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Honest opinion piece on disc brakes

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Honest opinion piece on disc brakes

Old 02-17-21, 08:31 AM
  #126  
badger1
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Originally Posted by Dan Burkhart View Post
As I read this, I can hear the hinterland whos who theme in the background. Only those of us from Canada and of a certain age would get that I think.
Got it in one!

Had both that Cdn. institution and David Attenborough in mind.

Last edited by badger1; 02-17-21 at 11:20 AM. Reason: Appalling copy edit error.
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Old 02-17-21, 09:45 AM
  #127  
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Originally Posted by blacknbluebikes View Post
Am I drinking alone here, or is everyone else downing a few?
All my bikes are rim brake. But the premise that the bike industry changed to disc to sell more bikes is ridiculous. Every industry employs new technology that is typically embraced by many and rejected by few.

Auto keyless entry is great, but if you do water sports it is a royal pain. No one is going to take a fob along and paddle out. Thankfully I have a chip key.

John
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Old 02-17-21, 09:52 AM
  #128  
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Originally Posted by Germany_chris View Post

The Dead Milkmen had a a great song in the '80s that sums this thread up nice "Takin' R****ds to the Zoo"
Death Rides a Pale Cow. R.I.P. Dave Blood. I saw them play at a frat before they released their first album in Ď85.

Saw Electric Love Muffin at the same frat and some DJ named Jazzy Jeff (before he became famous).

Those were the days.

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Old 02-17-21, 10:00 AM
  #129  
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Originally Posted by 70sSanO View Post
Auto keyless entry is great, but if you do water sports it is a royal pain. No one is going to take a fob along and paddle out. Thankfully I have a chip key.

John
Wet fobs are a thing of the past when stowed in a waterproof case/bag that is attached to a QDC lanyard. That modern keyless entry tech just created jobs for another market...
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Old 02-17-21, 10:02 AM
  #130  
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Originally Posted by 70sSanO View Post
All my bikes are rim brake. But the premise that the bike industry changed to disc to sell more bikes is ridiculous. Every industry employs new technology that is typically embraced by many and rejected by few.

Auto keyless entry is great, but if you do water sports it is a royal pain. No one is going to take a fob along and paddle out. Thankfully I have a chip key.

John
I agree that the industry changing to disc brakes was not to sell more bikes. In any industry the more of any one thing you make, causes the price to go down because of economies of scale. They saw the demand for a better braking system, and they responded. It is now cheaper for them to sell all disc brake bikes than it is to sell both rim brakes and disc brakes. Pure and simple.

Last edited by rydabent; 02-18-21 at 10:03 AM.
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Old 02-17-21, 04:38 PM
  #131  
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Originally Posted by 70sSanO View Post
All my bikes are rim brake. But the premise that the bike industry changed to disc to sell more bikes is ridiculous.
Of course that's ridiculous. Rather, the bike industry sold in the whole wide rim, fat tire thing, leading to selling more disc brakes.
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Old 02-17-21, 04:54 PM
  #132  
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Past 6 years since I've joined the Bike Forums, could always tell we are in middle of winter. Not by looking out the window, or seeing my bike on the trainer, but by the same arguments over every winter.

It's hilarious, each time, it started out with one thought and balloons into many different subjects.

Very entertaining! Thanks all!
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Old 02-17-21, 06:05 PM
  #133  
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Originally Posted by travbikeman View Post
Past 6 years since I've joined the Bike Forums, could always tell we are in middle of winter. Not by looking out the window, or seeing my bike on the trainer, but by the same arguments over every winter.

It's hilarious, each time, it started out with one thought and balloons into many different subjects.

Very entertaining! Thanks all!
Lol! At least itís not a knock down drag out battle over Rene Herse. Maybe we can do that next month, before temps start to rise.

John
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Old 02-17-21, 07:02 PM
  #134  
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Originally Posted by 70sSanO View Post
All my bikes are rim brake. But the premise that the bike industry changed to disc to sell more bikes is ridiculous. Every industry employs new technology that is typically embraced by many and rejected by few.
Isn't the goal of employing new technology that will be embraced by many to sell more product?
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Old 02-17-21, 08:08 PM
  #135  
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The goal of any business is to make money; i.e profit. Developing and selling new products are designed by nature to generate more sales and more profit and ultimately market share along the way.

The Suntour vs Shimano saga of the late 80’s and 90’s was an example of new products that were embraced by the consumer and resulted in profitable product lines and the demise of Suntour as a competitor.

