torony

Hi there,

I've been cycling a city/hybrid bike for 3 years now for fitness purposes.
I usually go out around 3 times a week for an approximate total distance of 300km as follows: 2 flat rides + 1 uphill ride with a roughly 2500m elevation gain for 80-100km distance.
Im wondering whether going further uphill rides during the week will do any damage to my legs/knees, and if so, what is the required strategy?

Thank you

Iride01 

As long as you have a gear ratio low enough to allow you to pedal without having to strain, you shouldn't have any issue with your knees. So don't pedal up the hill in hard to pedal gears. If you have to stand, then you might be in a hard gear. Nothing against standing, but it's hard to stand in an easy gear, IMO.


Though you can get some knee pain if your feet are at the wrong angle. But you'd be experiencing that just pedaling whether going uphill or not.

GlennR

Get in a low gear and spin.

If you try to "muscle" up in a higher gear, then you put pressure on your knees.

rsbob 

There will be zero impact to your legs other than premature tiredness if you ride in too high a gear`. Take the good advice above about your knees

wolfchild

My strategy for climbing hills is to stand up on the pedals and muscle my way up, never had any knee problems yet..

livedarklions

Unless you have an existing knee problem, this isn't something you need to worry about. Cycling is nowhere near as hard on the knees as running and walking. There's a very small association of cycling with repetitive stress injury to the knee joints, but it's essentially the same risk for people who use high vs. low gears.

bruce19

I'll have to check my conversion but it looks like your doing 8,202+ ft of climbing over 50-62 miles. That's roughly 160 ft per mile Where is that!?

noimagination

I agree with this, with a couple of caveats:
1) This assumes your bike is properly fitted to you. If your motion is not ergonomically correct, it is possible that you could get a repetitive motion injury, such as tendonitis, even if spinning (i.e. higher cadence/lower strain). However, that would apply to any riding you do, independently of climbing.
2) It is possible to get a repetitive motion injury if your connective tissue is not strengthened over time. The risk is minimized by the strategy Iride describes, but it is possible to overdo it even if spinning.

The above are highly dependent on genetics and age. Some people can get away with practically anything and never have a problem. And as we age it takes longer to increase strength and endurance, and longer to recover.

DMC707

two words ---- E bike


that is all

prj71

Depending on geometry...City/Hybrid bikes can be harder to pedal uphill.

pdlamb

Muscling up a steep hill is a great way to exacerbate an old knee injury, and it may give you that knee injury if you're unlucky.

Best way is to make sure you're spinning at a decent cadence (you might want to get a cyclometer with cadence, given the amount of climbing in the O.P.). Gear down and keep the cadence up; you may want to talk to your bike shop about lower gears if your current bike is geared too high. I've found that keeping my climbing cadence at 70 rpm or above makes it hard to push hard enough to strain my knees, but if I drop below 60 rpm for any length of time while climbing my knees tell me about it.

IME, standing to pedal doesn't strain my knees as much as grinding up a hill while climbing. OTOH I can only stand to climb for a few hundred yards, but I can sit and spin 10 miles or more.

Of course, YMMV.

philbob57

When I rode in hills, I just did my best to keep my knees going straight up and down. Forty years ago, I had a knee problem, and a doc looked at me pedal on a trainer. His prescription was to 'spin like hell', because that gave my knees the most natural motion. YMMV.

If I were climbing hills, I'd do the same things I do on the flats: if I felt no pain, I'd continue doing what I was doing. If I feel pain, I adjust the angle of my foot on the pedal until I found a painless position. If I couldn't find a painless position, I'd slow down or even stop pedaling and, perhaps, feel sorry for myself.

mstateglfr 

You are riding a city bike 3 times per week and your average ride is 63mi long and your hilly ride has 7500' of climb?!?
120' of climb per mile on a city bike for 63mi is seriously impressive.

How much more climbing do you want on a 63mi ride using a city bike?...That is a seriously good workout as it is.



Sit and spin if your legs are tired or your knees ache. Stand and mash if your legs arent tired and your knees dont ache.
Its pretty simple.

drlogik 

+1 Spinning in a lower gear helps as has been stated.

You might also consider SPD Mountain bike pedals and clips. They offer a lot more "float" for your feet and that translates into less stress on your knees. I kinda suffered from sore knees for years until I switched to SPD MTB pedals on a recommendation here. It worked! No more sore knees!

Float is the lateral movement your feet have when clipped in to the pedals. On road pedals there is very little movement, and unless the clips are adjusted correctly on your shoes (aligning the foot properly) that lack of float can caused stress on your knees. SPD MTB pedals can solve that because your feet are not stuck in one position. I have them on all my road bikes now.


