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Pedestrians are Strange

Old 05-13-21, 09:39 PM
  #26  
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[QUOTE=UCantTouchThis;22058505
But common sense says that if there is cyclist heading your way, and a car that could kill the cyclist, the jogger should be considerate enough to step aside as he is the one going against traffic and can make things easier on all. I know what I talking about, just not giving privileges to joggers, they need to think follow the system. I ride my bike, I do as traffic does and don't go head on with anyone that has the right of way.
.[/QUOTE]

Wow, I would hate to live where you do; that there’s so much traffic that bikes and cars and runners are constantly having to make thre-way passes all the time.

I think some of the issue here comes from the concept of who has right-of-way. Generally, it flows ‘down hill’ bikes give room to foot traffic, cars should give room to bikes, and everyone gets where they’re going with a minimum of drama and disruption.

I get that there’s an expectation by some cyclists that bike lanes are for the exclusive use of bikes, but yelling at runners in the bike lane isn’t any different from car drivers yelling at cyclists to ‘get off the road “

Bike lanes are few and far between where I live, so we all have to use the same pavement. Seems to work ok. Any road that has enough traffic to need a bike lane, isn’t somewhere I’d want to go running, anyhow.
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Old 05-13-21, 11:00 PM
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Originally Posted by Ironfish653 View Post
Wow, I would hate to live where you do; that there’s so much traffic that bikes and cars and runners are constantly having to make thre-way passes all the time.

I think some of the issue here comes from the concept of who has right-of-way. Generally, it flows ‘down hill’ bikes give room to foot traffic, cars should give room to bikes, and everyone gets where they’re going with a minimum of drama and disruption.

I get that there’s an expectation by some cyclists that bike lanes are for the exclusive use of bikes, but yelling at runners in the bike lane isn’t any different from car drivers yelling at cyclists to ‘get off the road “

Bike lanes are few and far between where I live, so we all have to use the same pavement. Seems to work ok. Any road that has enough traffic to need a bike lane, isn’t somewhere I’d want to go running, anyhow.

Wow, you sure like to twist things. Yes, there are roads where cars, joggers and cyclists meet VERY often. There are tons of cyclists in So California if you did not know that. There are heavily traveled roads by vehicles, cyclists and plenty of walkers and joggers with awesome trails along the side of the road of which they choose not to use. Rancho Cucamonga would be one place, Wilson Ave would be one of those places right next to a high school. Have you ever been to California? Have you ridden in the traffic in Cali?

Again, if I am riding on the shoulder, bike lane or not, cars traveling at 50 MPH behind me, and there is a jogger in my path, and a nice sidewalk, trail, or any kind of escape, I'm waving my hand at the jogger to move to the safe spot so that I do not get hit from behind.

We all know the game, if they don't move, they're just being obnoxious.

FTR, my ride tonight, I was in the bike lane along side a park, 2 joggers together, one in the bike lane, the other on the sidewalk. They saw me coming in the pitch black of night as I had good lighting. The guy on in the bike lane hopped up onto the curb as he should have. Very considerate and safe for all of us. I appreciate that! Had he stayed in my path for no reason, I would consider him obnoxious. Just as I would a cyclist climbing our local mtn roads taking the lane at 10 MPH with 3 or 4 cars behind him. I'm talking a 20 mile climb. Blocking traffic for no reason. He could show a little consideration as we all should if we affect the flow of safe travel.
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Old 05-14-21, 12:05 AM
  #28  
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Originally Posted by caloso View Post
Former and still occasional runner here: Asphalt is more forgiving than concrete. Makes a big difference on the joints. Sidewalks tend to be less even--driveway cutouts and tree root heaves, for example. If a runner is coming towards you, it means that they're running against traffic, which is correct. What I'll do is check over my shoulder, move into the lane, and carry on.
True, but isn't the purpose of running against traffic so that you see oncoming traffic and take maneuvers to avoid a collision? Like moving closer to the curb so the cyclist doesn't have to go quite as wide (especially noting that, at least where I live, cycling in a bike lane is legal whereas running/walking in one is not)?