This market share allowed for such developments as rapid rise rear derailleurs. These were not well received by consumers and the evidence is a Shimano product design that has been completely ignored by third party manufactures. If there were any redeeming qualities Microshift or others would have incorporated that design.

So yes while it is the goal, embracing that technology is another question. If disc brakes were in the same category as rapid rise derailleurs, people would dismiss disc brakes and continue to use rim brakes, in the same way as top normal rear derailleurs, and the people at Mavic would be dancing in the streets.

John
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Old 02-17-21, 08:13 PM
  #136  
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137 posts and still no link to the "honest opinion piece" that inspired this thread? Hmm ... I just remembered, I recently read a really truly absolutely positively so-help-me-god objective article that states:

Every single racer on the world tour, except Chris Froome, thinks rim brakes are for poopy heads.
That should settle it ...
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Old 02-22-21, 12:10 PM
  #137  
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Originally Posted by Bigbus View Post
I'm fine with rim brakes on my road bikes, but I could never go back to rim brakes on my MTB. That's just nonsense! People will get out of my way if I can't stop fast enough, trees don't budge.
Totally agree. Where/how I ride, rim brakes are fine for my road bikes. My road rides are mostly flat and relatively dry, so I don't personally see the advantage. However, they are indispensable on my mountain bike.
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Old 02-22-21, 12:33 PM
  #138  
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All bicycle brakes are disc brakes.
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Old 02-22-21, 01:03 PM
  #139  
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I didn't read all 6 pages of this thread (apologies in advance) but I'll add one reason to the 'plus' column for disc brakes.
Specifically for those of us who aren't pros or otherwise sponsored with free new wheels/bikes/components (aka 97% of those on BF) and those of us who don't have the sort of disposable income to replace or otherwise buy new wheels on a regular basis. Disc brakes are great because the wear & tear is between the pad and rotor, not the rim. I realize replacing disc pads and rotors isn't free, but it's a hell of a lot more cost effective (and easier) than replacing a worn out rim. Especially if one likes to ride fancy carbon wheels.
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Old 02-22-21, 01:09 PM
  #140  
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I have 6 bikes & 8 sets of wheels. Most are interchangeable. Woe is me to convert.
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Old 02-23-21, 05:32 AM
  #141  
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Agreed. After 55 years of riding, moved to thru and discs at age 67, now 72, will never go back. They are just that good whether hydraulic or mechanical. MHO
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Old 02-23-21, 06:18 AM
  #142  
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Originally Posted by coffeesnob View Post
rim brakes stop you quicker. at least with what I compare the with
I have several bikes with Campy rim brakes, one from the 70's and one that is about 10 years old. Aluminum rims on bike from 70's, Zipp carbon on newer bike. All tuned up properly they work very very well except for the carbon wheels in the rain. At that point the braking effectiveness goes way way down. About 3 years ago I was making twisty steepish descent (14%) in heavy rain and got pretty spooked when I started to accelerate on the descent. Despite pulling on the brake levers so hard I was sure I was going to break a cable or the lever, I sped up from only 13-14 mph to over 20 which doesn't sound like much but the fact I was accelerating and not decelerating made me sure at the time I was going down. Managed to keep my line for the turn at the bottom of the hill and got it back under control when the hill started to go back up. Whew.

The next year I purchased a Giant Defy Advanced with cable operated disk brakes. Incredible improvement over the Campy brakes and this is with a relatively cheap set of disks brakes. My mountain bike with hydraulic disks is even better, by a lot.
I've ridden (and raced a bit back in the day) for 50 years and with the exception of the scary rain incident, caliper brakes have served me well. However, there is no question in my mind that disks are simply superior and I would never buy a new bike without them. YMMV

Tim
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Old 02-23-21, 11:26 AM
  #143  
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Originally Posted by bOsscO View Post
I didn't read all 6 pages of this thread (apologies in advance) but I'll add one reason to the 'plus' column for disc brakes.
Specifically for those of us who aren't pros or otherwise sponsored with free new wheels/bikes/components (aka 97% of those on BF) and those of us who don't have the sort of disposable income to replace or otherwise buy new wheels on a regular basis. Disc brakes are great because the wear & tear is between the pad and rotor, not the rim. I realize replacing disc pads and rotors isn't free, but it's a hell of a lot more cost effective (and easier) than replacing a worn out rim. Especially if one likes to ride fancy carbon wheels.
Very true. Whole disc brakes systems can be bought for less than $100. CF rims alone seem to sell for around $350. Then there is the cost of rebuilding the wheel set.
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Old 02-23-21, 03:28 PM
  #144  
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Originally Posted by phughes View Post
"Why should I wax my chain? It isn't hairy. "