--

icemilkcoffee 

Spinning maybe easier on the knees, but you need to make it a habit to stand up once in a while. Nobody wants to talk about cycling bone loss but here it goes again: Cycling while seated is a non-weight bearing exercise and as such will cause accelerated bone loss. You need to be standing up pedaling to make it weight bearing. Or sprint like heck every so often.
https://www.trainingpeaks.com/blog/w...an-improve-it/

70sSanO

I would swap the rides, 2 uphill and 1 flat and see how it goes. I mean, you are only riding 180 miles a week on a comfort bike, how tough can it be?

John

noimagination

His/her location info says Mission Viejo, Ca. I don't know the area, but Google says there are some hills/mountains just to the East of his/her location.

Vintage Schwinn

Iride01 nailed it.

That is the whole reason for having GEARS.........................to make it easy to handle hills of differing sizes.

You need to analyze what gears (the GEAR inch size of your lowest gear) that you currently have.
Are you actually engaging and currently using your lowest gear?
The reason that I ask this question is because different bicycles differ quite a bit sometimes as to what gearing that they actually have. Sometimes this is how it may have come from the factory and sometimes the gearing can be attributed to the desires of the bicycle's prior owner.

Here is a little bit of Simple Math that can HELP YOU realize just how your current gearing stacks up to other bicycles, etc

Numerator = the number of teeth on the front Sprocket
Denominator = the number of teeth on the Rear cog Sprocket

Example:
45 teeth on FRONT
15 teeth on REAR

FRONT divided by REAR = result

then Take that "result" and Multiply by the INCH Diameter of the Bicycle Wheel = ___ GEAR number

Example: 45 divided by 15 = 3

3 x 27 ( for 27 inch wheel(630mm) or 700C (622mm) USE 27") so then 3 x 27 = 81 GEAR number

NOW , IF you have a 26" wheel (anything 597mm, 590mm, 584mm, 571mm, 559mm or anything 650, 650a, 650b, 650c ... USE 26" FOR Bicycle Wheel SIZE.)


Okay, why bother doing all of this mumbo jumbo?
Because as the following crazy differing EXAMPLE shows you just how different GEARING can be on different bikes;

1971 SCHWINN PARAMOUNT has 49 & 52 up FRONT..................it has 24-21-18-16-14 in the REAR

1971 SCHWINN SPORTS TOURER has 36 & 54 up FRONT..............it has 34-28-22-17-14 in the REAR

1971 SCHWINN SUPER SPORT has 39 & 52 up FRONt................it has 32-26-21-17-14 in the REAR

1971 Suburban 10sp, the CONTINENTAL & the VARSITY 39/52 ....with 28-24-20-16-14 in the REAR

1971 Suburban FIVE SPEED 46 teeth in Front.......................with 32-26-21-17-14 in the REAR

1971 COLLEGIATE Five Speed 46 teeth in Front....................with 32-26-21-17-14 in the REAR

I am not going to do all of the GEAR calculations for you to see the Gear Chart comparisons for each bicycle.
Typically this was how most manufacturers allowed for comparisons among their own product line and with the competitors' bikes during THE BIKE BOOM era of the early Seventies. Obviously, I am sure that you are aware that WEIGHT is a factor that most novices are so focused about that they just completely forget about or are just completely oblivious to the GEARING of said prospective bike. They wrongly assume that it is a Quality Bike, so that it Must Have GREAT Gearing!!
You see GREAT GEARING for a super-strong, Lance Armstrong at fifty something years old is gonna significantly differ from Tim Jones the 22 year old, All-American starting point guard at Duke. It doesn't matter that Tim is super fit, 22 year old athlete, old Lance will still be able to clean his clock you might say, with regard to strength on any bicycle. There are such bicycles that are GEARED for the serious cyclists that are capable and need only what they need in their quest for speed. A typical average fit athlete won't yet be that capable WITHOUT SIGNIFICANT TRAINING TIME ON THE ROAD, ROLLING UP SIGNIFICANT MILES.
What might be RIGHT for a Lance type rider that is super capable and a serious cyclist WILL LIKELY BE ALL WRONG FOR SOMEONE THAT IS NOT "Beast Strong" ON THE BIKE. Certainly, you can look like Lance, and get the exact type gearing and bike, but it might prove useless compared to something that still looks like Lance's bike but with GEARING suitable for that person at that point in time (Joe or Jane Average........not yet Joe or Jane De Beast....)

