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Ultimate Stream Pepper Spray

Old 03-12-20, 05:57 PM
  #51  
DeadGrandpa
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Originally Posted by alcjphil View Post
It is because we don't feel any need to admit people into our country who carry weapons. I am sure that you are also asked if you are bringing firearms into Canada. Someone on a fishing trip has no need of them
Do you mean that one may not carry bear spray, for self defense against bears?
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Old 03-12-20, 06:20 PM
  #52  
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Originally Posted by DeadGrandpa View Post
Do you mean that one may not carry bear spray, for self defense against bears?
Maybe, before you come into Canada on a fishing trip, you should look into whether you need military grade pepper spray. Bear spray is available here where you might need it
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Old 03-12-20, 06:58 PM
  #53  
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Originally Posted by alcjphil View Post
Maybe, before you come into Canada on a fishing trip, you should look into whether you need military grade pepper spray. Bear spray is available here where you might need it
I only carry bear spray, for defense against civilian dogs and bears. Haven't seen the need for military grade. Btw, how does Canada feel about military grade aluminum on Ford 150s? Oh, never mind. I drive a steel body Tundra.
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Old 03-12-20, 07:13 PM
  #54  
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Originally Posted by Milton Keynes View Post
I've got some homemade Carolina Reaper hot sauce that comes pretty close... If only I had some way to squirt it into an attacker's eyes.
How about a water pistol?

Cheers
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Old 03-12-20, 07:17 PM
  #55  
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Originally Posted by OldTryGuy View Post
The GEL disperses much less in windy conditions and my 380 even less.
Talking about guns will get this thread closed.

Cheers
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Old 03-12-20, 07:21 PM
  #56  
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Originally Posted by mjac View Post
Don't know about Canada. Maybe you can get someone in the Staes to get it for you and mail it to you. I would say get it from the Company but for some reason parts of their website are under construction. A better product description actually exists on Amazon.
It'll get confiscated at the border in Customs.

Just for fun, what do you do if your assailants are wearing googles or come at you from two different directions? Never mind as I don'r really care. It must be awful riding where such fear for one's personal safety is so great

Cheers
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Old 03-12-20, 07:33 PM
  #57  
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Originally Posted by Miele Man View Post
It'll get confiscated at the border in Customs.

Just for fun, what do you do if your assailants are wearing googles or come at you from two different directions? Never mind as I don'r really care. It must be awful riding where such fear for one's personal safety is so great

Cheers
Like I care what you care about. That is my situation, you deal with it. That is life.
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Old 03-12-20, 09:19 PM
  #58  
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So first things first in self defense if you are carrying some form of weapon you need to train on using it safely and correctly and be able to handle yourself in a high stress situation. Unfortunately a lot of folks have weapons and they think well I will know what to do when I need to and you don't. Pepper spray is not a joke and is not just a toy you can pull out when you want. You actually need to know how to use it, when and where to use it and how to handle yourself before you use it. You could hurt yourself and unintended targets. If you are dead set on buying it then find a safe space to train with it and learn how to use it and potentially use it on yourself (or have a trusted friend use it on you) so you know what you are doing to someone. These so called "Less Lethal" weapons can actually be quite lethal and even worse in untrained hands.

I know for pepper spray Sabre does training and they also make inert products for police (but you might be able to get some for personal training?) https://www.sabrered.com/personal-safety-training. Also you might find others doing self defense training and that can be rather invaluable.

If I am on a bike I would just plan to exfil the area quickly rather than hanging around trying to pull out pepper spray or a gun or whatever you might have. If you feel you are going to be in an unsafe area know ways out know ways around and know potential safe zones and always be spatially aware in any situation.
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Old 03-12-20, 10:09 PM
  #59  
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Self defense decisions and choices should always feel intrusive and carry the weight of conscience. Actions taken in the heat of the moment can have permanent consequences, all around.

I survived enough fights and worse when I was younger. Nowadays I prefer avoidance and just walking away whenever possible.

