Go Back  Bike Forums > Bike Forums > General Cycling Discussion
Reload this Page >

Bicycle weight doesn't matter? (myth)

General Cycling Discussion Have a cycling related question or comment that doesn't fit in one of the other specialty forums? Drop on in and post in here! When possible, please select the forum above that most fits your post!

Bicycle weight doesn't matter? (myth)

Old 07-13-18, 07:01 AM
  #76  
livedarklions
Je suis Snap Motomag
 
Join Date: Jun 2018
Location: New England
Posts: 3,823

Bikes: Trek FX 3; 1994 Specialized Allez Pro; "Motobecane" Fantom CX

Mentioned: 26 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1906 Post(s)
Liked 428 Times in 252 Posts
Originally Posted by indyfabz View Post
You can overcome a bike weight disadvantage by inflating the tires with helium.
I tried that, but it just made my bike squeaky.
livedarklions is offline  
Old 07-13-18, 07:03 AM
  #77  
indyfabz
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 22,442
Mentioned: 163 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 8582 Post(s)
Liked 334 Times in 212 Posts
Originally Posted by livedarklions View Post
I tried that, but it just made my bike squeaky.
Helium lube takes care of that. Start a thread asking which is the best helium lube.
indyfabz is offline  
Old 07-13-18, 07:39 AM
  #78  
livedarklions
Je suis Snap Motomag
 
Join Date: Jun 2018
Location: New England
Posts: 3,823

Bikes: Trek FX 3; 1994 Specialized Allez Pro; "Motobecane" Fantom CX

Mentioned: 26 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1906 Post(s)
Liked 428 Times in 252 Posts
Originally Posted by Metieval View Post
I side with Physics on the matter. It takes more energy to move more weight, all else being equal.
You've committed the logical fallacy of begging the question. The point is that "weight doesn't matter" as much as people think because other things are decidedly not being equal. When I've heard the phrase, I've never heard anyone claim it takes the same energy to move a 40 pound bike as it does a 16 pound bike, it's always about gram shaving for people who are not racers or paying great amounts of money just to shave a small number of pounds from the bike, and yeah, I seriously doubt these small fractions would be anything I'd notice even over the long distances I ride.
livedarklions is offline  
Old 07-13-18, 08:14 AM
  #79  
Metieval
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Metieval's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Ohio
Posts: 1,844

Bikes: Road bike, Hybrid, Gravel, Drop bar SS, hard tail MTB

Mentioned: 6 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 661 Post(s)
Liked 4 Times in 4 Posts
Originally Posted by livedarklions View Post
I seriously doubt these small fractions would be anything I'd notice even over the long distances I ride.
haven't noticed, or wouldn't care to notice?

the fact that you say 'doubt' means you haven't ridden both yet so what EXACT experience are you basing your opinion on?
__________________
Dawes SST AL, Cannondale Synapse Alloy 105, Giant Talon 29er, Trek Crossrip Elite,
Metieval is offline  
Old 07-13-18, 08:23 AM
  #80  
Metieval
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Metieval's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Ohio
Posts: 1,844

Bikes: Road bike, Hybrid, Gravel, Drop bar SS, hard tail MTB

Mentioned: 6 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 661 Post(s)
Liked 4 Times in 4 Posts
I find it ironic the number of people thinking that people can just lose body weight.
Are there actually that many fat people?

Speaking of size, we are told " Aero matters", yet you are buying xxl jerseys.

No wonder bike weight doesn't matter, you're pushing a billboard forward at 11 mph.
__________________
Dawes SST AL, Cannondale Synapse Alloy 105, Giant Talon 29er, Trek Crossrip Elite,
Metieval is offline  
Old 07-13-18, 08:31 AM
  #81  
livedarklions
Je suis Snap Motomag
 
Join Date: Jun 2018
Location: New England
Posts: 3,823

Bikes: Trek FX 3; 1994 Specialized Allez Pro; "Motobecane" Fantom CX

Mentioned: 26 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1906 Post(s)
Liked 428 Times in 252 Posts
Originally Posted by Metieval View Post
haven't noticed, or wouldn't care to notice?

the fact that you say 'doubt' means you haven't ridden both yet so what EXACT experience are you basing your opinion on?

Well, I've ridden very heavy bikes long distances in one day, I've ridden bikes that are fifteen pounds lighter further (the difference between 108 miles and 168 miles, to be exact). And obviously, I can tell the difference between fifteen pounds. Duh, I've also varied the loads I'm carrying on those bikes due to the fact that I ride to different locations and by different routes, so the types of equipment and/or the stuff I'm bringing to people varies in weight. And what I can tell you is that over those long rides, a few pounds here and there is really not noticeable, and by far going to be swamped by factors like wind direction, tires, ambient temperature and humidity. Now tell me, where is this magic place where those factors are going to be equal?

