General Cycling Discussion Have a cycling related question or comment that doesn't fit in one of the other specialty forums? Drop on in and post in here! When possible, please select the forum above that most fits your post!

Steel is Real.. Explain?

Old 05-20-19, 03:21 PM
  #101  
Trsnrtr
Super Moderator
 
Trsnrtr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Central Illinois
Posts: 16,766

Bikes: Giant Propel, Gianni Motta, Co-Motion Supremo, ICE VTX

Mentioned: 92 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 6190 Post(s)
Liked 55 Times in 40 Posts
Let's keep it civil, please. I know that's a lot to ask in a frame materials thread, but please try.
__________________
Dennis T

Trsnrtr is offline  
Old 05-20-19, 03:25 PM
  #102  
veganbikes
Clark W. Griswold
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: ,location, location
Posts: 5,189

Bikes: Foundry Chilkoot Ti W/Ultegra Di2, Salsa Timberjack Ti, Cinelli Mash Work RandoCross Fun Time Machine, 1x9 XT Parts Hybrid, Co-Motion Cascadia, Specialized Langster, Pink Klein MTB, Phil Wood VeloXS Frame (w/DA 7400), Cilo Road Frame, Proteus frame

Mentioned: 28 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1178 Post(s)
Liked 43 Times in 30 Posts
My 1994 Phil Wood frame made from steel (including fork) is so extremely stiff it is ridiculous. I have trouble getting the correct sized wheel in the drop outs (yes I measured everything and yes I have installed plenty of wheels in semi horizontal drops) I am also equipped with a heavier but very aero toroidal bulge (like a ZIPP wheel) and I don't notice my steel frames to be noodles and I have ridden various different steel frames from Columbus Cromor tubing to Tange Prestige to Reynolds 531 and 753 as well as other stuff from different builders and manufacturers. However my steel frames are certainly more comfortable over long distances than my aluminum or any carbon bikes I have ridden.

Carbon is a fine material and has its place but for me I would rather have a frame built from high quality steel or titanium. If I was a lighter person and valued weight above all else I could easily build a very light steel framed bike without much fuss and I still wouldn't be able to race it in a UCI competition because it would be too light. Going really light is not hard these days and you can even do it avoiding carbon all together.
veganbikes is offline  
Old 05-20-19, 03:48 PM
  #103  
ddeand 
Senior Member
 
ddeand's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Twin Cities
Posts: 687
Mentioned: 10 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 115 Post(s)
Liked 3 Times in 3 Posts
Originally Posted by Lemond1985 View Post
That's a pretty shocking statement, and I find it difficult to believe, but it does make me want to try out the new Cannondales.
I was very surprised, too. Cannondale (or whoever manufactures their frames) has something called the SAVE technique for hydroforming the aluminum frames, and that allows for some forgiveness to be built into the rear triangle. Also keep in mind that the CAADX is running 700x35 tires, so a lot of the forgiveness resides there. When I go for a ride, I am lucky enough to be able to choose between two bikes that feel similar. The main difference is in the 2x11 gearing of the Cídale and the 2x8 setup on the Miyata. It will be interesting to see how my present project rides - a 1974 Raleigh International.
__________________
Some days, it's not even worth gnawing through the restraints.
ddeand is offline  
Old 05-20-19, 03:57 PM
  #104  
Lemond1985
Sophomore Member
 
Lemond1985's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2019
Posts: 1,421
Mentioned: 10 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 791 Post(s)
Liked 150 Times in 108 Posts
The Brits have been building and riding quality bikes much longer than Americans, They were decades ahead of us.

I love my '76 Competition. It was fixie for a while, then a 700x35 gravel bike, and now I'm going for a race setup. Those old Raleighs can do it all, esp with modern componentry. Reynolds 531 rules, FWIW.

Lemond1985 is online now  
Likes For Lemond1985:
Old 05-20-19, 04:23 PM
  #105  
jlaw
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2018
Posts: 640

Bikes: 2015 Spec. AWOL Elite, 2007 Spec. Roubaix Elite, 2003 Spec. Big Hit 2, 1998 VooDoo Zobop, 1985 Trek 410, 1984 Trek 620

Mentioned: 9 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 222 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 35 Times in 21 Posts
Originally Posted by goldensprocket View Post

"So they don't make springs out of aluminum......................
Reminds me of my dream bike.

A bike made out of STEEL... AND made out of SPRINGS!

Will Peter Weigle build this for me?


jlaw is offline  
Likes For jlaw:
Old 05-20-19, 04:33 PM
  #106  
rosefarts
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2015
Posts: 653
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 266 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 43 Times in 15 Posts
Do you remember you mothers home baked cookies? Are they better than the ones in a package at the store? Of course, what was the secret ingredient? Love.