Falling is a big risk. Some dogs that are normally good tempered can suddenly turn violent when they sense fear, pain or smell blood.

I do carry pepper spray for dogs but haven't needed it. I regard every dog as free range and likely to run directly into my path, so as long as I can see the dog I'm always prepared. Most dogs are just goofballs and lose interest quickly. Usually I'll stop when they chase me. So far that's always ended their interest in me.

In my area deer and pickup trucks are bigger hazards than dogs.
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Old 03-12-20, 10:44 PM
  #60  
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Originally Posted by alcjphil View Post
Maybe, before you come into Canada on a fishing trip, you should look into whether you need military grade pepper spray. Bear spray is available here where you might need it
Originally Posted by mjac View Post
Don't know about Canada. Maybe you can get someone in the Staes to get it for you and mail it to you. I would say get it from the Company but for some reason parts of their website are under construction. A better product description actually exists on Amazon.
The law surrounding the use of pepper spray is a bit murky in Canada. First of all, if the product is purchased for personal protection and is not specifically labelled as bear spray or for animal use then would be considered a prohibited weapon. Both Canadian Tire and MEC sells bear spray but MEC makes you sign a waiver and one must be over the age of 18 to purchase. I believe the only authorities who have the legal right to carry pepper spray are law enforcement and mail carriers.

This is where the ruling become somewhat sketchy. You could still be charged with concealing a prohibited weapon by simply carrying it on your person or in a purse particularly in an area where there are no bears. Mace which has a higher level of capsicum is definitely considered off limits.

That being said, I suspect that its use could depend on the circumstances one faces such as vicious dogs.
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Old 03-12-20, 10:44 PM
  #61  
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Originally Posted by veganbikes View Post
So first things first in self defense if you are carrying some form of weapon you need to train on using it safely and correctly and be able to handle yourself in a high stress situation. Unfortunately a lot of folks have weapons and they think well I will know what to do when I need to and you don't. Pepper spray is not a joke and is not just a toy you can pull out when you want. You actually need to know how to use it, when and where to use it and how to handle yourself before you use it. You could hurt yourself and unintended targets. If you are dead set on buying it then find a safe space to train with it and learn how to use it and potentially use it on yourself (or have a trusted friend use it on you) so you know what you are doing to someone. These so called "Less Lethal" weapons can actually be quite lethal and even worse in untrained hands.

I know for pepper spray Sabre does training and they also make inert products for police (but you might be able to get some for personal training?) https://www.sabrered.com/personal-safety-training. Also you might find others doing self defense training and that can be rather invaluable.

If I am on a bike I would just plan to exfil the area quickly rather than hanging around trying to pull out pepper spray or a gun or whatever you might have. If you feel you are going to be in an unsafe area know ways out know ways around and know potential safe zones and always be spatially aware in any situation.
I think we worry too much about what "might" happen when a honest person arms himself with some type of defensive weapon and not enough about what the criminal element does to honest people. There is nothing untoward about defending yourself, it is a right granted by your founding document and no reason to be self conscious about it. As you say though, I have reconciled the carry of this extremely powerful stream spray by considering it an absolutely last resort when every other option is exhausted.

Fox Labs also offers self defense classes that if like everything else they do should be very professional. They supply the military, LEOs, the Secret Service, the prison system, on and on.
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Old 03-12-20, 10:48 PM
  #62  
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Originally Posted by Batstar View Post
The law surrounding the use of pepper spray is a bit murky in Canada. First of all, if the product is purchased for personal protection and is not specifically labelled as bear spray or for animal use then would be considered a prohibited weapon. Both Canadian Tire and MEC sells bear spray but MEC makes you sign a waiver and one must be over the age of 18 to purchase. I believe the only authorities who have the legal right to carry pepper spray are law enforcement and mail carriers.

This is where the ruling become somewhat sketchy. You could still be charged with concealing a prohibited weapon by simply carrying it on your person or in a purse particularly in an area where there are no bears. Mace which has a higher level of capsicum is definitely considered off limits.

