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I find it amazing what advertising can condition people to accept

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I find it amazing what advertising can condition people to accept

Old 08-20-20, 08:51 PM
  #151  
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Old 08-20-20, 11:41 PM
  #152  
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Things are progressing nicely ......
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Old 08-21-20, 04:16 AM
  #153  
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I would like to point out the fact that some people in this thread have been making fun of old age ... respect old age guys, even if older people think differently, there is always something to learn from them..especially when, deep inside, you know you're wrong.
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Old 08-21-20, 05:12 AM
  #154  
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I worked in metal manufacturing for 40 years so I can tell quality welds in steel and aluminum, the advertising does not influence me in my decision. As for some woman making 40 cents an hour loading frame parts, every manufacturer is going overseas and is doing something similar to this. I do not like it but no alternative for me to buy a bike unless I can get someone in the west to hand make one.
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Old 08-21-20, 05:34 AM
  #155  
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I'm willing to accept the OP's argument that evil advertising can mesmerize Americans into buying crap.

As exhibit A, I introduce the Fiat 500.

[mic drop]
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Old 08-21-20, 06:28 AM
  #156  
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Originally Posted by shelbyfv View Post
Parts of Nebraska are very attractive. I especially like the Sandhills. And don't forget Carhenge.
I just read this post, and realized that I am wearing my Carhenge souvenir ball cap.
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Old 08-21-20, 07:18 AM
  #157  
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Originally Posted by rydabent View Post
I you read any of the famous cycling books from the 80s and before, they call any bike frame butt welded low class junk. But in the nearly 40 years since then advertising has conditioned cyclist to accept butt welded frames instead of beautiful lugged and low temp brazed frames. The simple reason for that is that now computers run robot welding machines, and frame mfg can make more money that way. Robots can churn out butt welded frames 24 hours a day. It is the same with CF frames. Again frame mfg in china can have some poor chinese woman lay up CF frames for 40 cents an hour. Then advertising has conditioned cyclist to be in awe of CF (plastic frames) and have have cyclist pay thousand of dollars for them.

Another example of how mfg advertising influence people was with the "need" for ever increasing number of gears on the rear sprocket. Cyclist JUST HAD to have the latest and largest number of gears, or they would be just old fashion Freds!!! Then all of a sudden WHIP LASH mfg now want you to buy the "new" one by gear trains.

As I say it is amazing how advertising can lead so many around by the nose.
Try to look at this from a different angle. What if the advertising industry tuned in on recumbents? Yeah. A few schneaky commercials and we’d all be riding them. Maybe?
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Old 08-21-20, 07:31 AM
  #158  
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Originally Posted by Phil_gretz View Post
I'm willing to accept the OP's argument that evil advertising can mesmerize Americans into buying crap.

As exhibit A, I introduce the Fiat 500.

[mic drop]
That mic was made in china. I wouldn't drop it like that.
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Old 08-21-20, 08:46 AM
  #159  
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Originally Posted by HD3andMe View Post
Many folks don't see spending years as a copier repairman and ending up being trapped in Nebraska as the American dream.

Just like many folks don't pine for the days of brifters and six speed cassettes.

It's broader experiences and different goals that you seem to not be able to understand here.
BTW Lincoln has a little over 130 miles of scenic hard surface bike trails. They are pretty much interconnected so you can string together almost any length of a circle route you would like to ride.
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Old 08-21-20, 10:09 AM
  #160  
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Having spent lots of time in Lincoln itís clearly not as idyllic as OP makes it seem. My in-laws have had stuff happen near their house and itís just like any city of similar size. Im not going to say itís a terrible place and Iím biased, but my wife (a native Nebraskan) and I enjoy New England far more than the Midwest in terms of cultural richness, nature (beaches, mountains, forests vs vast fields of corn) and quality of education. And the so called bike trails are often glorified sidewalks so I wouldnít say their bike infrastructure is all that great. Plenty of gravel roads though as I saw doing 150miles there last year for gravel worlds
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Old 08-21-20, 10:11 AM
  #161  
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Originally Posted by HD3andMe View Post
Yes, it would really suck to be trapped there in Flatasapanckaeistan, as I noted above.

I'll take thousands and thousand of miles trails and roads around here any day of the week:



p.s. we also ride year round rather than being trapped inside during the Winter, as you have admitted you are.
its funny though, the gravel roads outside of the city arenít pancake flat, over 150miles I had 12k ft of climbing, lots of rolling hills
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Old 08-21-20, 10:35 AM
  #162  
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Originally Posted by HD3andMe View Post
Yes, it would really suck to be trapped there in Flatasapanckaeistan, as I noted above.

I'll take thousands and thousand of miles trails and roads around here any day of the week:



p.s. we also ride year round rather than being trapped inside during the Winter, as you have admitted you are.