The idea of riding a bike whose frame parts were each chosen for the build and assembled by hand, a project that blurs the line between craftsmanship and art, a ride that invokes the idea of a sweaty Italian man building this bike for me. You're damn right I'm going to love that ride.

Sugar, flour, fat; those cookies at the store aren't much different than the one's mom made.

I'm a recent convert to steel. A common theme among us steel proselytizers is that most of us used to race on much more exotic materials. We've slowed down and matured. My Scandium bike was 16.5lbs in 2003, I sold it to pay for the next ride. My Litespeed was 14lb 15oz in 2006, I sold it for a loss because it rode like ****. I ride a Columbus steel Tallerico with Bayliss geometry. I might like it more each time I ride it. It's a 2002 or 3 and I've only had for 2 years. It still feels new and lively. It's not the "old bike". I've sure waited a long time on top of major climbs for people. 17.75lbs isn't slowing this thing down, well, not anymore than age/children/job have. I've never had something that descends this well. Something about it begs to be ridden. It entices me into the mountains. It dares me to attempt more and more audacious goals. It brings back the love of riding. Is it as fast as the stuff I raced on. Probably not. Is it as fast as a modern Cat 2 worthy bike? Definitely not. Am I in the market for a new road bike? What do you think?
rosefarts is offline  
Likes For rosefarts:
Old 05-20-19, 05:09 PM
  #107  
Rajflyboy
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2018
Posts: 509
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 245 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 28 Times in 26 Posts

Im not into the carbon fiber thing just yet.
Rajflyboy is offline  
Old 05-20-19, 05:46 PM
  #108  
goldensprocket
Banned.
 
Join Date: May 2019
Posts: 24
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 17 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 5 Times in 4 Posts
Originally Posted by Rajflyboy View Post
Im not into the carbon fiber thing just yet.
Carbon mountain bikes have been around since the mid-90s.

Luckily enough for you, while the middle to top tier bikes are mostly carbon fiber these days, some manufacturers still offer aluminum, or steel, frames for budget-conscious people.

(insert youtube video showing carbon frames being whacked with hammers, bare carbon rims being thrashed down stair sets, etc. etc.)
goldensprocket is offline  
Old 05-20-19, 06:29 PM
  #109  
bgross
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 172
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2 Post(s)
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Being a Bear of Very Little Brain, I ride what I love and love what I ride - and thatís steel.

Well, three of four are steel. One tandem is aluminum.




I realize that metal is heavier than CF. But Iím not a competitor so it really doesnít matter.

Rather than spending money on a additional ďlighterĒ bike I lost weight. 30# less in the saddle really makes a difference.




Steel is real for me because itís *my* reality.

Your reality may vary.
bgross is offline  
Old 05-20-19, 06:29 PM
  #110  
Dr.Lou
Senior Member
 
Dr.Lou's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2019
Posts: 139
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 31 Post(s)
Liked 20 Times in 16 Posts
Are most synthetic oils truly synthetic and can I use it on my bike chain?
Dr.Lou is offline  
Old 05-20-19, 06:38 PM
  #111  
jlaw
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2018
Posts: 640

Bikes: 2015 Spec. AWOL Elite, 2007 Spec. Roubaix Elite, 2003 Spec. Big Hit 2, 1998 VooDoo Zobop, 1985 Trek 410, 1984 Trek 620

Mentioned: 9 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 222 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 35 Times in 21 Posts
Originally Posted by Dr.Lou View Post
Are most synthetic oils truly synthetic and can I use it on my bike chain?

But have you tried waxing your chain?


Stop me now.............


jlaw is offline  
Likes For jlaw:
Old 05-20-19, 06:39 PM
  #112  
satrain18
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2018
Posts: 61
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 44 Post(s)
Liked 4 Times in 4 Posts
Originally Posted by mstateglfr View Post
Only if you weigh no more than 150-160 lbs. To a heavier person, it's like riding a wet noodle.
I am 240# and havent found riding steel frame and fork bikes to be like riding a wet noodle. This goes for traditional diameter tubing and OS tubing. I own a lot of steel road, gravel, and touring bikes that are from the 80s, 90s, and present. I am 6'5 too, so the diamond frames are large too, which doesnt help things.