Too many Local bike shops and places that sell bicycles do not give a hoot whether the GEARING on said bike is adequate for the buyer. Their attitude is predominately, oh yeah dude, if you're gonna be a real cyclist, this is what you gotta ride. Yeah it is a moron mentality of the typical twits that are the technicians and sales clerks at these local bike shops. The principal owners or the sole proprietor of the local bike shop never ever make this mistake as they do realize the importance of customer satisfaction beyond just ringing up the sale at the register. The twits are typically narrow minded in that they do believe that everybody else rides the same as they do and thus they don't account for that fact that folks ride bikes that are ordinary folks above 35 years old, and even 70 years old or older. These twenty something and teen-age twits just don't get it, --they would if they owned the bike shop, where they had capital at risk and realized that customer service and satisfaction matters tremendously in repeat sales, reputation, and word of mouth advertising. These youthful twits earning low wages simply cannot grasp this at this point in their lives, and simply aren't concerned with it at all as they believe it has no impact on them and their hourly earnings.
Still, you cannot blame the Local Bike Shops as there is currently significant competition for trying to hire low wage workers......Help wanted signs everywhere and so my guess is that they are sorta stuck with som of these idiots to try and cope with their workload and backlog. As a shopper/consumer, you should reasonably expect to gain some minimal knowledge to the point where you can ask relevent questions and make comparisons between models and competing manufacturers and/or nearby and out of town LBS as well. I'm not saying that salespeople at LBS are equal to the worst at the autodealerships but they can be. It is your job to become educated before making the purchase. Remember Caveat Emptor. It can be much worse when buying an expensive bicycle from a private individual on Craigs. Some folks find it a sport to try and sell some POS or otherwise damaged bicycle, knowingly, and try to pass it on to the next owner at pricing as if it were in otherwise perfect mechanical condition. There is always someone like that. There is even a recent posting somewhere here on bikeforums where some guy bought a carbon fiber bike without properly inspecting it, relying only on the seller's verbal and wriiten description and pictures...........purchaser says he found cracks and problems after...........Yes, the probability that the seller didn't disclose the known issues is probably high but it likely doesn't matter as the purchaser viewed photos and whatever description and bought the item. There are always two sides of the story, I don't know enough to definitively say, but I never like to see somebody get the short end of the stick. You have to always be on guard and watch out and know enough to make an informed decision. Yeah, it doesn't matter when you're buying something trivial that costs almost nothing but most people might consider and compare multiple dog collars or multiple can openers, more so than they might research their bicycle before purchasing it.


Back to the old 1971 Schwinns and their GEAR ranges;
------PARAMOUNT has roughly from 55 GEAR to 100 GEAR (THIS IS TERRIBLE FOR HILL CLIMBING unless you're Super-Strong...even though you have a 16 pound weight advantage over the Varsity , Suburban, and Collegiate) THE PARAMOUNT is made for SPEED, and strong speed demons who ride them.

---------SPORTS TOURER has roughly 28 GEAR to 104 GEAR ( For a 10 SPEED BICYCLE, This is GREAT for HILLS, and You Have a Super Wide Gear Range such that if You Want to cruise at a very swift speed, given the weight of the bike, you can still do that......what you give up is the closely spaced gear ratio intervals of the PARAMOUNT that a racer would enjoy........here in the SPORTS TOURER you have both a greater top end gear and a greater(better by far) low end gear for HILLS.

----------SUPER SPORT has roughly 33 GEAR to 100 GEAR

----------10sp Suburban, VARSITY & Continental have roughly 38 GEAR to 100 GEAR

----------5 SPEED SUBURBAN has roughly 39 GEAR to 89 GEAR range

--------- 5 SPEED COLLEGIATE(of the SEVENTIES) has roughly 37 GEAR to 85 GEAR range

****** As you can see the 1970 & later COLLEGIATE DOES HAVE A BETTER HILL CLIMBING ABILITY THAN the VARSITY, the CONTINENTAL and both the Five speed and Ten Speed SUBURBAN models**********************************

( the 1964 through 1969 5 speed COLLEGIATE has roughly 45 GEAR to 85 GEAR range BECAUSE it has the same model F freewheel 28-24-20-16-14 as does the Seventies Varsity / Continental and Late sixties Varsity..................****FOR THIS SIMPLE REASON ALONE, THE 1970 -1977 COLLEGIATE five Speed IS FAR SUPERIOR TO ANY OF THE 1964 - 1969 COLLEGIATE five speeds******************)

