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Can a bike shop really put a lien against your bike?

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Can a bike shop really put a lien against your bike?

Old 09-25-17, 10:23 PM
  #1  
TreyWestgate
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Can a bike shop really put a lien against your bike?

Today a friend told me that the one bike shop nearby should be avoided because of how the owner will sell people's bikes without question if they were unable to pay for labor or services that were rendered.

The habit of leaving a bike at a shop and coming back later to pay for it is probably a bad habit to be avoided anyway.

I think I heard of stores claiming bikes that were not picked up for very long periods of time. As well as special catalog order bikes that were not picked up. Where the store will then sell them at a reduced price and anyone who wants it must pay that price, even if that is you.

But is a store really allowed to put a lien on your bike where they will claim and sell it to settle a debt?.

Some stores don't allow for payments later on at all.

perhaps this means too bikes can be taken for other owed debts even such as a house payment or the like?.

Say if you dont have a car first?.
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Old 09-25-17, 10:42 PM
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A friend of mine got a really nice titanium Seven, when the guy that dropped it off for an overhaul never picked it up. I think he only paid $1,000 for it and it was worth at least $3,000.
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Old 09-25-17, 10:48 PM
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In most states the answer is yes. But there are rules and procedures to be followed.

There are two issues involved, abandoned property if you don't pickup your bike within a reasonable time, or the equivalent of a mechanics lien, where there money due for services, and you refuse to pay.

These are very different and are generally treated differently, but yes, if you have someone work on your bike, they are generally within their rights rot to release the bike without payment, and if enough time passes without resolution to sell it to recover their labor.
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Old 09-25-17, 10:49 PM
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So... you're asking whether a shop could hold a bike until you pay for the services agreed upon at an agreed upon rate?

Then if you never pay up... what should they do? 30 days? What if you ignore the 30 days and come back in 6 months?

The one thing that I think they need to concentrate on is upfront pricing for services so there are no surprises.

I've never run into those issues because I pay for parts which I walk out of the store with. Pretty simple.
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Old 09-25-17, 11:03 PM
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Originally Posted by CliffordK View Post
So... you're asking whether a shop could hold a bike until you pay for the services agreed upon at an agreed upon rate?

Then if you never pay up... what should they do? 30 days? What if you ignore the 30 days and come back in 6 months?

The one thing that I think they need to concentrate on is upfront pricing for services so there are no surprises.

I've never run into those issues because I pay for parts which I walk out of the store with. Pretty simple.
The bike store here doesn't give a set price in the beginning, many times he says a problem needs attention in other areas as well.

But generally he doesn't give a solid quote.

I dont think he's trying to find extra stuff to charge you for that you dont need, but I'm not sure.
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Old 09-25-17, 11:17 PM
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Originally Posted by TreyWestgate View Post
The bike store here doesn't give a set price in the beginning, many times he says a problem needs attention in other areas as well.

But generally he doesn't give a solid quote.

I dont think he's trying to find extra stuff to charge you for that you dont need, but I'm not sure.
If there's a dispute about unauthorized work that was done, or charges that wasn't agreed to in advance, it generally ends up being negotiated. If folks can't agree most places have a mechanism to resolve the issue, ie. a consumer affairs arbitration process or small claims court. But, in the end, after exhausting the process, the store has the right to sell the bike for charges.

If you're concerned, ask for a written estimate, and write "no additional work without authorization" on it. That will protect you from added charges.
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Old 09-26-17, 12:11 AM
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My LBS has "abandoned" bikes hanging in the back of the service area that have been there for several years. I assume they eventually sell or donate them when they start to run out of space.
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Old 09-26-17, 12:14 AM
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Originally Posted by TreyWestgate View Post
The bike store here doesn't give a set price in the beginning, many times he says a problem needs attention in other areas as well.

But generally he doesn't give a solid quote.

I dont think he's trying to find extra stuff to charge you for that you dont need, but I'm not sure.

If you bring a bike in for a remove-and-replace job like; 'install new tires and swap freewheel' or installing a new (different bend) handle bar, then the scope of labor will be pretty easy to deterimine before hand, and they should be able to give you a quote right there.

OTOH, the diagnose-and-repair jobs are a lot more open ended. A repair ticket for 'chain keeps coming off' could be resolved by a simple limit screw or cable adjustment, or it could mean replacing a crank or shifter pod. None of which you will know until the bike's on the stand.
A scrupulous mechanic/shop will try to remedy the problem in the most cost-effective manner, both in parts and labor hours.

Usually when I drop off a low-value item like a bike or computer, i'll ask the shop to call me if the estimate for the repair will exceed a given dollar amount. That way I can decide for myself, if i want the repair to continue.
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Old 09-26-17, 07:06 AM
  #9  
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With any car or bike I've ever had serviced I've always expected "call me if the price is going to change from the estimate" to be the norm.