We all ride differently though. Perhaps my output isnt close to yours. Just saying that weight neednt be a reason to not ride a steel frame bike.[/QUOTE]

http://pardo.net/bike/pic/fail-001/FAIL-036.html
http://pardo.net/bike/pic/fail-001/FAIL-025.html
http://pardo.net/bike/pic/fail-001/FAIL-041.html
http://pardo.net/bike/pic/fail-001/FAIL-063.html
http://pardo.net/bike/pic/fail-001/FAIL-068.html
http://pardo.net/bike/pic/fail-001/FAIL-079.html
http://pardo.net/bike/pic/fail-001/FAIL-085.html
http://pardo.net/bike/pic/fail-001/FAIL-147.html
http://pardo.net/bike/pic/fail-001/FAIL-153.html
http://pardo.net/bike/pic/fail-001/FAIL-157.html
http://pardo.net/bike/pic/fail-001/FAIL-179.html
http://pardo.net/bike/pic/fail-001/FAIL-193.html
http://pardo.net/bike/pic/fail-001/FAIL-194.html
satrain18 is offline  
Likes For satrain18:
Old 05-20-19, 06:40 PM
  #113  
jlaw
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2018
Posts: 640

Bikes: 2015 Spec. AWOL Elite, 2007 Spec. Roubaix Elite, 2003 Spec. Big Hit 2, 1998 VooDoo Zobop, 1985 Trek 410, 1984 Trek 620

Mentioned: 9 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 222 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 35 Times in 21 Posts
Originally Posted by rosefarts View Post
Do you remember you mothers home baked cookies? Are they better than the ones in a package at the store? Of course, what was the secret ingredient? Love.
The guy at the Trek factory who welded my 410 and my 620 in the mid-1980's must have had lots of his Mom's cookies. I'm still feelin' the love 35 years later!
jlaw is offline  
Likes For jlaw:
Old 05-20-19, 06:56 PM
  #114  
mstateglfr 
Sunshine
 
mstateglfr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: Des Moines, IA
Posts: 8,272

Bikes: '87 Schwinn Prelude, Black Mountain Cycles Monstercross V4, '89 Novara/Centurion Ironman, '18 Diamondback Syncr, '18 handmade steel roadbike

Mentioned: 76 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2968 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 147 Times in 105 Posts
Huh?

Not sure what the point of all this was. A lot of effort on your part for a lot of confusion on my part.
mstateglfr is offline  
Old 05-20-19, 07:09 PM
  #115  
Gresp15C
Senior Member
 
Gresp15C's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Posts: 2,629
Mentioned: 16 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 634 Post(s)
Liked 39 Times in 32 Posts
For building up bikes from old parts, a steel frame is more forgiving of adjusting the rear triangle spacing and correcting alignment issues. Practically any halfway decent lugged road frame will continue to have a use, even after most of its other parts have been trashed, so there are a certain number of us who are always looking out for those frames. Granted, that's a pretty small niche. For a newer mainstream bike that I don't expect to modify, I'd have no problem with a wider range of frame materials.
Gresp15C is offline  
Old 05-20-19, 07:16 PM
  #116  
Loose Chain
Senior Member
 
Loose Chain's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: USA
Posts: 1,930

Bikes: 84 Pinarello Trevisio, 86 Guerciotti SLX, 96 Specialized Stumpjumper, 2010 Surly Cross Check, 88 Centurion Prestige, 73 Raleigh Sports, GT Force, Bridgestone MB4

Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 215 Post(s)
Liked 17 Times in 14 Posts
Originally Posted by Juggy_Gales View Post
Ok I keep hearing and seeing quotes about "Steel is Real".

What is with the fascination? I am assuming it is related to steel framed bikes.. but why is this the thing now?

Im not mocking steel bikes.. they are robust.. very rugged.. But aren't they a bit heavy too?
With everyone trying to be light and go carbon.. Im seeing so much "Steel is Real"
I remember when LPs were replaced by CDs. And guess what is back and what is not?
Loose Chain is offline  
Old 05-20-19, 07:17 PM
  #117  
Koyote
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2017
Posts: 734
Mentioned: 13 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 403 Post(s)
Liked 116 Times in 65 Posts
Originally Posted by wolfchild View Post
The reason it's real is because it can be welded or brazed.into a strong durable structure which will last for a very long time...Carbon is just a bunch of plastic held together with some epoxy and it's weak and fragile.
Iím a carbon-based life form, and Iím still going strong after 56+ years. Iím pretty sure my carbon-based bike frame is strong enough.
Koyote is offline  
Likes For Koyote:
Old 05-20-19, 07:41 PM
  #118  
Kapusta
Cyclochondriac
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Posts: 2,163
Mentioned: 18 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 906 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 49 Times in 38 Posts
Carbon fiber asplodes. I seen it. Nuthiní left but scraps of Lycra and white socks.
Kapusta is offline  
Likes For Kapusta:
Old 05-20-19, 07:51 PM
  #119  
livedarklions
Je suis Snap Motomag
 
Join Date: Jun 2018
Location: New England
Posts: 3,834

Bikes: Trek FX 3; 1994 Specialized Allez Pro; "Motobecane" Fantom CX

Mentioned: 26 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1925 Post(s)
Liked 444 Times in 264 Posts
Originally Posted by wolfchild View Post
I sprayed some rust proofing oil inside my steel frames because I ride all year round in all weather conditions...Cro- moly steel is pretty rust resistant and will last a very long time even without rustproofing. I've never seen a steel bicycle rust out.
Mine are doing a lot better once I stopped storing salt in the seat tubes.
livedarklions is offline  
Old 05-20-19, 07:52 PM
  #120  
FiftySix
where's the gas tank?
 