Most of the time I will just check for traffic and go around, but sometimes if I think the person is being an oblivious imbecile or just outright rude I will come to a complete stop in the middle of the lane and wait. Now it's their move. They usually look confused for a second and then move over a bit to get around me. At least it made them think.
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Old 05-14-21, 12:16 AM
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Originally Posted by dmanthree View Post
Like I said, the sidewalk in this case is wide, smooth, and really nice. No excuse for the runners to be in the BIKE LANE.
It's not just a matter of how smooth it is. Apparently asphalt is softer to the impact, enough that it makes a difference to the knees. I have no idea if this is true or not, but it's apparently the reason runners prefer asphalt. Still I agree with you that they should be aware they they are the ones bending the rules and as such should be courteous to those they are inhibiting.

This thread reminds me of Westlake Village where there are usually more runners in the street than on the sidewalk going around the lake, and many of them are spoiled and don't care who they're impeding. I actually once got scolded by a lady who was walking all the way on the line between the bike lane and the motor vehicle lane because I had the nerve to pass her in the 12' of space between her and the curb (8' parking lane + 4' bike lane).
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Old 05-14-21, 08:27 AM
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Originally Posted by urbanknight View Post
It's not just a matter of how smooth it is. Apparently asphalt is softer to the impact, enough that it makes a difference to the knees. I have no idea if this is true or not, but it's apparently the reason runners prefer asphalt. Still I agree with you that they should be aware they they are the ones bending the rules and as such should be courteous to those they are inhibiting.

This thread reminds me of Westlake Village where there are usually more runners in the street than on the sidewalk going around the lake, and many of them are spoiled and don't care who they're impeding. I actually once got scolded by a lady who was walking all the way on the line between the bike lane and the motor vehicle lane because I had the nerve to pass her in the 12' of space between her and the curb (8' parking lane + 4' bike lane).
[[b]emphasis mine] This reminds me of some very peculiar courtesy from some runners in the bike lane I've encountered who have actually moved over into the traffic lane to make space for me and my wife. Some have even ventured into the second traffic lane (two traffic lanes each direction plus bike lane). There's a nice sidewalk available, but I guess the asphalt is really that much nicer. <shrug>
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Old 05-14-21, 08:37 AM
  #31  
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Pedestrians are supposed to be strange because they are from the planet Pedestria!!
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Old 05-14-21, 08:51 AM
  #32  
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I ride in Southern California and have the same issues. Here in east county(Santa Paula), the roads are so bad that the bike lanes are not rideable with a road bike. They are so bad that I have to true my wheels about every other ride to keep them in good shape if I am forced into the bike lane by an aggressive driver. The holes in the asphalt are dangerous but the runners , still convinced that asphalt is better, run in the bike lanes and they can have them. Most are fairly considerate but we tend to remember the jerks who just want to jerk your chain. I stopped riding MUP's because every time there would be at least one or two groups of people with baby strollers or children trying to learn how to skate taking up the whole path even when Ventura went to the trouble of putting up signs and painted lines separating bikes from pedestrians (worthless) .I have had very near misses coming around a blind corner at 12mph and encountering the "infinity leashes" stretched across the path so I will take my chances on the road , the frustrations are far less. It is a fairly densely populated area and every one wants their space. For me , the ride far out weighs the frustration.
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Old 05-14-21, 09:00 AM
  #33  
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Originally Posted by SurferRosa View Post
This happens a lot riding south along E Green Lake Way in Seattle. I don't really care. The runner usually hops out of the bike lane back onto the grass as I approach, but I still usually take the road lane and give him room to continue his course if he chooses.
WOW!! I was born in Seattle and my God parents lived by Green Lake. I would spend some time staying with them and used to think it was heaven. This was in the late 1950's , before my family relocated to Southern California. It used to be a beautiful area if memory serves me well, very hilly , again if memory serves me.
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Old 05-14-21, 09:09 AM
  #34  
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Originally Posted by OPC View Post
[[b]emphasis mine] This reminds me of some very peculiar courtesy from some runners in the bike lane I've encountered who have actually moved over into the traffic lane to make space for me and my wife. Some have even ventured into the second traffic lane (two traffic lanes each direction plus bike lane). There's a nice sidewalk available, but I guess the asphalt is really that much nicer. <shrug>
I have actually had that happen to me before. It baffled me and I didn't know if I should be gracious that they are that dedicated to getting out of my way, or alarmed at the risk they're taking.