And even as to weight, the size and number of water containers is going to have a much larger effect on the overall weight than $1000 difference in the price tag of the bike will buy.
livedarklions is offline  
Old 07-13-18, 08:39 AM
  #82  
Metieval
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Metieval's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Ohio
Posts: 1,844

Bikes: Road bike, Hybrid, Gravel, Drop bar SS, hard tail MTB

Mentioned: 6 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 661 Post(s)
Liked 4 Times in 4 Posts
Originally Posted by livedarklions View Post
Well, I've ridden very heavy bikes long distances in one day, I've ridden bikes that are fifteen pounds lighter further (the difference between 108 miles and 168 miles, to be exact). And obviously, I can tell the difference between fifteen pounds. Duh, I've also varied the loads I'm carrying on those bikes due to the fact that I ride to different locations and by different routes, so the types of equipment and/or the stuff I'm bringing to people varies in weight. And what I can tell you is that over those long rides, a few pounds here and there is really not noticeable, and by far going to be swamped by factors like wind direction, tires, ambient temperature and humidity. Now tell me, where is this magic place where those factors are going to be equal?

And even as to weight, the size and number of water containers is going to have a much larger effect on the overall weight than $1000 difference in the price tag of the bike will buy.
yet.... you typed "you'd doubt...." the first time.

the first time would have been a better time to be straight up?
__________________
Dawes SST AL, Cannondale Synapse Alloy 105, Giant Talon 29er, Trek Crossrip Elite,
Metieval is offline  
Old 07-13-18, 08:52 AM
  #83  
Kontact
Senior Member
 
Kontact's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Posts: 3,619
Mentioned: 32 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2145 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 4 Times in 4 Posts
Originally Posted by Metieval View Post
I find it ironic the number of people thinking that people can just lose body weight.
Are there actually that many fat people?

Speaking of size, we are told " Aero matters", yet you are buying xxl jerseys.

No wonder bike weight doesn't matter, you're pushing a billboard forward at 11 mph.
We are? How many cyclists are buy XXL jerseys? Let's hear more science!
Kontact is offline  
Old 07-13-18, 08:54 AM
  #84  
Metieval
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Metieval's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Ohio
Posts: 1,844

Bikes: Road bike, Hybrid, Gravel, Drop bar SS, hard tail MTB

Mentioned: 6 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 661 Post(s)
Liked 4 Times in 4 Posts
Originally Posted by Kontact View Post
We are? How many cyclists are buy XXL jerseys? Let's hear more science!
apparently 70% of you, science enough?

Obesity Information
__________________
Dawes SST AL, Cannondale Synapse Alloy 105, Giant Talon 29er, Trek Crossrip Elite,
Metieval is offline  
Old 07-13-18, 08:55 AM
  #85  
livedarklions
Je suis Snap Motomag
 
Join Date: Jun 2018
Location: New England
Posts: 3,823

Bikes: Trek FX 3; 1994 Specialized Allez Pro; "Motobecane" Fantom CX

Mentioned: 26 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1906 Post(s)
Liked 428 Times in 252 Posts
Originally Posted by Metieval View Post
I find it ironic the number of people thinking that people can just lose body weight.
Are there actually that many fat people?

Speaking of size, we are told " Aero matters", yet you are buying xxl jerseys.

No wonder bike weight doesn't matter, you're pushing a billboard forward at 11 mph.
Yes, there are lots of fat people (really, the phrase "obesity epidemic" doesn't ring a bell?), and no, you don't have to be fat to have a few pounds to shed.

Aero is a factor, how important it is depends on what kind of riding you're doing. It's like any other factor.

I haven't bought anything XXL since I lost 150 pounds. Who are you talking to?

No I'm not pushing a billboard, but aero isn't my only consideration, which is why I ride a flat bar. At my age, I coudn't maintain an aerodynamically optimum posture for more than a few miles.

I'm not a racer. I like being able to ride 24 mph in the flat at age 57, and being able to pass light-weight road bikes ridden by people half my age on hills. But mostly, I like being able to ride long enough in a day to pick a distant destination for a nice lunch and return. I've got to balance a lot of factors to achieve that, and overall weight of the bike and rider is just one. My fitness level, which I worked very hard to achieve, is by far a much bigger factor.
livedarklions is offline  
Old 07-13-18, 09:10 AM
  #86  
Kontact
Senior Member
 
Kontact's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Posts: 3,619
Mentioned: 32 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2145 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 4 Times in 4 Posts
Originally Posted by Metieval View Post
apparently 70% of you, science enough?

