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It just doesnt make any sense

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It just doesnt make any sense

Old 11-01-21, 06:55 AM
  #151  
Ironfish653
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Originally Posted by vespasianus View Post
One of a big reasons for a 1X system is that it allows a suspension system to pedal well in almost all gear combinations. No more need to try to optimize pedaling for the granny and have it bob like crazy in the middle or big ring. Most people don't seem to understand the role of the drivetrain in suspension performance/action. 1X systems were the game changer.
I would agree. If you were MTB'ing in the 1990s, the array of full-suspension designs was staggering.

However, here in the BikeForums universe, that never happened. There have only been three mountain bikes; department store Huffy's, Danny MacAskill's Freeride rig, and the '85 Schwinn High Sierra. Suspension development started and ended with the Scott Unishock.
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Old 11-01-21, 06:57 AM
  #152  
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Originally Posted by Maelochs View Post
Why do I think "It just doesn't make any sense" sounds like a good title for a BF theme song?

Maybe a new page? .... sort of "foo-boost." We could move certain posts there based on the poster, without even having to read them .....
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Old 11-01-21, 07:01 AM
  #153  
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Originally Posted by PeteHski View Post
Nobody is claiming that triples donít make any sense to some people. Yet the OP comes along and states that a universal modern 1x mtb gearing is senseless. He didnít even refer to a road 1x setup that would have been at least debatable.

Why triples are disappearing is a good question. What it has to do with the rise of 1x is just about nothing.
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Old 11-01-21, 07:07 AM
  #154  
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Originally Posted by livedarklions View Post
Why triples are disappearing is a good question. What it has to do with the rise of 1x is just about nothing.
So you donít think triples have disappeared from MTBs due to the rise of 1x drivetrains?
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Old 11-01-21, 07:14 AM
  #155  
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Originally Posted by PeteHski View Post
So you donít think triples have disappeared from MTBs due to the rise of 1x drivetrains?

I don't MTB, so if you say so. I don't know if they wouldn't have just gone from triples to doubles as road bikes largely did.
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Old 11-01-21, 07:35 AM
  #156  
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Originally Posted by livedarklions View Post
I don't MTB, so if you say so. I don't know if they wouldn't have just gone from triples to doubles as road bikes largely did.
The MTB world pretty much went straight from 3x to 1x. There was always the double + bash ring option for those who didnít see the point of a big ring on their MTB. But once 1x took hold nearly a decade ago then nobody looked back.

I donít remember triples ever being popular on road bikes except for touring. All my road bikes have been 2x since the early 80s.
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Old 11-01-21, 07:55 AM
  #157  
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Originally Posted by PeteHski View Post
The MTB world pretty much went straight from 3x to 1x. There was always the double + bash ring option for those who didnít see the point of a big ring on their MTB. But once 1x took hold nearly a decade ago then nobody looked back.

I donít remember triples ever being popular on road bikes except for touring. All my road bikes have been 2x since the early 80s.

I consider most hybrids to have been flat bar road bikes because that's how they were generally used in the States. They were, for a while, THE utility bikes here. It was very common to have triples on them.

What I don't know about MTB could fill volumes.
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Old 11-01-21, 08:06 AM
  #158  
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Triples were pretty rare on road bikes back in the day. Campy made a beautiful triple, I only recall seeing one. It was on Bicycling Magazine Editor-in-Chief's bike, Ed Pavelka had one on his custom made Tom Kellog Spectrum that went to PBP a few times. Back then, most high quality RD would only shift a 26 or 28 cog and the bolt circle diameter of the crankset limited you to 41 or 42. There were two solutions to a lower gear for climbing, install a triple and/or install a Deore or Huet RD and a 32T back there.