I will say that I also don't expect them to hop up onto the curb. I have seen runners slip and trip pulling that maneuver, and at least once the guy had to take a seat and assess his ankle. Just moving over near the curb is fine.
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Old 05-14-21, 09:09 AM
  #35  
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This falls in the category "minor annoying things" also known as "that's bike riding". Most runners are nice enough here to move out of the bike lane if they see me coming. I have no problem moving out of lane if they don't.

The pedestrians that step off the curb right in front of me without looking are a different story.
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Old 05-14-21, 09:21 AM
  #36  
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i screwed up the other day....
i'm cycling on a dirt road, very low automobile traffic. a runner going in my direction is on the left side of the road, going against traffic like foot travelers are supposed to do.
another runner coming toward me on my side of the road, like runners are supposed to do.
i drift to out for the runner coming at me. he moves out into the road, kind of lined up with me. OK - it's dirt road, need to avoid stuff, i understand.
i move further out. he moves further out. - what? we're all get closer to converging at the same point.
so i move further out - 'cause no car traffic. he moves further out - what the heck.
now i'm about to make a close pass to the runner who can't see me. which is end up what's happening - i'm like practically weaving between the two runners.
after i pass them I am speculating they knew each other - i guess.

i should have just stuck to the right side of the road instead of trying to obey the law - where pedestrian traffic goes against wheeled traffic.
so - yep - pedestrians are strange. so maybe it's not accurate that: "everyone is normal until you get to know them"
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Old 05-14-21, 10:57 AM
  #37  
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Originally Posted by mrv View Post
i screwed up the other day....
i'm cycling on a dirt road, very low automobile traffic. a runner going in my direction is on the left side of the road, going against traffic like foot travelers are supposed to do.
another runner coming toward me on my side of the road, like runners are supposed to do.
i drift to out for the runner coming at me. he moves out into the road, kind of lined up with me. OK - it's dirt road, need to avoid stuff, i understand.
i move further out. he moves further out. - what? we're all get closer to converging at the same point.
so i move further out - 'cause no car traffic. he moves further out - what the heck.
now i'm about to make a close pass to the runner who can't see me. which is end up what's happening - i'm like practically weaving between the two runners.
after i pass them I am speculating they knew each other - i guess.

i should have just stuck to the right side of the road instead of trying to obey the law - where pedestrian traffic goes against wheeled traffic.
so - yep - pedestrians are strange. so maybe it's not accurate that: "everyone is normal until you get to know them"
I would argue that, after the second move inward, you slow or even stop. Drivers and cyclists alike often forget that their vehicle is equipped with an amazing device to help avoid collisions... called brakes. I'm just as guilty as the next person for having the mentality that I must keep moving forward, but it honestly doesn't hurt to slow down or stop for a second or two.

Edit: And thinking back quite a few years, I had a similar incident. The local HS track team was training on the MUP I was on. They were diligently running on the far edge of their lane. I saw plenty of room between a runner going my way and two runners going the other way (single file). There was plenty of space between them... until the guy going my way decided to flip a sudden U and join his teammates just as I was about to pass. I had just enough time to shout STAY! and he had the reflexes to stop dead in his tracks, but (1) he should have looked before changing direction and lane, and (2) I should have called my pass and/or slowed down.
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Old 05-14-21, 10:57 AM
  #38  
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Originally Posted by dmanthree View Post
Like I said, the sidewalk in this case is wide, smooth, and really nice. No excuse for the runners to be in the BIKE LANE.
My experience training for a marathon - and now training for a Half-Ironman ... asphalt is more forgiving on the legs (up to 7 times softer) so after about 1.5 hrs of running - asphalt definitely makes a big difference. I have a running friend that falls at least twice a year running on the sidewalk as she trips on the cracks.

Where I run - sidewalks are not common - as it is up to the developer to install them - not the city/county
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Old 05-14-21, 11:19 AM
  #39  
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Originally Posted by urbanknight View Post
I would argue that, after the second move inward, you slow or even stop. Drivers and cyclists alike often forget that their vehicle is equipped with an amazing device to help avoid collisions... called brakes. .
- HA! TRUE THAT!
"People driving cars" frequently treat me like they have no idea what I'm going to do (based on strange behavior from the "people of bikes" they have seen).
So I will occasionally - if I feel I'm safer off - just stopping, putting a foot down, looking at the sky and getting a drink out my water bottle - so the "person driving a car" will proceed legally where I would be breaking the law if I followed them waving me on.

totally agree - sometimes with other people's strange behavior, stopping in a safe & clear spot is the better thing to do.
Always makes me think of Qui Gon waiting for the barrier to lift while Darth Maul paces......