If it's a complicated diagnose and repair job, I'm not leaving until the shop gives me a price on the cheapest thing it could be and the most expensive thing they could think of. If the most expensive thing they can think of is still affordable I say "do what it takes" and then usually the actual problem was somewhere in between least and most expensive. But if it ends up being something else entirely and it costs more, they have to call me before I agree to the work.

That's the standard. Anything less than that is entirely unacceptable. If you don't have a clear understand that this is a process at teh shop you are in, walk out and go somewhere else. If you stay, you're the cause of your own problems.

Now I trust both my bike shop and my car place as I've known the managers of both for years. So when they give me the high estimate I don't feel like it's definitely going to be the high price in the end. I know both will only do what's actually needed. But that's good honest service and is the gold standard. (The bike shop I go to is the platinum standard, another step up. If it costs them more to do the work than they estimated, they just charge the estimated price and call it a learning experience for themselves)

Not telling the customer that the price is going to be a lot more than the estimate is entirely unacceptable.

As for the lien for unpaid repairs....that's kind of implied too at the time of drop off. They said "They will cost $200. You said okay. They gave you parts and labor, which have a value of $200. If you don't give them the $200 they get to keep their parts and labor. That's like taking a coffee maker to the cash register at Target and saying you're going to take the coffee maker home but aren't going to give Target $50. It's the same thing.

Last edited by Skipjacks; 09-26-17 at 08:04 AM.
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Old 09-26-17, 07:14 AM
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Two issues: If a shop is unwilling to give you a quote that the repairs will not exceed, that you agree to before work begins, find a new one. Caveat emptor to the person who gives the repair shop a blank work order and a blank check to work with.

Secondly, if you agree to work and then decide you can't/won't pay for whatever reason, I would more than expect the shop to hold your bike. Shops don't have infinite space (or generally, much at all), eventually it will be sold to recoup costs. I know of at least one that will give you a couple days to pick it up after repairs are complete, and then start charging a daily parking rate, to alleviate their space problems. As others have mentioned, most states have laws on the books describing the exact process for taking ownership of abandoned property.

Lastly: stop paying your bills and have court judgments entered against you, and you will likely find that ANY assets with a few exceptions become fair game for payments. Whether most bikes are going to rise to the level of notice by an attorney, I doubt it, but a nice valuable bike may well garner attention, as well a bike that you took a line of credit out against even if it were unsecured.
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Old 09-26-17, 07:26 AM
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Yes why would you think it would be any different? States all have different time frames though. None are immediate and don't allow the owner to profit. You show up to pick up a bike he says that will be $200 and you say that crazy I'll only pay $50 he's not selling the bike the next day for $500 and keeping it all, but they can tack on storage costs if you refuse to pay,

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Old 09-26-17, 07:38 AM
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Originally Posted by TreyWestgate View Post
The habit of leaving a bike at a shop and coming back later to pay for it is probably a bad habit to be avoided anyway.
It has always worked out fine for me. I only use shops that understand that nothing besides what I asked to get done gets done without checking with me first. It's called using interpersonal skills to set parameters up front. I think in this "type, type send" world we live in, I think a lot of people don't know how to deal with others face to face.
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Old 09-26-17, 07:47 AM
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Depends on your relationship with the people in the shop. How well do you know them? How well do they know you? When in doubt I ask them to call me when they have made an estimate. Before doing any more work. Get a verbal agreement ahead of time. This applies to more than a bike; car, motorcycle, plumbing, etc.
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Old 09-26-17, 07:53 AM
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Even if they don't quote you a price everything has to be reasonable. Reasonable means different things to each person but if it gets that far the courts can decide if they were reasonable. As jefnvk posted above pretty much all your belongings can end up in the pot if you quit paying your bills.


Hell in Texas my HOA can take my house if I quit paying HOA dues.
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Old 09-26-17, 08:04 PM
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The shop I was at had a policy for completed repairs not picked up. We documented three phone calls on the repair ticket, after which a registered letter was sent to the address on the ticket. No response after 30 days, the item was sold.
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Old 09-26-17, 08:10 PM
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Originally Posted by thumpism View Post
The shop I was at had a policy for completed repairs not picked up. We documented three phone calls on the repair ticket, after which a registered letter was sent to the address on the ticket. No response after 30 days, the item was sold.
Yep, this is a typical procedure for an "unclaimed" bike. However, if the owner responds and say he wants the bike, except that the charges aren't reasonable, or agreed to it gets more complicated.