Oooh, you failed on correctly spelling Lincoln's nickname.
As for Nebraska being flat, it isnt. Same with Iowa and Kansas- they have that reputation, but they arent. There arent any mountains, but there are seemingly endless ways for me to get 50-70' of climb per mile and routes to get more too, if thats a goal. Nebraska can easily make you climb more than that per mile.

As for your pic, what town is that? I cant see much thru the haze and even if it were clear, i wouldnt know one random town of 20K from a random town of 60K.
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Old 08-21-20, 10:44 AM
  #163  
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Kansas abuts Colorado, and western Kansas is Not a Nebraska-flat cornfield ( )I have never ridden Nebraska, but I hear it has some great scenery .... they keep it in a 100-square-foot enclave in the middle of the state, so people who want to see it have to drive through hundreds of miles of flat.

Just kidding, working on you Nebraskites a bit. But the point about year-round riding rings loudly. I bet the cross-country skiing is great, though.
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Old 08-21-20, 10:50 AM
  #164  
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Originally Posted by mstateglfr View Post
There arent any mountains, but there are seemingly endless ways for me to get 50-70' of climb per mile and routes to get more too, if thats a goal. Nebraska can easily make you climb more than that per mile.
In most places, 50-70 feet per mile is referred to as a "false flat." Where I live, we just call that flat, period.
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Old 08-21-20, 11:03 AM
  #165  
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Originally Posted by tomato coupe View Post
In most places, 50-70 feet per mile is referred to as a "false flat." Where I live, we just call that flat, period.
I understand. When I climb 3000' of a 40mi ride, I often tell my GPS that its wrong and I actually did no climbing at all.
That makes perfect sense and is quite reasonable.***
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Old 08-21-20, 11:04 AM
  #166  
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Originally Posted by rydabent View Post
In 1960 I was on a Navy base near SF. It was an up scale city that most sailors dressed up a little to go there on liberty. Now we see pictures of a guy taking a dump at the curb right next to an out door cafe. Pelosi and the democrats have about destroyed that city. Who in their right mind would consider taking their family there on vacation.

I would. In fact, my wife and I went there for our honeymoon in 2016. We spent a week in the Tenderloin neighborhood in a cheap, non-corporate motel, and we loved every minute of it. We walked to every other neighborhood we wanted to see (Mission, Castro, HA, North Beach, etc), and the only time we used a car was when we drove out to wine country for the day (checked out a Zipcar for that trip). It was actually really amazing to see that city on foot in late September. We weren't expecting the wide range of weather we got during that week, going from low-60s and overcast to upper-80s and sunny, but it just added to the fun we were having.


We saw plenty of homeless people, for sure, but I've seen homelessness in every major city I've ever visited (NYC, Chicago, Houston, San Diego, Atlanta, Bangkok, etc). Staying in the Tenderloin, we were actually at the epicenter of where SF's homeless people gather, because there is/was a large concentration of services offered to them in that area. There was a group with a trailer full of shower stalls that was helping the people stay clean (their sign said they come out 2-3 times per week, IIRC), there was a group handing out food, and there was another group offering basic wellness check-ups. It was actually nice to know there are organizations giving aid to those who are in need, even if it's not fixing the root of the problem.


Based on my prior experience and the current news about the city, I would have zero problem taking my family back there (post-pandemic, of course). Your assertion that nobody wants to go there is kind of silly.
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Old 08-21-20, 11:06 AM
  #167  
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Originally Posted by HD3andMe View Post
SF East Bay with Clayton, CA in the foreground and Concord, CA in the background.

Taken from Mount Olympia, which is the bump on the far left in this photo.
Very cool. Back years ago, when I went to college my parents moved out to half moon bay. Each visit 'home' was me spending days exploring up and down the coast and further inland mostly by car, a little by bike.
Damn fun time as its scenic view after scenic view.
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Old 08-21-20, 11:13 AM
  #168  
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Originally Posted by BoraxKid View Post
I would. In fact, my wife and I went there for our honeymoon in 2016. We spent a week in the Tenderloin neighborhood in a cheap, non-corporate motel, and we loved every minute of it. We walked to every other neighborhood we wanted to see (Mission, Castro, HA, North Beach, etc), and the only time we used a car was when we drove out to wine country for the day (checked out a Zipcar for that trip). It was actually really amazing to see that city on foot in late September. We weren't expecting the wide range of weather we got during that week, going from low-60s and overcast to upper-80s and sunny, but it just added to the fun we were having.


We saw plenty of homeless people, for sure, but I've seen homelessness in every major city I've ever visited (NYC, Chicago, Houston, San Diego, Atlanta, Bangkok, etc). Staying in the Tenderloin, we were actually at the epicenter of where SF's homeless people gather, because there is/was a large concentration of services offered to them in that area. There was a group with a trailer full of shower stalls that was helping the people stay clean (their sign said they come out 2-3 times per week, IIRC), there was a group handing out food, and there was another group offering basic wellness check-ups. It was actually nice to know there are organizations giving aid to those who are in need, even if it's not fixing the root of the problem.


