reason you point out: a steel bike will eat up shocks that a CF frame transmits.

jamesdak 

Dude, shhhhh!!!!!!!!!!! Last time I said my steel bikes were more comfortable I was almost shot!! You gotta be careful with those comments of the CF'ers will burn you at the stake!

I honestly wanted the Domane to be all that but when it didn't even match up to the Tourmelet I was surprised. Now I have a whole stable of great riding steel bikes. Most of them very comfortable on the rough roads.

Moe Zhoost

how about this one?

McBTC

Here's a 61:

WizardOfBoz

Even LeMond looks a bit leery about mounting up on that thing, doesn't he?

WizardOfBoz

Nice looking bike. Sorry to get so personal, but if this is your bike and it fits, what's your inseam? How tall are you? And would you consider it mama bear, papa bear, or baby bear (to small, too big, or just right?) in size?

McBTC

6-3... long legs-- I had a 59 Centennial Zurich too, purchased new and loved the red-white and blue (just like the one at the top of the thread); however, the paint job was pretty bad on mine as the blue was soft as butter (white underneath). Ultegra components ran great and the Vector wheelset was actually pretty good. My only issue was my ability to get my knee behind the peddle spindle.

While I owned it I thought the 59 might have been just a tad small. After selling it I still had a fond memory of it and purchased the 61 BA used from private party. Both bikes were factory-made triples although the BA was 105-equipped.

The 61 was a better fit for me especially in as much as I wanted a more relaxed riding posture at the time. Fitting the bike with a shorter and taller Nitto stem was necessary given the 61's longish top tube. One of the Vectors was trashed so I swapped them out with the 105 hub, 32-spoke wheelset for a retro look.

Both bikes rode well and were very lively. The Reynolds 853 may be the best I've experienced; but, not able to match the XL (63") Trek Pilot 5.2 that I also had at that time, which was CF. The Maillot Jaune in the years I knew about were aluminum not steel so I had no interest in them back then...

jamesdak 

You know I'm not so sure about the whole perfect size thing. Each Lemond I show above is a different size. The Tourmelet is a 53, the Ventoux is a 54, the Zurich is a 55 and then the Maillot Jaune is a 56. I just always dial in the right saddle height based off of the center of the BB, then get the aft position right using a set distance between the saddle center and the center of the BB and then I'll source a stem to give me my normal reach and saddle to handlebar drop. Maybe I'm not picky, I don't know? I do no that the saddle position matter greatly to whether or not I have knee pain from my worn out knees. Anyway, just thinking aloud. My speed doesn't vary much bike to bike with all my many bikes. Slow is just slow, LOL!

Lynskeyman

there is no downside to getting an older bike as long as that older bike is not trashed and needing a bunch of parts to get into running condition, those parts may cost more than the bike is worth. so tread carefully when buying an older bike. do a lot of studying on the internet for the kind of bike and components on it or them, and make sure the frame and fork aren't bent or rusting and you should be fine. older bikes can be fun and a good one can be a revelation

McBTC

'01 Lemond BA:

SpookyReverb

Geez. I've seen this bike posted in quite a few different threads lately...

I WISH IT WERE POSTED IN MORE. I love it, it looks so fantastic.

jamesdak 

Glad you like it. Those TSDI folks really knew how to paint a bike. This one has held up pretty well and the Maillot Jaune I jsut picked up is in even better shape.