My nearly maintenance free new bike
10-12-21, 09:33 AM
#26
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Originally Posted by mstateglfr
That is about as purpose built for what you want and how you use a bike as you can get. I hadnt heard of that brand- local builders using aluminum are relatively rare. Very neat build.
10-12-21, 09:35 AM
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Originally Posted by Route 66
It's a small family owned company. I learned something today; I didn't know that it was unusual for for a domestic company to be building aluminum frames.
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10-12-21, 09:47 AM
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Originally Posted by ColonelSanders
Is there any inefficiencies/drag with your drivetrain that you can notice?
The question is: Does it matter? If one drivetrain consumes two watts of energy and another just one, that's twice as much energy loss but it's still not enough for most people to notice subjectively.
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10-12-21, 10:04 AM
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Originally Posted by 70sSanO
Bike maintenance can be a pain or a hobby. Or maybe it’s a hobby until it becomes a pain.
Its a pain ! - LOL
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10-12-21, 10:05 AM
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Originally Posted by Route 66
I bought this bike about a month ago and I think I'm in love. I've been riding a bike for 60+ years and I was hoping to find one that didn't require all the usual maintenance. This is my Spot ACME belt drive bike. It's made in Colorado and has a Gates Carbon drive that's lasts four times as long as a conventional bike because the belt doesn't stretch the way a chain does. It also has a Shimano Alfine 11 speed shifter with the gears sealed inside the rear hub. Because it is belt driven and the gears aren't exposed, the bike is super quiet. The only routine maintenance needed is to do an oil change (50ml) on the rear hub every 7K miles. I'm as pleased as I can be with this thing. No more cleaning and oiling a chain, adjusting a derailleur and hearing a chain ride the gears!
Nice bike !
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10-12-21, 10:09 AM
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@Route 66 - nice ride.
Bike maintenance - best retirement hobby, short of riding them all.
Something about working on nice vintage bikes keeps it from being burdensome maintenance. 👍
Bike maintenance - best retirement hobby, short of riding them all.
Something about working on nice vintage bikes keeps it from being burdensome maintenance. 👍
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10-12-21, 10:34 AM
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Originally Posted by Retro Grouch
We live in a digital world in which an ordinary guy can measure things like drive train drag with pretty good accuracy.
10-12-21, 11:35 AM
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Originally Posted by Route 66
When I first got it, it thought that there was a certain amount of drag vs. my previous bike (Cannondale Quick carbon 1). When I got back from that ride I put it on my stand and noticed that the brakes were rubbing. I centered the the discs around the rotors so that the wheels spun freely and took it out again. This time I didn't notice any drag at all. In terms of absolute efficiency, I don't know if a belt drive can match a conventional drivetrain yet or we'd be seeing the pros using them.
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10-12-21, 11:36 AM
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Originally Posted by PeteHski
The belt drive itself will have similar or even slightly higher efficiency than a chain drive, but there are likely be higher losses in your hub gears compared to a derailleur.
10-12-21, 11:49 AM
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Originally Posted by Route 66
Interesting. Thanks for sharing that.
10-12-21, 12:39 PM
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Originally Posted by PeteHski
No worries. It just so happens when I was an engineering student back in the late 80's I built a test rig to measure efficiency of HTD belt drives (like yours) vs the old style trapezoidal toothed belts that are now pretty much extinct. Power transfer efficiency is something like 97-98%. Chains are typically in the 96-97% range depending on lube etc. Not much in it. But I believe hub gears can bring the overall drivetrain efficiency down by up to 5%. But which is worse? A wet, dirty chain drive or a clean sealed hub? Probably not much in it and likely some overlap in extremes.
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10-12-21, 01:56 PM
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I'd assume the IGH is both heavier and less efficient. So what? A pound of extra weight isn't what keeps riding from being fun, unless you like to race your friends and their bikes all weigh less---and then the weight is more fun, because it gives you an excuse for losing. 
The trade-off are clear---the bike is Always ready to ride with nothing more than a squeeze of the tires to make sure they are aired up. After a ride the rider can park it and forget it and it will be just as ready whenever s/he picks it up again.
The lost half-watt isn't what's keeping the rider form climbing that next hill or whatever .... it is Not a high-performance bike.
But just as a modern household sedan can outlap a lot of performance cars from 30 years ago, if driven to its limits---most modern bikes have performance capacity Way beyond what most riders use. (If you aren't sliding and saving the back end at 65 mph on fast downhills or sprinting at two thousand watts .... ) This rider has sacrificed some of the extremes of performance s/he would never have used anyway to have a trouble-free, always-on bicycle.
Tools for the job. My best touring bike had no high-performance parts .... it was cobbled together from junkyard Schwinn and even Huffy parts and a lot of mystery parts .... but it got me 100 miles per day for eleven straight days with 80+ pounds of load and the only issue was a worn-out rear tire. Saving grams and worrying over drivetrain inefficiency wasn't on my mind.
The trade-off are clear---the bike is Always ready to ride with nothing more than a squeeze of the tires to make sure they are aired up. After a ride the rider can park it and forget it and it will be just as ready whenever s/he picks it up again.
The lost half-watt isn't what's keeping the rider form climbing that next hill or whatever .... it is Not a high-performance bike.
