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Do bikeshare bicycles have to be so heavy?

Old 04-17-18, 08:25 PM
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Originally Posted by CliffordK
I'm not sure "inexpensive" is part of it.

I'm seeing estimates of $1000 to $5000 per bicycle. Plus, a bunch for every bicycle rack spot.

Part of it will be to minimize continuing maintenance, but as the Chinese notes indicate, they won't be entirely maintenance free.

Someone's making a bundle. They are not worth that even with the GPS tracking.
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Old 04-17-18, 09:13 PM
  #27  
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Because aero trumps weight.

Duh.
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Old 04-17-18, 09:53 PM
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I think the making/indicated weights for those bikes is too prevent thieves.
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Old 04-18-18, 03:16 AM
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Originally Posted by _ForceD_
Twice while traveling last year I used bike share program bikes. In Austin, TX, and in Venice Beach, CA. I didn't want to spend the nearly $1000 to rent a road bike, so I figured riding a heavy bike share bike for 20-25 miles is "pedaling" and good enough for a workout. But in each case I got interesting comments from pedestrians that I encountered. In Austin...several miles away from downtown...while waiting at a traffic light...someone said to me "Wow, I've never seen one of those bikes so far away from downtown." In California...I was riding along the Oceanfront path. A group of teenage girls waved me down and asked "Where did you rent that electric bike?"

Dan
Wow, what were the prices quoted for the road bike, and how for long would you have had it for the fee asked?
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Old 04-18-18, 05:31 AM
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They just started bikeshare in Lincoln Ne. I lifted one, and must weight more than my 1950 Roadmaster Rocket.

Last edited by rydabent; 04-20-18 at 10:50 AM.
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Old 04-18-18, 07:00 AM
  #31  
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Originally Posted by spinnaker
Someone's making a bundle. They are not worth that even with the GPS tracking.
If I had to guess, this price is probably for all the bikes plus the stands and the infrastructure and rental terminals and labor. Then someone will break it down and say we get X bikes for $Y total cost, meaning each bike costs us $Z. Doesn't mean the cost of that bike itself is $Z, just that when it is all said and done, that what the project is costing per bike.

Remember, all these stand have power and communications run to them. Many have terminals for credit card processing. All that adds up in a hurry, that is why many companies are trying to migrate to a dockless setup.
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Old 04-18-18, 07:10 AM
  #32  
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Originally Posted by rydabent
The just started bikeshare in Lincoln Ne. I lifted one, and must weight more than my 1950 Roadmaster Rocket.

Do they have bikes out yet in them? I've seen the racks downtown by work--but no bikes in them. As far as bike weight....Look at your typical rider....those things need overbuilt in the extreme for how overweight people are.
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Old 04-18-18, 07:26 AM
  #33  
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Originally Posted by exmechanic89
Wow, what were the prices quoted for the road bike, and how for long would you have had it for the fee asked?
I can't recall exactly, but it was well over $100 for just a few hours. That didn't include the $1500 damage/security deposit on my credit card. Obviously the $1500 would be reimbursed to my card (baring any damages). The bikes the shop rented were higher quality, and I understand they have to protect their investment. This particular shop's rental program was aimed more at long-term rental for events such as multi-day rides. The fee they quoted me was actually for one day, but I really only needed the bike for a few hours. Unfortunately they didn't have an hourly fee. And so the idea of laying down more than $1500 just to ride for a few hours didn't sit well with me.

Dan
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Old 04-18-18, 07:27 AM
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So you want durability?

Raleigh 3 speeds were advertised as "the hundred year bicycle" and from what I have seen that claim is entirely justified. I recently took a 1969 model home to rehab. The paint on the frame was like new. The 3 speed Sturmey Archer worked like new. It still had the original Dunlop tires on it. The wheels are double walled and look like they could be run over by a truck and be unhurt. And it weighed a little over 40 lbs ready to ride. The 3 speed transmission also has replaceable cogs. you can substitute anything from 14 to 24 teeth. With a 24 tooth cog you can go up hill and down with relative ease.
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Old 04-18-18, 07:27 AM
  #35  
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Originally Posted by rydabent
The just started bikeshare in Lincoln Ne. I lifted one, and must weight more than my 1950 Roadmaster Rocket.
I think we've forgotten just how heavy the old bikes were. I lifted a Schwinn Varsity "10-speed" "road bike" a few years ago, and was shocked at how heavy it was.