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Old 05-14-21, 12:39 PM
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So last night, I was riding on my usual course. Someone asked where I ride that a runner in the bike lane can make it difficult with traffic behind me. So last night, I caught this image on my ride. I am riding by a college and business district of LaVerne. Locals will back me up on this. There can be a ton of runners, walkers on the streets here. LaVerne and Claremont colleges. Now if a runner is in the bike lane coming at me in this situation, it could be very deadly for me as I am doing the correct thing to do, go with traffic and stay in the clean bike lane. If a runner is in the bike lane running at me in this situation, when there is a sidewalk just a few feet away, I don't feel I have to be nice with my gestures or comments as the runner in this situation could get me killed.

There was no runner coming at me, just to show the situations that can arise.




I have had runners in the past do this to me and I am not nice about it when they risk my life running the opposite way and not considerate enough to stop for 3 seconds so I can pass.

But funny enough, as it should be, last night I was heading down a dark street. Next to a park. 2 runners heading at me without lights or reflectors. One of them in the bike lane but I could see them with my lights. NO TRAFFIC AROUND AT ALL! As I approached, the guy in the bike lane jumped up on the curb so that we could pass one another safely. THAT is the way it is supposed to be. You have the good guys who do what keeps us all safe and the clowns who get obnoxious and think they own the bike lane heading in the opposite direction. I have had jerk faces stay in the middle of my bike lane while traffic is passing from behind (similar to my image above). Can't even more their jerk faces over a foot or two?

So did say, "how's it going guys?" to the guys last night in a friendly tone because I appreciate the good guys!
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Old 05-14-21, 01:09 PM
  #41  
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So it appears that most cyclists don't actually enjoy the act of riding their bikes that much. I mean I see complaints about cars, pedestrians, dogs, runners, roadies, e-bikes, parked cars, no lines, no "protected" path ad infinitum. And what's with the pictures? There's a local group of bike commuters who post pictures of cars parked in a bike lanes. I get it....they're not "supposed" to be there but it wouldn't be better if you just turned your ******g handlebars? You can't just ride around things?

Everyone is my enemy when I'm on the bike? And vice versa?

Damn y'all are some worked up Karens that's for sure.
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Old 05-14-21, 01:17 PM
  #42  
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Originally Posted by UCantTouchThis View Post
So last night, I was riding on my usual course. Someone asked where I ride that a runner in the bike lane can make it difficult with traffic behind me. So last night, I caught this image on my ride. I am riding by a college and business district of LaVerne. Locals will back me up on this. There can be a ton of runners, walkers on the streets here. LaVerne and Claremont colleges. Now if a runner is in the bike lane coming at me in this situation, it could be very deadly for me as I am doing the correct thing to do, go with traffic and stay in the clean bike lane. If a runner is in the bike lane running at me in this situation, when there is a sidewalk just a few feet away, I don't feel I have to be nice with my gestures or comments as the runner in this situation could get me killed.

There was no runner coming at me, just to show the situations that can arise.




I have had runners in the past do this to me and I am not nice about it when they risk my life running the opposite way and not considerate enough to stop for 3 seconds so I can pass.

But funny enough, as it should be, last night I was heading down a dark street. Next to a park. 2 runners heading at me without lights or reflectors. One of them in the bike lane but I could see them with my lights. NO TRAFFIC AROUND AT ALL! As I approached, the guy in the bike lane jumped up on the curb so that we could pass one another safely. THAT is the way it is supposed to be. You have the good guys who do what keeps us all safe and the clowns who get obnoxious and think they own the bike lane heading in the opposite direction. I have had jerk faces stay in the middle of my bike lane while traffic is passing from behind (similar to my image above). Can't even more their jerk faces over a foot or two?