Again, that just tells you that you need to know how and when the same models significantly differed in gear ratio such as when---what years, etc...
It isn't that the bicycle manufacturers would have loved to have better HILL CLIMBING capability in tourist & casual Rider type bikes BEFORE 1970, BUT YOU MUST REMEMBER THAT THERE WAS NO EXISTING EUROPEAN REAR DERAILLEUR MANUFACTURER THAT COULD RELIABLY SHIFT ANYTHING WITH A 30 TEETH REAR COG or GREATER than 30 teeth.........NOTHING COULD.......until the JAPANESE and the 1970 Collegiate/1970 Suburban 5 SPEEDS were the first Schwinns to feature a Shimano built for Schwinn rear derailleur..... shimano also built the model J freewheel with the 32 teeth low gear cog.
TODAY, YOU HAVE ZERO ISSUES, BUT BEFORE 1970, in order to get improved HILL CLIMBING, the ONLY CHOICE was to go with an even smaller FRONT Chainwheel if you needed to.
***BASICALLY There are two ways, technically three ways to IMPROVE Hill Climbing via GEARING.......one of them WHEEL SIZE isn't isn't nearly as significant as just FRONT & REAR cog size..........so lets forget Wheel Size, although technically a slightly smaller wheel technically will improve GEAR ratio a small amount but there are realistic limits to this possibility........So BASICALLY just two ways to accomplish IMPROVED LOW GEAR (Hill Climbing) capability via Gearing...............You can GO with LARGER REAR Cog(more teeth) and keep the FRONT as it is......................................OR......................You can GO with a SMALLER FRONT CrankWheel(fewer teeth) and keep the REAR as it is. ................................................Obviously you can do BOTH but YOU WANT TO REALISTICALLY CALCULATE (Do The Math!!!) WHAT YOU MIGHT NEED AND THEN TAKE THE COURSE OF ACTION THAT DOES IT WITHOUT COMPLICATING CURRENT RELIABILITY & RIDEABILITY. Typically there is only a practical reason to do one or the other but not both. If you're making major changes in equipment and you do possess the expertise to undertake swapping the rear cassette(or freewheel if is an ancient bike) and the cranks too, then you are good to go with anything, but for normal, average skilled people, THIS IS NOT RECOMMENDED because there is perhaps more than meets the eye in making such modifications. You probably can certainly follow someone's existing road-map of how they did it with certain specific components on the exact same model bicycle as yours is.
I hope this does not discourage people from considering potentially changing their GEARING to better serve their riding style, but you've got to be able to know what you're doing, otherwise, you may have something that doesn't shift properly, and the bike won't be too fun to ride because of that. The components that you choose need to work well together. Changing stuff on an ancient 10 speed with friction shifting and a rear five freewheel is super-simple if you stay with a rear five freewheel or rear six freewheel, as you well know, you can spread the rear and accomodate far more but things get more complicated as you get more and more, but there are superb road-maps of how to's that you could easily copy.


GEARS ARE WHAT ARE SUPPOSED TO SAVE THE EFFORT AND DAMAGE TO THE KNEES & LEGS!
You aren't supposed to be Too Pooped after trying to MASH the way to the top of a HILL!
Too many dumbasses view it as you are some how weak as a "CYCLIST" if you need such HILL CLIMBING GEARS, and some of these super dumbasses take the view that you should never use them if you have them, because that just means you haven't trained enough.
That is the most ridiculous f------ b.s. that anyone can say, much less a long time bike shop flunkie who actually said just that.
GEARS are to be taken full advantage of.
Learn about GEARS..............and how to calculate and compare the differences............then sure as hell put them to use......Use everything that you can.
There is no shame with using whatever low GEAR that you might need! IF ALL ELSE FAILS, WHERE THERE IS NOT A USEABLE Low Gear ON YOUR BICYCLE FOR A CERTAIN PARTICULAR HILL, THEN GET OFF THE BIKE AND WALK IT UP THAT HILL. There is nothing Wrong with that. You're Riding A Bicycle, So You Are Not In A Hurry To Reach A Particular Destination!
Have FUN RIDING!!! You're not trying to qualify for next year's Tour De France, or trying to prepare for the Hawaii IRON MAN competition next year.

livedarklions

I'd rather hit my knee with a hammer than read that.

70sSanO

I live in Mission Viejo. I am not the OP. Mission Viejo is in the foothills and no roads are straight or flat. It was the site of the 1984 Olympic Road Race.

I have no clue where the OP lives. He has given no location, but his profile has his county as LB.

John

torony

Im having a good gear combination for climbing, a 48/36/26 chainring set and an 11-34 cassette. The only penalty im paying is the 11.5 kg weight of my bike.
Im following exactly the method you mentioned above and im having absolutely no pain whatsoever during the hilly ride except for normal legs tiredness.
One thing to add: i feel that during the rides where i do more standing pedaling, my knees feel tired/hurting a little at the end of the ride, and sometimes i decide to stay seated fearing not to aggravate the pain or run out of energy.
Having all that said, I was wondering if having many uphill rides during one week will do any bad to my legs/knees.

torony

Spinning is the technique im using!!

torony

I live in an middle east country named Lebanon. We have many hilly areas, and actually you can reach an 1800m elevation in just 50 minutes car driving from the sea

livedarklions

Probably not. You seem to be describing normal post-workout muscle pain. You don't have a history of knee problems, do you?

Iride01 

And that is the question I answered.

If you have any knee problems then it will be to other causes if you are pedaling up hills in gear ratios that don't require much more power than you use for cycling on flats.