(And try lifting one of the $100 Target bikes, too!)
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Old 04-18-18, 07:33 AM
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Originally Posted by jefnvk
If I had to guess, this price is probably for all the bikes plus the stands and the infrastructure and rental terminals and labor. ...
All that adds up in a hurry, that is why many companies are trying to migrate to a dockless setup.
The dockless systems are already up and running. Several cities/programs, such as LimeBikes in South Bend, Indiana don't have docks/racks. Apparently the bikes can be tracked via GPS and/or cell network. The 'check out' terminal, and locks are mounted right on the bikes. You just leave the bike wherever you are when you're finished. In fact...they have employees move bikes to certain popular areas to make sure there are always bikes available.

Dan
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Old 04-18-18, 06:11 PM
  #37  
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Originally Posted by jwh20
If you look at the bikes typically used for bike sharing systems, you'll see that these things resemble the kinds of bikes you and I would consider viable bikes only superficially. These are purpose-made to a very different set of criteria and usually include things like built-in locks, radio tracking device and associated battery/charger, a dropped down-tube (i.e. a girly-style) frame, wide sprung seat, and large flat-proof tires. They often also have racks and all sorts of reflectors. Remember that they market these things at city planners not individual bike buyers. Planners are looking for longevity, low-upkeep, long-term reliability, etc. I think they also seem to prefer bizarre looking design vs. traditional bike styles.
Plus the automatic electric 3speed transmission powered by a generator in the crank.
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Old 04-18-18, 06:15 PM
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Originally Posted by tyrion
Bombproof and inexpensive. And I imagine they have lots of gimmicks to make them difficult to cannibalize.
They do. can make a video and link the youtube url here.
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Old 04-18-18, 06:32 PM
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Originally Posted by Dan Burkhart
Well, here's an attempt at rationalizing it.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PgJo7GnGor
I.e. granny gear. Even if you fall you're moving so slow its like a slow-motion fall. I've actually seen this.
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Old 04-18-18, 07:23 PM
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Originally Posted by _ForceD_
I can't recall exactly, but it was well over $100 for just a few hours. That didn't include the $1500 damage/security deposit on my credit card. Obviously the $1500 would be reimbursed to my card (baring any damages). The bikes the shop rented were higher quality, and I understand they have to protect their investment. This particular shop's rental program was aimed more at long-term rental for events such as multi-day rides. The fee they quoted me was actually for one day, but I really only needed the bike for a few hours. Unfortunately they didn't have an hourly fee. And so the idea of laying down more than $1500 just to ride for a few hours didn't sit well with me.

Dan
At those rental prices seems like it would be cheaper to buy an inexpensive bike on CL and just sell it or give it away after you're done.
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Old 04-18-18, 07:25 PM
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Originally Posted by CliffordK
I carry enough cargo, that it is pretty easy to hit 40 lbs of cargo, but one certainly starts noticing it, especially when one hits the hills (they seem to have cut most of the hills out of the rental zone).
That's the key - the bike share bikes are not designed for hilly areas. Most stay in the flat, downtown sections of their metro areas. Even in San Francisco they're generally used along Market Street or the Embarcadero - not up and over the hilly parts of town. On flat ground the weight is far less important. I sometimes tow my 100 lb. boat behind my bike and it only slows me down a little on flat ground (I tow it back after paddling downstream with the current - but riverfront roads are usually pretty flat). But it was a real struggle towing it to a local reservoir with a 1200' climb in the way.
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Old 04-18-18, 07:49 PM
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Just another local government graft scheme.
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Old 04-18-18, 08:03 PM
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Originally Posted by exmechanic89
At those rental prices seems like it would be cheaper to buy an inexpensive bike on CL and just sell it or give it away after you're done.
It probably would. But when you're only going to be in town for two or three days...getting into the whole Craigslist thing just isn't in the cards.

Dan
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Old 04-18-18, 09:38 PM
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A friend is the chief mechanic for our city bike program. The bikes take a lot of abuse, despite the seemingly overbuilt construction. If you watch enough folks riding city bikes around town you realize many are inexperienced cyclists and bash across potholes and curbs, wobbling around and falling quite a bit.

My Globe Carmel, the bike I resumed cycling with in 2015, seems massively overbuilt but at 30-35 lbs it's a lightweight compared with city bikes.

Most folks who work in the docked city bike programs oppose the Lime Bikes and similar dockless bike programs. While dockless is fine in theory, as with all things along the lines of libertarian and anarchic they fail in actual practice due to fallible humans.

While Dallas hasn't yet been overrun like China with dockless bikes, it's already been noted several times on social media that Lime Bikes have been scattered across public egress, blocking ramps for disabled folks, forcing pedestrians to walk into the street around the scattered bikes.