But just as a modern household sedan can outlap a lot of performance cars from 30 years ago, if driven to its limits---most modern bikes have performance capacity Way beyond what most riders use. (If you aren't sliding and saving the back end at 65 mph on fast downhills or sprinting at two thousand watts .... ) This rider has sacrificed some of the extremes of performance s/he would never have used anyway to have a trouble-free, always-on bicycle.
Tools for the job. My best touring bike had no high-performance parts .... it was cobbled together from junkyard Schwinn and even Huffy parts and a lot of mystery parts .... but it got me 100 miles per day for eleven straight days with 80+ pounds of load and the only issue was a worn-out rear tire. Saving grams and worrying over drivetrain inefficiency wasn't on my mind.
10-12-21, 02:15 PM
#39
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Originally Posted by Maelochs
I'd assume the IGH is both heavier and less efficient. So what? A pound of extra weight isn't what keeps riding from being fun, unless you like to race your friends and their bikes all weigh less---and then the weight is more fun, because it gives you an excuse for losing.
The trade-off are clear---the bike is Always ready to ride with nothing more than a squeeze of the tires to make sure they are aired up. After a ride the rider can park it and forget it and it will be just as ready whenever s/he picks it up again.
The lost half-watt isn't what's keeping the rider form climbing that next hill or whatever .... it is Not a high-performance bike.
But just as a modern household sedan can outlap a lot of performance cars from 30 years ago, if driven to its limits---most modern bikes have performance capacity Way beyond what most riders use. (If you aren't sliding and saving the back end at 65 mph on fast downhills or sprinting at two thousand watts .... ) This rider has sacrificed some of the extremes of performance s/he would never have used anyway to have a trouble-free, always-on bicycle.
The trade-off are clear---the bike is Always ready to ride with nothing more than a squeeze of the tires to make sure they are aired up. After a ride the rider can park it and forget it and it will be just as ready whenever s/he picks it up again.
The lost half-watt isn't what's keeping the rider form climbing that next hill or whatever .... it is Not a high-performance bike.
But just as a modern household sedan can outlap a lot of performance cars from 30 years ago, if driven to its limits---most modern bikes have performance capacity Way beyond what most riders use. (If you aren't sliding and saving the back end at 65 mph on fast downhills or sprinting at two thousand watts .... ) This rider has sacrificed some of the extremes of performance s/he would never have used anyway to have a trouble-free, always-on bicycle.
10-12-21, 04:35 PM
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Originally Posted by Rolla
You should get out more.
10-12-21, 05:19 PM
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Route 66 I've read reviews and been to the website for your new bike. It looks like a really well done design, Congrats!
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10-12-21, 05:37 PM
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Originally Posted by daverup
Route 66 I've read reviews and been to the website for your new bike. It looks like a really well done design, Congrats!
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10-12-21, 06:36 PM
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Originally Posted by dedhed
That's fascinating, but the fact is, asserting that riders across the entire 650,000 square miles of California don't experience conditions that require bike maintenance is a) patently absurd b) a weak attempt at trolling, or c) both.
For the record, I'm going with (c).
10-12-21, 07:27 PM
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Originally Posted by Retro Grouch
An interesting question: We live in a digital world in which an ordinary guy can measure things like drive train drag with pretty good accuracy. Once you can measure it, there are always going to be winners and losers. Bicycle people love arguing over such minutia.
The question is: Does it matter? If one drivetrain consumes two watts of energy and another just one, that's twice as much energy loss but it's still not enough for most people to notice subjectively.
The question is: Does it matter? If one drivetrain consumes two watts of energy and another just one, that's twice as much energy loss but it's still not enough for most people to notice subjectively.
I'm certainly not insinuating any kind of deal breaker, I am genuinely interested in internal hubs, so appreciate the feedback from those who ride them.
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10-12-21, 08:18 PM
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Originally Posted by Rolla
That's fascinating, but the fact is, asserting that riders across the entire 650,000 square miles of California don't experience conditions that require bike maintenance is a) patently absurd b) a weak attempt at trolling, or c) both.
For the record, I'm going with (c).
For the record, I'm going with (c).
10-12-21, 08:24 PM
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Originally Posted by 70sSanO
Bike maintenance can be a pain or a hobby. Or maybe it’s a hobby until it becomes a pain.
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10-12-21, 08:32 PM
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Doh. Just when I thought the Trek District 4 was just what I wanted now I see this. The Spot is a nice looking bike and looks to compete directly with the District 4. Obviously there are some differences but both bikes have Gates belt, internal hub shifting (11-speed vs. 8-speed), aluminium frame (Spot has carbon fork if I browsed the specs correctly), and both bikes look to be around-the-town cruisers.
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10-12-21, 08:42 PM
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Originally Posted by tcs
“Is it hard? Not if you have the right attitudes. It's having the right attitudes that’s hard.” - Robert Pirsig
But in other ways it can become like doing your own oil changes on your car. One day you say, “I don’t want to do this anymore.”
It hasn’t happen with my bikes, but that day may, or may not, come.
John
10-12-21, 09:31 PM
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Originally Posted by 70sSanO
But in other ways it can become like doing your own oil changes on your car. One day you say, “I don’t want to do this anymore.” John
10-12-21, 10:16 PM
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Originally Posted by dedhed
Are you saying a state that covers 10 degrees of latitude and longitude and 15K feet of elevation change might have varied weather?