That being said, I suspect that its use could depend on the circumstances one faces such as vicious dogs.
It seems Canada is the Polar Opposite of the United States when it comes to arming yourself.
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Old 03-13-20, 12:03 AM
  #63  
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Generally speaking, yes. There are a lot more restrictions here.

Planning on crossing the border into Canada? Leave behind anything that could be classified as prohibited such as expandable batons, stun guns, switchblades, etc… Oh yea, that knuckle duster that’s been lying around in your glove compartment for years…that too.

Acquiring that can of Ultimate Spray through the mail could also result in charges of importing a prohibited weapon if it was discovered by the CBSA.
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Old 03-13-20, 01:12 AM
  #64  
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In the aftermath of a violent confrontation where someone gets killed or seriously injured, the truth may prove to be an ephemeral concept. Establishing who was or was not exercising reasonable self defense measures and who was or was not using excessive force, even who was or was not the original aggressor, it's not likely to be slam dunk easy.
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Old 03-13-20, 03:26 AM
  #65  
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The only time that I would carry pepper spray is if I was riding through bear territory or some rural area with a lot of aggressive stray dogs.... I would never carry pepper spray in urban areas because the legal consequences aren't worth it. If you used pepper spray for self defense against another person you would still get charged for carrying illegal weapon and using excessive force....In a worst case scenario I could use my bike lock as a self defense weapon.
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Old 03-13-20, 03:41 AM
  #66  
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Originally Posted by mjac View Post
I will not be a victim, trust me.
If you don't want to be a victim then you need to practise situational awareness and avoid situations which have a potential to turn violent. Even if you were successful in using a pepper spray to defend yourself against another person you would still end up being a victim of your legal system. The legal system will do everything they can to get you charged with using excessive force and carrying a restricted weapon. In this day and age avoidance is the best weapon.
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Old 03-13-20, 07:15 AM
  #67  
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Originally Posted by Miele Man View Post
How about a water pistol?

Cheers
It's slightly chunky. Despite using a high-speed Ninja food processor, I've never been able to get my hot sauce to the smooth consistency as what you buy commercially.

That reminds me, it's about time to start planting pepper seeds again. I think I'm just going to do habaneros this year. I make a pretty tasty mango/pineapple/habanero sauce which will knock your socks off. It's really good on tacos.
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Old 03-13-20, 07:25 AM
  #68  
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Originally Posted by terrafirma View Post

The non-lethal option is right for me. Might be more dangerous here in North Idaho to tell someone you just shot their dog compared to leaving the dog sneezing and keeping on riding.
I have ridden in Idaho several times. As recently as last year. I can vouch for ^^this^^.

In any event...This thread has not failed to disappoint.
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Old 03-13-20, 07:56 AM
  #69  
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Originally Posted by wolfchild View Post
If you don't want to be a victim then you need to practise situational awareness and avoid situations which have a potential to turn violent. Even if you were successful in using a pepper spray to defend yourself against another person you would still end up being a victim of your legal system. The legal system will do everything they can to get you charged with using excessive force and carrying a restricted weapon. In this day and age avoidance is the best weapon.
I could not agree with you more. As a matter of fact I was reluctant to even use this very effective defensive weapon because I thought it might discourage me from doing everything that you suggested.Every single incident that has happened on the bike path, and some were significant,was avoidable if I had listened to my instincts. I saw the situation developing but let my positive attitude about human nature interfere. If I stayed keen and listened to my instincts, virtually all situations should be able to be avoidable. As you say, exceptional situational awareness is more important then any defensive weapon you can carry. Which is why I did not want to carry one. I did not want to diminish that just because I had a weapon and I thought it would. So I reconciled all of that on my second ride carrying the spray in my pocket and mounted it and a cell phone on the bike in a fixed position. Still do everything humanely possible to avoid or prevent any altercation or confrontation, but when all of your sincere efforts fail, this 5.3 Million Scoval Heat Units Heavy Stream Pepper Spray and the cell phone are the last resort. That is why I wanted the best and waited until I knew what was the best. Because it is going to be used as a last resort and it has got to work. I am so intent on having a last resort to prevent being a victim of crime I am going CC. But for right now, it is the Fox Labs Heavy Stream Pepper Spray on the bike and in public. In the truck it is a more lethal weapon because in this state you are allowed to carry inside your vehicle as an extension of your home. I will be prepared for any possible last resort.I, or anyone around me, will not be the victim of a crime,trust me.