I think the big problem 1X solved for MTB riders was chain suck and one does not need as many tight gears as on the road because the speeds are lower on a MtB and the forces to overcome are generally more linear (slower speed = less wind, and lousy surfaces = more rolling resistance)
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Old 11-01-21, 08:13 AM
  #159  
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Originally Posted by PeteHski View Post
I don’t remember triples ever being popular on road bikes except for touring. All my road bikes have been 2x since the early 80s.
Somewhat popular, and certainly readily available. I bought a Madone 12 (?) years ago that was available with either a compact or a triple, and (presumably) also a standard. Pretty much wiped out by compacts.
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Old 11-01-21, 08:29 AM
  #160  
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Triples only made sense when we only had 7 - 9 speed cassettes in back.
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Old 11-01-21, 09:39 AM
  #161  
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Anyway the main point is that 1x does make sense on the bikes that actually run 12 speed 50T+ rear cassettes. It's triples that don't make sense on those bikes anymore, which is why they have all but disappeared out of that market through lack of demand.
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Old 11-01-21, 09:52 AM
  #162  
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Originally Posted by wolfchild View Post
All of my bikes are singlespeed and fixed gear, this thread just doesn't make any sense to me.

You should see what theyíre saying about it over on the unicycle forum. What kind of idiot need brakes, handlebars, chains, or friends?
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Old 11-01-21, 10:24 AM
  #163  
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I no longer have any bikes with three chainrings. They're unnecessary for my type of riding. But it's not that they "don't make sense" to me. They make complete sense for certain types of riding, as others have pointed out.

My wife, on the other hand, enjoys having a triple. She rarely uses the large chainring, though. She's a true spinner.
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Old 11-01-21, 10:37 AM
  #164  
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Originally Posted by AdkMtnMonster View Post
You should see what theyíre saying about it over on the unicycle forum. What kind of idiot need brakes, handlebars, chains, or friends?
You forgot the second wheel. Who needs that?
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Old 11-01-21, 10:48 AM
  #165  
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Originally Posted by livedarklions View Post
I consider most hybrids to have been flat bar road bikes because that's how they were generally used in the States. They were, for a while, THE utility bikes here. It was very common to have triples on them.

What I don't know about MTB could fill volumes.
Tourers and hybrids were the main market for road triples over here. Road race bikes with drop bars were/are almost exclusively doubles, even with only 5 or 6 rear sprockets. Only bikes I've ever owned with triples were MTBs up to around 2014 when I got my first 1x MTB, which was a total revelation. It's hard to overstate how much better 1x is on technical single track. No more risk of dropped chains or having to plan front downshifts coming out of steep dips into aggressive climbs. Smaller front chainring also helps with clearance over obstacles. 1x also frees up your left hand for the dropper post. There are no downsides that I can think of for 1x MTB use. Maybe that's why 99% of MTBs are now 1x. For road use it's a lot more marginal, which is why 2x still dominates the road market. At least for now. As for triples? Bit of a niche market really. Who really needs 3x12 gearing?
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Old 11-01-21, 10:57 AM
  #166  
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Originally Posted by prj71 View Post
Triples only made sense when we only had 7 - 9 speed cassettes in back.
Not true for many riders.

How do you get a sub 20 inch low and a 120+ inch high with a 2x or 1x. There are riders in some locales who need those ranges and are also not willing to have big steps in the cruising gears.
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Old 11-01-21, 11:02 AM
  #167  
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Originally Posted by PeteHski View Post
Tourers and hybrids were the main market for road triples over here. Road race bikes with drop bars were/are almost exclusively doubles, even with only 5 or 6 rear sprockets. Only bikes I've ever owned with triples were MTBs up to around 2014 when I got my first 1x MTB, which was a total revelation. It's hard to overstate how much better 1x is on technical single track. No more risk of dropped chains or having to plan front downshifts coming out of steep dips into aggressive climbs. Smaller front chainring also helps with clearance over obstacles. 1x also frees up your left hand for the dropper post. There are no downsides that I can think of for 1x MTB use. Maybe that's why 99% of MTBs are now 1x. For road use it's a lot more marginal, which is why 2x still dominates the road market. At least for now. As for triples? Bit of a niche market really. Who really needs 3x12 gearing?