Obesity Information
I don't see anything in there to indicate that the obese are 70% of "us" cyclists. Do you think models and race car drivers are also 70% obese as well?


Did you read this on Prius window sticker?
Kontact is offline  
Old 07-13-18, 09:14 AM
  #87  
Metieval
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Metieval's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Ohio
Posts: 1,844

Bikes: Road bike, Hybrid, Gravel, Drop bar SS, hard tail MTB

Mentioned: 6 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 661 Post(s)
Liked 4 Times in 4 Posts
Originally Posted by Kontact View Post


Did you read this on Prius window sticker?
what I read on the Prius window, was "saving gas, to buy more ammo"

what I read on the Prius window with a bike rack was "saving gas, to buy more food"
__________________
Dawes SST AL, Cannondale Synapse Alloy 105, Giant Talon 29er, Trek Crossrip Elite,
Metieval is offline  
Old 07-13-18, 09:28 AM
  #88  
ph0rk
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2015
Location: Southern Appalachians
Posts: 451

Bikes: A hauler, a commuter, and a steamroller.

Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 15 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by Metieval View Post
I find it ironic the number of people thinking that people can just lose body weight.
Are there actually that many fat people?
You sound sincere.
ph0rk is offline  
Old 07-13-18, 09:34 AM
  #89  
livedarklions
Je suis Snap Motomag
 
Join Date: Jun 2018
Location: New England
Posts: 3,823

Bikes: Trek FX 3; 1994 Specialized Allez Pro; "Motobecane" Fantom CX

Mentioned: 26 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1906 Post(s)
Liked 428 Times in 252 Posts
Originally Posted by Metieval View Post
what I read on the Prius window, was "saving gas, to buy more ammo"

what I read on the Prius window with a bike rack was "saving gas, to buy more food"
Comedy is hard.
livedarklions is offline  
Old 07-13-18, 09:51 AM
  #90  
livedarklions
Je suis Snap Motomag
 
Join Date: Jun 2018
Location: New England
Posts: 3,823

Bikes: Trek FX 3; 1994 Specialized Allez Pro; "Motobecane" Fantom CX

Mentioned: 26 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1906 Post(s)
Liked 428 Times in 252 Posts
Originally Posted by Metieval View Post
yet.... you typed "you'd doubt...." the first time.

the first time would have been a better time to be straight up?

You're not an obsessive troll hanging on my every word at all, are you?

With that, I'm done talking to you ever.
livedarklions is offline  
Old 07-13-18, 09:58 AM
  #91  
Skipjacks
Senior Member
 
Skipjacks's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2017
Location: Mid Atlantic / USA
Posts: 1,933

Bikes: 2017 Specialized Crosstrail / 2013 Trek Crossrip Elite

Mentioned: 39 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 929 Post(s)
Liked 145 Times in 95 Posts
Originally Posted by wphamilton View Post
Has anyone mentioned yet, to answer the OP question, that you're probably going slower on the heavier bike (because it's just not worth the extra effort if the hills and stoplights are slowing you down anyway), and because of the slower speed the calories per mile may be less than they would be on a lighter bike?

For example, I'm likely to be 3-4 mph slower riding to work on my heavy fixed gear commuter than on my lighter road bike, Maybe 30 or 40 watts less. The heavier bike takes less fuel in my case.
The road bike is slightly faster because it's lighter.

It is MUCH faster because it has gearing that allows you to compensate for the terrain better than the fixed gear bike.
Skipjacks is offline  
Old 07-13-18, 10:01 AM
  #92  
Kontact
Senior Member
 
Kontact's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Posts: 3,619
Mentioned: 32 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2145 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 4 Times in 4 Posts
Originally Posted by Metieval View Post
what I read on the Prius window, was "saving gas, to buy more ammo"

what I read on the Prius window with a bike rack was "saving gas, to buy more food"
So how would you rate your thread starting experience?

5 - Really changed some minds
4 - Stimulated interesting discussion
3 - Some folks liked it, some didn't
2 - Caused some discord with controversial idea
1 - Laughed at, ended up lashing out at those meanies
Kontact is offline  
Old 07-13-18, 10:05 AM
  #93  
Metieval
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Metieval's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Ohio
Posts: 1,844

Bikes: Road bike, Hybrid, Gravel, Drop bar SS, hard tail MTB

Mentioned: 6 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 661 Post(s)
Liked 4 Times in 4 Posts
Originally Posted by Kontact View Post
So how would you rate your thread starting experience?