Last edited by mjac; 03-13-20 at 08:32 AM.
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Old 03-13-20, 08:25 AM
  #70  
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Originally Posted by Milton Keynes View Post
It's slightly chunky. Despite using a high-speed Ninja food processor, I've never been able to get my hot sauce to the smooth consistency as what you buy commercially.

That reminds me, it's about time to start planting pepper seeds again. I think I'm just going to do habaneros this year. I make a pretty tasty mango/pineapple/habanero sauce which will knock your socks off. It's really good on tacos.
Strain or filter out those chunks and/or thick parts?

A strong Tabasco sauce solution in a water pistol?

Cheers
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Old 03-13-20, 08:53 AM
  #71  
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Probably the most important thing you can do before carrying a self defense weapon is spend some time with a good criminal defense attorney. In the event you do use force, just because you and your attorney believe your use of force was justified doesn't mean the police and state prosecutors will agree.
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Old 03-13-20, 09:03 AM
  #72  
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Originally Posted by Milton Keynes View Post
It's slightly chunky. Despite using a high-speed Ninja food processor, I've never been able to get my hot sauce to the smooth consistency as what you buy commercially.

That reminds me, it's about time to start planting pepper seeds again. I think I'm just going to do habaneros this year. I make a pretty tasty mango/pineapple/habanero sauce which will knock your socks off. It's really good on tacos.
If all your efforts to implement your pepper sauce fail, just choot em.

mango/ pineapple/habanero...now we are getting somewhere.
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Old 03-13-20, 09:12 AM
  #73  
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Originally Posted by indyfabz View Post
I have ridden in Idaho several times. As recently as last year. I can vouch for ^^this^^.

In any event...This thread has not failed to disappoint.
After reading all of your comments I have decided to heed your advice and practice with this pepper spray device. I was going to ask IndyFabs if he would like to volunteer. Please say yes.
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Old 03-13-20, 09:30 AM
  #74  
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Originally Posted by desconhecido View Post
In the aftermath of a violent confrontation where someone gets killed or seriously injured, the truth may prove to be an ephemeral concept. Establishing who was or was not exercising reasonable self defense measures and who was or was not using excessive force, even who was or was not the original aggressor, it's not likely to be slam dunk easy.
Originally Posted by desconhecido View Post
Probably the most important thing you can do before carrying a self defense weapon is spend some time with a good criminal defense attorney. In the event you do use force, just because you and your attorney believe your use of force was justified doesn't mean the police and state prosecutors will agree.
Let's also look at the other side of the equation, not just that side. I have personally seen the aftermath of crime on its victims, we are talking wheelchairs, suicides, disfigurement, the grief and emotional stress of losing someone, the consequences you describe pale in comparison to what I have seen with my own eyes and experienced. That is not going to happen to me and if I can do anything about it, it is not going to happen to anyone in my vicinity whether I know them or not. I will do my best to exercise discipline to avoid the repercussions you described and I have seen these repercussions play out but if it becomes a choice of being the victim of a crime it is not going to happen. I will take my chances with the system as much as I distrust it. Because the alternative is much,much worse. I have seen it.
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Old 03-13-20, 10:26 AM
  #75  
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Originally Posted by mjac View Post
After reading all of your comments I have decided to heed your advice and practice with this pepper spray device. I was going to ask IndyFabs if he would like to volunteer. Please say yes.
Highly inappropriate comment. I suggest you re-think your path.
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