To be pragmatic dockless bikes would work only if deposits, fees and penalties were increased to discourage irresponsible users, and to encourage more responsible usage. Unless that is adopted the dockless system is doomed to fail in the U.S.

Too bad because it's great in theory. I declined to participate in our local city bike program because the 30 minute time limit and lack of docks on my end of town made it infeasible. The city bike system is geared toward the affluent redevelopment of the downtown and near-downtown. It's not intended to supplement public transportation for the folks who live on the outskirts. So I bought my own city bike type of beast of burden. Great for errands and casual rides, but I mostly ride my lighter hybrid and road bikes now.
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Old 04-19-18, 09:53 AM
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I rented a bike in Paris and it was very likely the heaviest bike I have ridden (seatpost looked like galvanized steel pipe) but it wasn't horrible to ride or anything even with just a 2 speed hub. I put quite a few miles riding all over the city at a comfortable pace.

I just assumed it was heavy to take the abuse that rentals get. Riding up curbs, etc...

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Old 04-19-18, 01:37 PM
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Originally Posted by jwh20
If you look at the bikes typically used for bike sharing systems, you'll see that these things resemble the kinds of bikes you and I would consider viable bikes only superficially. These are purpose-made to a very different set of criteria and usually include things like built-in locks, radio tracking device and associated battery/charger, a dropped down-tube (i.e. a girly-style) frame, wide sprung seat, and large flat-proof tires. They often also have racks and all sorts of reflectors. Remember that they market these things at city planners not individual bike buyers. Planners are looking for longevity, low-upkeep, long-term reliability, etc. I think they also seem to prefer bizarre looking design vs. traditional bike styles.
Planners don't get to pick the bikes, as far as I know (planner for 32 years and involved in recent bike share stuff).
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Old 04-19-18, 01:49 PM
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Originally Posted by Ridefreemc
Planners don't get to pick the bikes, as far as I know (planner for 32 years and involved in recent bike share stuff).
Well perhaps "planners" is not the right term, but it's certainly not the users of the service.
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Old 04-19-18, 02:55 PM
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Originally Posted by jwh20
Well perhaps "planners" is not the right term, but it's certainly not the users of the service.
Sorry, I think I was being myopic and maybe a little defensive. We get blamed for a lot that we don’t have a lot of control over (like traffic when you say you are a transportation planner). . The urban planners typically get involved in locations, contracts, etc depending on the size and associates staff of the local government.

I’ve never got inside why the things are so darn heavy though. Maybe the bicycle planners just don’t ride and don’t know the difference. Like the transportation planners putting valley curbs (deep) across each trail (MUP) crossing😳
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Old 04-19-18, 03:09 PM
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Originally Posted by canklecat
A friend is the chief mechanic for our city bike program. The bikes take a lot of abuse, despite the seemingly overbuilt construction. If you watch enough folks riding city bikes around town you realize many are inexperienced cyclists and bash across potholes and curbs, wobbling around and falling quite a bit.

My Globe Carmel, the bike I resumed cycling with in 2015, seems massively overbuilt but at 30-35 lbs it's a lightweight compared with city bikes.

Most folks who work in the docked city bike programs oppose the Lime Bikes and similar dockless bike programs. While dockless is fine in theory, as with all things along the lines of libertarian and anarchic they fail in actual practice due to fallible humans.

While Dallas hasn't yet been overrun like China with dockless bikes, it's already been noted several times on social media that Lime Bikes have been scattered across public egress, blocking ramps for disabled folks, forcing pedestrians to walk into the street around the scattered bikes.

To be pragmatic dockless bikes would work only if deposits, fees and penalties were increased to discourage irresponsible users, and to encourage more responsible usage. Unless that is adopted the dockless system is doomed to fail in the U.S.

Too bad because it's great in theory. I declined to participate in our local city bike program because the 30 minute time limit and lack of docks on my end of town made it infeasible. The city bike system is geared toward the affluent redevelopment of the downtown and near-downtown. It's not intended to supplement public transportation for the folks who live on the outskirts. So I bought my own city bike type of beast of burden. Great for errands and casual rides, but I mostly ride my lighter hybrid and road bikes now.

I would say Dallas is overrun. Although supposedly changes are coming. Humans are going to human though. I don't know how you charge for irresponsibility as nothing is stopping anyone from damaging the bikes or placing them in inappropriate places other than their weight.


Highland Park an affluent part of Dallas put a stop to it pretty quick. They'll scoop up any left overnight and charge a fine to the companies to get them back.
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Old 04-19-18, 09:27 PM
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My carbon road bike without pedals about 17 pounds, so fast, riding on a flat road.
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