So did say, "how's it going guys?" to the guys last night in a friendly tone because I appreciate the good guys!
I don't see anyone
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Old 05-14-21, 01:27 PM
  #43  
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Originally Posted by urbanknight View Post
It's not just a matter of how smooth it is. Apparently asphalt is softer to the impact, enough that it makes a difference to the knees.
The freeway was just repaved. Very smooth & soft. I bet that very open area would be just super to run on, especially around 5pm during the week. It's 70 mph, so you really are limitless for achieving some top speeds in the new balances.
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Old 05-14-21, 01:55 PM
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Originally Posted by Troul View Post
The freeway was just repaved. Very smooth & soft. I bet that very open area would be just super to run on, especially around 5pm during the week. It's 70 mph, so you really are limitless for achieving some top speeds in the new balances.
If you say that sweetly enough, they might actually take you up on your suggestion.
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Old 05-14-21, 03:00 PM
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Originally Posted by Flip Flop Rider View Post
I don't see anyone

Then you need to read it again.
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Old 05-14-21, 05:36 PM
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Originally Posted by aplcr0331 View Post
So it appears that most cyclists don't actually enjoy the act of riding their bikes that much. I mean I see complaints about cars, pedestrians, dogs, runners, roadies, e-bikes, parked cars, no lines, no "protected" path ad infinitum. And what's with the pictures? There's a local group of bike commuters who post pictures of cars parked in a bike lanes. I get it....they're not "supposed" to be there but it wouldn't be better if you just turned your ******g handlebars? You can't just ride around things?

Everyone is my enemy when I'm on the bike? And vice versa?

Damn y'all are some worked up Karens that's for sure.
Going back to the main category, 2 of the 10 most recent threads were complaints. Sounds like you’re fishing for something.
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Old 05-14-21, 06:18 PM
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Think I have this "problem" about once every two years or so. Really not that hard to go around or say something.I get many more problems with drivers who think I need to park myself in the blind spot of the intersection to facilitate their right turn on red. I had a guy actually try to nudge me with his car.
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Old 05-14-21, 11:27 PM
  #48  
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I ran for years before slowly transitioning to becoming a full time cyclist. Unless the streets were crazy busy with cars, I always ran in the street or bike lanes. As others have pointed out, asphalt is a bit softer, it isn’t likely to be broken up like concrete sidewalks and doesn’t have the annoying up and down of cub cut transitions to the roadway. Was passed by many cyclists with never a comment. I figure it was just like passing a very slow moving cyclist. If I knew a bike was behind me, I would jump out of the street. Seems like a lot to do about nothing. Maybe I should write a play about it!

Now peds completely crowding a MUP from one side to another is a whole different story.
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Old 05-14-21, 11:40 PM
  #49  
LarrySellerz
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Cyclists who refuse to yield to pedestrians in the bike lane piss me off TBH, like look behind you and merge with the traffic, I saw an old man (70+) get off the road because an approaching cyclist signaled him to so he wouldn't have to cycle in the traffic. Who cares if they are going the wrong way, you're operating a vehicle avoid the pedestrians. gesturing them to move is incredibly entitled and rude imo

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Old 05-14-21, 11:45 PM
  #50  
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I ride, run and walk, a lot. Everywhere. There's usually a good reason why pedestrians do what they do. It's not always clueless selfishness. Sometimes it's survival.

I usually jog on the sidewalks where they're available, safe and in good condition. But there are many places where the sidewalk is uneven, or creates a hazard due to poorly designed infrastructure with blind spots for drivers.

A few places along my usual jogging/walking route have hedges, trees, fences, etc., that create blind spots for drivers exiting parking lots. So I leave the sidewalk and jog along the roadside until I'm passed that danger zone. That way I'm more visible and the drivers have another second or two to see me and react appropriately. Presuming they actually give a damn.

Same with cyclists. I avoid most "bike lanes" because they're just tarted up kill zones with painted lines. Too many bike lanes are too close to those same blind spots. I'd rather be away from the curb and more visible.

I see joggers and pedestrians in "bike lanes" all the time on my rides. No biggie. I anticipate soon enough to merge safely into the traffic lane, pass the folks on foot, and merge back to the kill zone... oops, "bike lane" ... to allow drivers to pass if they got stacked up and slightly delayed behind me.

There is absolutely nothing we can do to change the way people adapt to poorly designed infrastructure. The only thing that affects how people use infrastructure is a good design that nudges people intuitively to use it safely.

Until that day in nirvana, it's easier to live and let live and not make a fuss over how people use shared infrastructure. Take it up with the city, county or state, because it's probably bad infrastructure if people prefer the "bike lane" over the sidewalk.
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