I tend to find cyclists pretty much mirror the character of the general population, really nothing more or less.

I haven't met a serious runner who is generally a bad person. Same for serious rowers. Etc., etc., etc., so I am not sure the premise of the OP carries any significance.

Sounds like you just don't like him period.
Using that logic how are YOU able to enjoy anything.
I'm not gonna defend his actions just mine. And I know people are going to hate just to hate.
​​​​​​​
Which brings this post full circle for me and on Topic. People are people, no matter where you go. There's good and bad. Negative and positive. I choose to be the good and mostly positive. I try to live by the golden rule (treat others as you would have them treat you) , and have a rule about Internet posting too, don't post anything you wouldn't say to someone in person.

:roflmao2: Testify!

Well, better at doped cycling than any other doped cyclist. He might not have done as well as other cyclists who didn't respond to the doping as well or have as good a doping program.

Or an undoped Graeme Obree.

I wish "real" cyclists would be nicer to Freds like me. :lol:

I don't hate him, I do hate what he did, especially to his former teammates. And he lied viciously about reporters and other people who were exposing what he was doing.

He proved himself a ruthless, nasty, dishonest bad man. Sorry if you think that just makes him like everyone else. You must really hate humanity.

I now doubt you believe half of what you post.
Perhaps put it in perspective, Just cause the Patriots were caught reading lips, getting opponents game plays and deflating game balls doesn't mean I have to "hate" them.

You don't have to hate Ted Bundy, either. It just might not be something that anyone is going to enjoy talking to you about.

Am I to believe you equate ted bundys actions with LA? Yikes!
In that case ,BTW, I didn't bring him up in the first place.
​​​​​​​LOL

No, you are not to believe that I equate Bundy and Armstrong. But you are equivacating about wrongdoing as if some of it is just acceptable. It might be to you, you'll never lack for people that think doing the wrong thing - especially as policy - is wrong and contemptible.

You're now making assumptions. Here's my take they all did it, he was better. That's what you can assume I think.
It's wrong to punch someone, but if you punch me but believe me I'll punch you back, it's wrong I know, but I'll still do it.

He was a better criminal, not a better athlete. Jesse James had a huge fan club, too.

Well he was a better Cyclist 7 times!
Cards on the table, I loved watching that American win. It was exciting and fun to watch. I didn't follow his actions off the playing field. But boy howdy I loved watching him WIN.
While we're at it, I don't watch every athletes actions off their playing field either. I wouldn't get to watch ANY athletes in any sporting event if cared how they treated other people. I watch a sporting event for that event. A lot of people put LA on a pedestal and got hurt because of it. I Didn't do that. I simply appreciated him whipping ass on the course. In my Paul Harvey voice, "Good day".
I'm out.....clank hummmmmm.

The criminality I'm talking about is cheating. I wouldn't be able to enjoy watching any athlete win by cheating, and I wouldn't enjoy the tainted memory of finding out later. That's why Lance has zero TDF wins.

Fair is fair and unfair is unfair. So that's why there aren't ANY listed winners, they all did it.
I realize I'm being trolled so unless you mention me I'm not responding. And I'll leave you with Mr. Bill Burr saying what it be like.

"Trolled", get over yourself.

A bunch of cheaters competing is fair if everyone knows its fake. Like professional wrestling. Lance is a champion the way Hulk Hogan is.

Please define "ridiculous".

You're not reading what I actually said. You know the expression "it's not the crime, it's the cover up"? He acted as a complete bully when he was on top, absolutely ruthless and immoral going after people who dared cross him. I believe he has gotten away with several felonies outside of the drug crime. Watch the documentary "Stop at Nothing" before you defend this guy further, because comparing what he did to "reading lips" is pretty stupid. Reading lips is hardly on the same level as filing lying and frivolous lawsuits to harass people, slandering them, getting them fired and blacklisted, cynically hiding behind his charity to accuse his critics of being against kids with cancer, and lying repeatedly under oath.
Even he admits he was a bully. So you're defending a criminal bully, and we're trolling you? Go ahead, minimize what he did one more time, you have no credibility.

Last night in Philly a guy riding a bike got into an altercation with a passenger in a car. The cyclist ended up stabbing and killing the passenger. He's still on the loose.

That's an apt comparison. If you study the movie "The Assassination of Jesse James by the Coward Robert Ford," or, better yet, read the novel, it perfectly encompasses the American myth and why we are the way we are. It's among the top ten greatest American works of literature, not only because Ron Hansen is a superb wordsmith but because he put the man, myth and era into context that crosses generations.

For better or worse Lance Armstrong was a prophet in the sense that he presaged the current American milieu of politics, culture and our inevitable and irreconcilable differences.

Like Jesse James, Armstrong was an outlaw among outlaws, who ruthlessly eliminated not only enemies but friends and allies in pursuit of his single minded goal. Both overcame injuries/illnesses that would have killed most men, and it made them hard, fearless and ruthless.

And they've earned at least grudging respect and admiration from some because we recognize a certain honesty in their dishonesty, their ability to shove in our noses the myth of integrity and good guys winning by doing things the right way. And whether we like it or not, a significant number of Americans will always admire outlaws, anarchists, rebels, eccentrics and outliers. They're the ones who stole this country and cobbled it into the glorious mess it is.

We can dislike that reality all we want. Men like that will laugh at our naivete while they're looting the rubes and sheep who cling to lofty ideals. And when it's all done they'll be remembered and regarded well despite their vices because victors dictate history.

***

Livedrklyn Do you perform an analysis on every athletes character before deciding to watch them perform? Why are you so butt hurt about LA. Was he your hero and you were disillusioned? I don't know about his personal attacks and frankly don't care. Why do you? If he bullied adults and they couldn't deal with it that's on them. He could never bully me, as I would never allow it. Not in any way. I don't like bullys and if he bullied people I wouldn't like him either but I didn't read or watch what people said about him and form an opinion, I simply watched him beat other cyclist and I loved it as did all of America. And btw i guess you don't like our president either just cause you think he "acted as a complete bully when he's on top, absolutely ruthless and immoral going after people who dared cross him, I believe he has gotten away with several felonies" how un-American of you sir.
STOP trolling me, no more responses from me.

So if he filed a frivolous law suit against you (like he did with others) you would ignore the complaint and have default judgement entered against you?

I love Bill Burr. Saw him live. And you are correct about one thing: Burr got it right. "The guy was a sociopath on a bicycle."