5 - Really changed some minds
4 - Stimulated interesting discussion
3 - Some folks liked it, some didn't
2 - Caused some discord with controversial idea
1 - Laughed at, ended up lashing out at those meanies
6.b It was a filter for my own benefit.
__________________
Dawes SST AL, Cannondale Synapse Alloy 105, Giant Talon 29er, Trek Crossrip Elite,
Metieval is offline  
Old 07-13-18, 10:22 AM
  #94  
livedarklions
Je suis Snap Motomag
 
Join Date: Jun 2018
Location: New England
Posts: 3,823

Bikes: Trek FX 3; 1994 Specialized Allez Pro; "Motobecane" Fantom CX

Mentioned: 26 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1906 Post(s)
Liked 428 Times in 252 Posts
Originally Posted by Kontact View Post
So how would you rate your thread starting experience?

5 - Really changed some minds
4 - Stimulated interesting discussion
3 - Some folks liked it, some didn't
2 - Caused some discord with controversial idea
1 - Laughed at, ended up lashing out at those meanies
Now, in fairness, we were just poking holes in his argument to make it lighter.
livedarklions is offline  
Old 07-13-18, 10:30 AM
  #95  
cyclebycle13
Super WW
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: NY (state)
Posts: 617

Bikes: A really light one and a really heavy one.

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 53 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Ahh, just finished reading the moronathon!
cyclebycle13 is offline  
Old 07-13-18, 10:52 AM
  #96  
livedarklions
Je suis Snap Motomag
 
Join Date: Jun 2018
Location: New England
Posts: 3,823

Bikes: Trek FX 3; 1994 Specialized Allez Pro; "Motobecane" Fantom CX

Mentioned: 26 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1906 Post(s)
Liked 428 Times in 252 Posts
Originally Posted by cyclebycle13 View Post
Ahh, just finished reading the moronathon!
Sucker. You could have just waited for the movie.
livedarklions is offline  
Old 07-13-18, 11:03 AM
  #97  
indyfabz
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 22,442
Mentioned: 163 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 8582 Post(s)
Liked 334 Times in 212 Posts
@cb400bill to the rescue, please.
indyfabz is offline  
Old 07-13-18, 11:04 AM
  #98  
Marcus_Ti 
Frozen Solid.
 
Marcus_Ti's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Lincoln, Nebraska
Posts: 4,667

Bikes: Roadie: Seven Axiom Race Ti w/Chorus 11s. CX/Adventure: Carver Gravel Grinder w/ Di2

Mentioned: 27 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1921 Post(s)
Liked 55 Times in 36 Posts
Originally Posted by cyclebycle13 View Post
Ahh, just finished reading the moronathon!
Hopefully you at least did it on corporate time, you you at least got some remuneration for your wasted time.
Marcus_Ti is offline  
Old 07-13-18, 11:31 AM
  #99  
02Giant 
Home School Valedictorian
 
02Giant's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Iowa
Posts: 2,689

Bikes: 13 Orbea Orca 02 Giant Cypress 88 Mongoose ATB

Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 760 Post(s)
Liked 25 Times in 16 Posts
****!


BTW, the extra weight does matter.
__________________
Excuse me if I, have some place in my mind,
Where I go time to time
02Giant is offline  
Old 07-13-18, 11:37 AM
  #100  
wphamilton
Senior Member
 
wphamilton's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Alpharetta, GA
Posts: 14,550

Bikes: Nashbar Road

Mentioned: 65 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2505 Post(s)
Liked 55 Times in 33 Posts
Originally Posted by Skipjacks View Post
The road bike is slightly faster because it's lighter.

It is MUCH faster because it has gearing that allows you to compensate for the terrain better than the fixed gear bike.
Not so much as you'd think, navigating the terrain is the least of it.

Maybe I didn't express it well, but I'm slower by 3-4 mph because I know that I'm going to be somewhat slower regardless, and because of that I don't try very hard to go fast on the heavy fixed gear. The position factors into it. Gearing factors into it. Weight factors into it. All of these are potentially elements bound up in the "heavy bike". But the end result is, since it IS going to be slower, you don't WANT to push for your top speeds. Consequently, the slower speeds on the heavier bike require LESS fuel per mile than the lighter bike, which you'll be pushing faster through the air.

That's what OP asked, "so how is it that a heavier bicycle won't require more fuel for the given distance?" This is how, not only doesn't require more fuel but likely requires less fuel.
wphamilton is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service

Copyright 2018 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.