Disputed charge cases also have procedures, usually including arbitration or the amount due.
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Old 09-26-17, 09:47 PM
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Originally Posted by FBinNY View Post
Yep, this is a typical procedure for an "unclaimed" bike. However, if the owner responds and say he wants the bike, except that the charges aren't reasonable, or agreed to it gets more complicated.

Disputed charge cases also have procedures, usually including arbitration or the amount due.
I would agree that if the charges are legally disputed, the bike would likely not be able to be disposed of, but in a society where the majority of people ignore debt cases and let them get to the point of a default judgement, I seriously doubt many folks are legally savvy enough to take those proper procedures.
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Old 09-27-17, 06:48 AM
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Fix it yourself.
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Old 09-27-17, 08:17 AM
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I don't know about bike shops specifically, but people not picking up the repair is a problem you really try to avoid. Selling abandoned equipment is a last resort; they aren't trying to make an extra profit on it. It costs money just to store it, and you've got keep track it, keep records, contact people, and all of that costs productivity for no profit gain.

Generally, what I've observed (and done myself) is charge a storage fee after a certain period of time. It's on the work estimate or receipt that you signed and took with you. After enough of that with no payment, your property will be disposed of. No one actually wants to do that, but just continuing to hold it for the (non)customer eventually is unreasonable.
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Old 09-27-17, 08:56 AM
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If the owner didn't have the money to pay for repairs he should never have brought the bike in for repair in the first place. I've worked in a bike shop and we had no space to store a bike for an extended period of time while the owner scraped up the repair costs. I can't remember this happening but I think the store is right. That space is needed either for new bikes to sell or to hold bikes that are in for repair.

+1 to trailangel who said "fix it yourself" if you don't have the money to pay for the bike shop to do it. The shop is a place where owners and workers earn their living and can't be looked at as a charity
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Old 09-27-17, 12:32 PM
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I believe you are asking about what is known as a "Mechanics Lien". The laws vary state by state as to what has to happen to place the lien, how long the lien is valid, and how the disputed amount is settled. In many cases, the shop has to provide a written estimate, or have costs for standard services posted, before they could even file for a lien. For instance, if you dropped your bike off for a tune up, and there was no estimate given, or posted charge for the service, and the shop handed you a bill for $500, they may have a hard time putting a lien on your bike. Again, there are certain things the consumer must abide by as well if they are to have a legal leg to stand on. If you walked into said shop and told them "do whatever it takes" without asking for an estimate, well......
(p.s.: 40+ years in the automotive repair business)
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Old 09-27-17, 12:52 PM
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Originally Posted by wphamilton View Post
Generally, what I've observed (and done myself) is charge a storage fee after a certain period of time. It's on the work estimate or receipt that you signed and took with you. After enough of that with no payment, your property will be disposed of. No one actually wants to do that, but just continuing to hold it for the (non)customer eventually is unreasonable.
I stopped into my local shop today for a part and I asked the owner about this because I find it interesting.

He told me he used to have a problem with people not picking up bikes on time and needed an extra week to pay the repair bills and such. The extra week turned into a month or 2 on a regular basis. He had problems storing the bikes on site and it was a big pain. But people almost always eventually paid him and picked up their bikes.

Then he decided to be a $30 per day storage fee written right on the receipts and repair estimates. It says any bike not picked up within 7 days of you being notified the work was complete will be charged a $30 per day storage fee.

He says he NEVER has to charge that fee. People are scared off by the threat of the fee so they get in there within the 7 days and pay off the repairs and pick up their bikes.

He said occasionally someone just can't afford a repair they said they could afford and he'll try to work with them (payment plan, discount if it's a long time customer, stuff like that) but most people who don't have the money for a repair come up with it anyway just to avoid the $30 per day fee from being added to it.

He said its one of the smartest business moves he's ever made and it doesn't cost him a penny. All he had to do was reprogram his receipt printer to add that line to the store policies at the bottom. Solved all his problems.

He did say that occasionally someone drops a bike off and just disappears. Never comes back. Never returns calls. But that's sort of different. And it doesn't happen often.
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Old 09-27-17, 06:31 PM
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At the shop where I worked, customers had to sign a work order before repairs were done. The work order specified that if the owner failed to pick up his bike within 30 days, it would be disposed of at the shop's discretion. At least a dozen bikes each year were never picked up, and were either sold or given away.
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Old 09-27-17, 07:07 PM
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My LBS will give estimates and given that a lot of their clientele are on tight budgets, they don't exceed them without authorization. But I just drop my bike off telling them what I need and giving them carte blanche to do anything else they think is necessary. I trust them and it has always worked out well.
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Old 09-27-17, 07:16 PM
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Learn to wrench, or learn to pay.

Do you think the store is supposed to not get the money and give you the bike back and hope one day you will show up with money?
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