FiftySix's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2019
Location: S.E. Texas
Posts: 473

Bikes: Norco Cityglide, Schwinn Jaguar, Schwinn Willy

Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 225 Post(s)
Liked 97 Times in 75 Posts
Originally Posted by Loose Chain View Post
I remember when LPs were replaced by CDs. And guess what is back and what is not?
Makes me think of the 21st century vinyl owners finding out they're allergic to their own vinyl collection. Sad.
FiftySix is offline  
Old 05-20-19, 07:54 PM
  #121  
FiftySix
where's the gas tank?
 
FiftySix's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2019
Location: S.E. Texas
Posts: 473

Bikes: Norco Cityglide, Schwinn Jaguar, Schwinn Willy

Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 225 Post(s)
Liked 97 Times in 75 Posts
Originally Posted by jlaw View Post
Reminds me of my dream bike.

A bike made out of STEEL... AND made out of SPRINGS!

Will Peter Weigle build this for me?


So rigid. So light.
FiftySix is offline  
Old 05-20-19, 07:59 PM
  #122  
livedarklions
Je suis Snap Motomag
 
Join Date: Jun 2018
Location: New England
Posts: 3,834

Bikes: Trek FX 3; 1994 Specialized Allez Pro; "Motobecane" Fantom CX

Mentioned: 26 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1925 Post(s)
Liked 444 Times in 264 Posts
By the way, chocolate is inherently better than vanilla. Anyone who prefers vanilla is a moron.

and one point of information -- if you really don't want an assplosion, avoid mannitol ice cream and candy.
livedarklions is offline  
Old 05-20-19, 08:23 PM
  #123  
bcpriess
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2016
Posts: 243

Bikes: Masi Giramondo, Trek 830 monstercross build, Raleigh Gran Sport, Lemond Tourmalet

Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 103 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 6 Times in 1 Post
You get a lot of bang for your buck with steel, IMO. All things being equal, I think they are a more compliant ride than other materials, and way less expensive than cf. I still drool over bikes like the cutthroat, but I am also perfectly happy doing most of my riding on 26 to 30 pound bikes and having an extra$2k in my pocket. Any deficiency in my riding I chalk up to my fitness level, and until I can generate 1000w at the drop of a hat, I have no practical need for anything fancier than butted cromo.
bcpriess is offline  
Old 05-20-19, 08:36 PM
  #124  
Loose Chain
Senior Member
 
Loose Chain's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: USA
Posts: 1,930

Bikes: 84 Pinarello Trevisio, 86 Guerciotti SLX, 96 Specialized Stumpjumper, 2010 Surly Cross Check, 88 Centurion Prestige, 73 Raleigh Sports, GT Force, Bridgestone MB4

Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 215 Post(s)
Liked 17 Times in 14 Posts
Originally Posted by FiftySix View Post
Makes me think of the 21st century vinyl owners finding out they're allergic to their own vinyl collection. Sad.
No, that is the black mold growing on LPs stored in wet basements!
Loose Chain is offline  
Likes For Loose Chain:
Old 05-20-19, 08:49 PM
  #125  
cyccommute 
Mad bike riding scientist
 
cyccommute's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Denver, CO
Posts: 21,291

Bikes: Some silver ones, a red one, an orange one and a few titanium ones

Mentioned: 92 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2472 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 103 Times in 70 Posts
Originally Posted by Machka View Post
Now? It's been the thing for decades.

If you do a Google search on "steel is real" quote, the first result up is dated 2005.
And that date is fairly recent. Aluminum became the dominate frame material in the mid90s. People have been saying ďsteel is realĒ since at least then. It may even date from the mid80s when Cannondale and Klein started using aluminum as a new fangled material.
__________________
Stuart Black
Pokin' around the Poconos A cold ride around Lake Erie
Dinosaurs in Colorado A mountain bike guide to the Purgatory Canyon dinosaur trackway
Solo Without Pie. The search for pie in the Midwest.
Picking the Scablands. Washington and Oregon, 2005. Pie and spiders on the Columbia River!
Days of Wineless Roads. Bed and Breakfasting along the KATY
Twisting Down the Alley. Misadventures in tornado alley.
An Good Ol' Fashion Appalachian Butt Whoopin'.
cyccommute is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service

Copyright © 2018 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.