Based on my prior experience and the current news about the city, I would have zero problem taking my family back there (post-pandemic, of course). Your assertion that nobody wants to go there is kind of silly.
"Nobody goes there anymore. It's too crowded."

There's a reason that over 7 million people live in the greater Bay Area, and fewer than 2 million live in all of Nebraska.
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Old 08-21-20, 11:30 AM
  #169  
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Originally Posted by mstateglfr View Post
I understand. When I climb 3000' of a 40mi ride, I often tell my GPS that its wrong and I actually did no climbing at all.
That makes perfect sense and is quite reasonable.***
Not to weigh in too much on the silliest argument ever ("What is flat?"), but what the hell, why not.

To me, it really is how it's distributed, I don't think I'd even notice 70 feet per mile, especially if there was an equal descent. But if the 3000 feet were concentrated in a relatively small part of the route, then it would feel ljke I climbed somewhat.

My rides are always loops so the ascents and descents have to cancel each out mathematically. If it's a consistent 1-2% grade either way, that's not going to feel like significant climbing to me. I grew up in Minnesota, there were some good hills, but you had to deliberately ride to them.
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Old 08-21-20, 11:32 AM
  #170  
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Originally Posted by mstateglfr View Post
I understand. When I climb 3000' of a 40mi ride, I often tell my GPS that its wrong and I actually did no climbing at all.
That makes perfect sense and is quite reasonable.***
Don't worry, that whole line of reasoning from people equates to some mental self gratification based on where they live. "Oh, I live in mountains and thus have REAL elevation". You know what, that kind of talk can sod off. Sticking their nose up in the air like it matters. Or like being from somewhere is some achievement.

Sure 40 feet over an ENTIRE mile is pretty flat. So is 70. Over an entire mile. That's not how the planet is shaped. Around here, those 70 feet come all within 1/8 mile. Then it's flat again. Then you go down. So, a ride might be 60 feet per mile averaged over the ENTIRE ride. But pretty much 75% of that elevation is gained over only 10% of the distance of that ride. Meaning..............not flat.

The TdF "flat, middle mountain (hilly), high mountain" stage names are all over the place. I pulled up a few lists from Wiki and found a few full TdF routes on Ridwithgps. Some of the hilly routes are anywhere from 70ft per mile avg to 100ft per mile avg.

So, the Tour de France deems 70 feet per mile "hilly"............that's good enough for me. Sure, it's not mountainous. But that ain't flat. The flat stages appeared to be around 40 to 70 feet per mile. Final stage is about 50ft per mile avg.
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Old 08-21-20, 12:29 PM
  #171  
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I'm new around here and this thread is quite a blend of funny, weird, silly, and informative.
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Old 08-21-20, 01:49 PM
  #172  
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Originally Posted by diggida View Post
I'm new around here and this thread is quite a blend of funny, weird, silly, and informative.
One can get a lot of solid advice about purchasing, maintaining, riding, and equipping a bike here .... and hear some good stories about rides .... but to me, the best threads are these ridiculous, rambling, fact-free illogical vacations through the hinterland of silliness. Sometimes they go on for many, many pages, with maybe one percent of the posters having read more than ten percent of the posts .... sort of colorful benign tumors which ceaselessly amaze with the absurd twists and false interpretations and sheer inanity.

You want to understand this site? Post a really obscure Monty Python references and see how many people respond. These are people who deeply appreciate the art of the pointlessly silly.
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Old 08-21-20, 01:58 PM
  #173  
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Originally Posted by Maelochs View Post
One can get a lot of solid advice about purchasing, maintaining, riding, and equipping a bike here .... and hear some good stories about rides .... but to me, the best threads are these ridiculous, rambling, fact-free illogical vacations through the hinterland of silliness. Sometimes they go on for many, many pages, with maybe one percent of the posters having read more than ten percent of the posts .... sort of colorful benign tumors which ceaselessly amaze with the absurd twists and false interpretations and sheer inanity.

You want to understand this site? Post a really obscure Monty Python references and see how many people respond. These are people who deeply appreciate the art of the pointlessly silly.
"Cruel, but fair ...", Maelochs, "cruel, but fair".
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Old 08-21-20, 01:59 PM
  #174  
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Originally Posted by diggida View Post
I'm new around here and this thread is quite a blend of funny, weird, silly, and informative.
As long as things stay silly, and don't get nasty (there's been a bit of that in this thread), it's all good.
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Old 08-21-20, 04:16 PM
  #175  
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"Dinsdale?"
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