Maybe it needs a bike-ini wax for the Summer
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Old 02-23-21, 06:30 PM
  #145  
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I recall seeing as a kid a front wheel brake on easy going town bikes that was a rubber pad pressing on the tire from above, like in this picture of bike made in 1900. But it was not anything antique like this one, also the mechanism was 'more modern' than this, it was still made in 1960s in Europe. Talk about easy maintenance, adjustability, in my books that beats any rim or disk brake anyday. I bet you that is still used in rural China today.



=================================================================
And honestly, who need this $%^&*
New to disc brakes

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Old 02-23-21, 11:06 PM
  #146  
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Originally Posted by vane171 View Post
I recall seeing as a kid a front wheel brake on easy going town bikes that was a rubber pad pressing on the tire from above, like in this picture of bike made in 1900. But it was not anything antique like this one, also the mechanism was 'more modern' than this, it was still made in 1960s in Europe. Talk about easy maintenance, adjustability, in my books that beats any rim or disk brake anyday. I bet you that is still used in rural China today.
Some people will argue it is superior to both disc brakes and rim brakes, because the diameter is bigger.
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Old 02-23-21, 11:38 PM
  #147  
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Honest opinion piece on disc brakes

I ride a Thorn Mercury with a Rohloff hub and Thorn supplied this bike with a BB7 disc brake on the rear so as to not have to re-rim the Rohloff too frequently and on the front I have an XT V brake (rim brake.)

Much is said about far better modulation with a disc brake which may well be the case with hydros but I find the modulation easier on my front V brake than on the rear BB7.

At my age (1942 model) I am unlikely to ever go back to a derailleur bike but if I did it would be with electronic shifting, it is a no brainer but last time I looked it seemed about 20% more expensive than a Rohloff.

Mike
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Old 02-24-21, 01:04 PM
  #148  
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Originally Posted by 70sSanO View Post
The goal of any business is to make money; i.e profit. Developing and selling new products are designed by nature to generate more sales and more profit and ultimately market share along the way.

The Suntour vs Shimano saga of the late 80ís and 90ís was an example of new products that were embraced by the consumer and resulted in profitable product lines and the demise of Suntour as a competitor.

This market share allowed for such developments as rapid rise rear derailleurs. These were not well received by consumers and the evidence is a Shimano product design that has been completely ignored by third party manufactures. If there were any redeeming qualities Microshift or others would have incorporated that design.

So yes while it is the goal, embracing that technology is another question. If disc brakes were in the same category as rapid rise derailleurs, people would dismiss disc brakes and continue to use rim brakes, in the same way as top normal rear derailleurs, and the people at Mavic would be dancing in the streets.

John
I used to run Rapid Rise XTR on my mountain bikes. I loved it, but not many others did so it went the way of the do do bird. As for disk brakes, I started running disk brakes around 2010 on my mountain bikes and I will NEVER go back. I bought my first road/CX/gravel bike with disk brakes in 2017 and I will NEVER go back. That was my CAADX and it has cable actuated disks and it still better than rim brakes in any condition. I put in over 10,000 miles a year for the past 20+ years, so I've experienced all of the different variations of rim brakes.
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Old 02-24-21, 02:59 PM
  #149  
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Originally Posted by Snotrub View Post
I used to run Rapid Rise XTR on my mountain bikes. I loved it, but not many others did so it went the way of the do do bird. As for disk brakes, I started running disk brakes around 2010 on my mountain bikes and I will NEVER go back. I bought my first road/CX/gravel bike with disk brakes in 2017 and I will NEVER go back. That was my CAADX and it has cable actuated disks and it still better than rim brakes in any condition. I put in over 10,000 miles a year for the past 20+ years, so I've experienced all of the different variations of rim brakes.
Don’t tell anyone, but I still run Rapid Rise (760 & 960) even with a 40t and a RoadLink. I will say that it is important to be able to ease off make good downshifts and not just force the chain over under high stress. With a top normal people can just use the cable to force it over, for better or worse.

John

Edit added: But I’m not running disc brakes. My parents couldn’t afford to send me to a good school when I was a kid.
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Old 02-24-21, 05:08 PM
  #150  
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Originally Posted by phughes View Post
I hope you are going to share the popcorn, this thread will be interesting...
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