Cue the guys who road ride in mountain states. They need a high gear descending, and a very low gear ascending.

There were a fair number of drop bar triples being marketed as "endurance fit" or something similar in the U.S. if I recall correctly.

I don't want to start up another row about my gearing (not referring to you), but I think you could understand why I'd have no interest in 1x for a road bike. When I had a triple on my FX3, I almost never went below the middle chain ring.
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Old 11-01-21, 11:06 AM
  #168  
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Originally Posted by GhostRider62 View Post
Not true for many riders.

How do you get a sub 20 inch low and a 120+ inch high with a 2x or 1x. There are riders in some locales who need those ranges and are also not willing to have big steps in the cruising gears.
Yeah, well that's not really many riders is it?
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Old 11-01-21, 11:07 AM
  #169  
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Originally Posted by GhostRider62 View Post
Not true for many riders.

How do you get a sub 20 inch low and a 120+ inch high with a 2x or 1x. There are riders in some locales who need those ranges and are also not willing to have big steps in the cruising gears.

I think that's the trouble for finding triples going forward--the people who need them really really need them (e.g., road riders in mountainous places), but there may not be enough of those people to justify continuing to mass produce them economically.
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Old 11-01-21, 11:09 AM
  #170  
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Originally Posted by livedarklions View Post
Cue the guys who road ride in mountain states. They need a high gear descending, and a very low gear ascending.

There were a fair number of drop bar triples being marketed as "endurance fit" or something similar in the U.S. if I recall correctly.

I don't want to start up another row about my gearing (not referring to you), but I think you could understand why I'd have no interest in 1x for a road bike. When I had a triple on my FX3, I almost never went below the middle chain ring.
Compact doubles are pretty popular in the Alps. You don't actually need a very high gear for descending steep slopes. You actually need good brakes!
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Old 11-01-21, 11:09 AM
  #171  
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Originally Posted by livedarklions View Post
I think that's the trouble for finding triples going forward--the people who need them really really need them (e.g., road riders in mountainous places), but there may not be enough of those people to justify continuing to mass produce them economically.
Shimano produces them. You can buy triple cranks in EU but not USA. It is a marketing thing. SRAM especially is shoving 1X and weird gearing down our throats.
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Old 11-01-21, 11:10 AM
  #172  
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Originally Posted by PeteHski View Post
Compact doubles are pretty popular in the Alps. You don't actually need a very high gear for descending steep slopes. You actually need good brakes!
The Alps are not especially steep.
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Old 11-01-21, 11:11 AM
  #173  
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Originally Posted by Maelochs View Post
Yeah, I realize it is hard to ride a bent anywhere that isn't flat .... but if you cannot understand 1x12 off-road, it is because you are willfully ignorant. You have been riding for way too long not to understand gearing ... . but old guys like you sometimes Want not to understand, and act foolish to try to pretend to be wise.

Anyone with a lot of off-road miles understand 1x. Either you lack the experience and choose not to extrapolate from your road riding, or you have the experience and are just being a donkey.
Nice personal attack. Maybe the moderator should take notice. As a mechanical tech among other things, I assure you I know a lot about gearing.

As others have stated, it is just something new the mfg want you to bite on, to be "up to date"!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Fortunately most of us ARE NOT so "ignorant" as to bite on this continuing sales ploy.
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Old 11-01-21, 11:12 AM
  #174  
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Originally Posted by GhostRider62 View Post
The Alps are not especially steep.
So are you seriously going to argue that you need a bigger gear to descend say a 20% slope?
Or are you talking about super low gears?
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Old 11-01-21, 11:13 AM
  #175  
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Originally Posted by PeteHski View Post
Yeah, well that's not really many riders is it?
Well, it depends on the forum. Virtually every trike rider needs gears that low. Most velomobile riders would kill for a 20 inch gear and 140 inch top gear. Touring cyclists need low and high gears. As do most fast recumbent riders. Probably a lot more than you think
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