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100 meter bike races, building a bike for sprints.

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100 meter bike races, building a bike for sprints.

Old 01-09-22, 08:26 PM
  #26  
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Originally Posted by urbanknight View Post
Not a chance. The world record for the flying 200m is 9.100 seconds (4.55 seconds per 100m). Going from a standing start is going to stretch that out a noticeable amount. Maybe 7 seconds?

I would also suspect that 100m isn't quite enough distance to reach a rider's overall top speed, or is that not your intention?
The goal is fastest elapsed time for a race that takes approximately 10 seconds at the competitive level. I thought it might be 100 meters but if you think 200m would be more like 16 seconds then maybe 100m would be about right. I would say a sprinter running would beat any bike off the line out to 20 or 30 meters. Human top speed running is somewhere around 25mph so a bike isnt going to be that much faster than running in the 100meter short distance but I have no idea. It would be interesting.
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Old 01-09-22, 08:29 PM
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Originally Posted by Bmach View Post
Interesting distance. Like a 1/4 mile drag race gearing would depend on the engine. Are you a big block low cadence or a small block high cadence engine?
exactly. pick your gears depending on where your strength is. its a sport for everyone.
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Old 01-09-22, 08:31 PM
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Originally Posted by WhyFi View Post
My guess is that, if you were to go beyond idle musing, you'd quickly find practical reasons for the absence. Or are you assuming that you've had a unique thought that hasn't occurred to anyone in the hundred plus years of bicycle racing?
Its not my goal to have unique thoughts, it just seems interesting to me. Ive been watching track and field lately and it just occurred to me that there is no 100m or short sprints for bikes. Then I wondered how fast a bike would be compared to a man running. I think it would be pretty close. I think it would be fun. Can you think of any practical reasons for the absence of short distance bike racing?
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Old 01-09-22, 08:55 PM
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Originally Posted by MinnMan View Post
OP, is there a velodrome anywhere near you? I get that really you're just daydreaming, but if you have half an interest in seeing people put out the watts, that's where you'll find it.

As to your Friday night fantasy, I suggest you write a script for Hollywood. If the movie gets made and makes it all seem exciting, then people will imitate it and make the fictional real.

Like Quidditch.
well I think bike riding is a little more realistic than Quidditch. but ya thats what it takes sometimes to trigger the group behavior gene. A movie or commercial showing that everyone is doing it. Gosh I love our species. Monkey see, monkey do. Another fear gene some of us have is to denigrate any thought that isnt currently popular.
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Old 01-09-22, 09:00 PM
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Originally Posted by cubewheels View Post
How do you train for that? I see lots of broken chains in that type of race.
I know sprinters do a lot of high intensity interval training. Box jumps, plyometrics, squats, lunges. I would think an explosive start would be most critical. Maybe 30m take offs 5 sets 2x per week on leg day? Limit distance work, just train for power like sprinters do.
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Old 01-09-22, 09:07 PM
  #31  
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Originally Posted by BikePower View Post
well I think bike riding is a little more realistic than Quidditch. but ya thats what it takes sometimes to trigger the group behavior gene. A movie or commercial showing that everyone is doing it. Gosh I love our species. Monkey see, monkey do. Another fear gene some of us have is to denigrate any thought that isnt currently popular.
You may not know it, but I'm kind of agreeing with you.

anyway, yeah, quidditch. A real sport now. Sort of.

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Old 01-09-22, 09:16 PM
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Originally Posted by BikePower View Post
Its not my goal to have unique thoughts, it just seems interesting to me.
And the point has escaped you.
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Old 01-09-22, 09:32 PM
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Originally Posted by WhyFi View Post
... Or are you assuming that you've had a unique thought that hasn't occurred to anyone in the hundred plus years of bicycle racing?
Originally Posted by BikePower View Post
Its not my goal to have unique thoughts, it just seems interesting to me. Ive been watching track and field lately and it just occurred to me that there is no 100m or short sprints for bikes. Then I wondered how fast a bike would be compared to a man running. I think it would be pretty close. I think it would be fun. Can you think of any practical reasons for the absence of short distance bike racing?
Originally Posted by WhyFi View Post
And the point has escaped you.
No I got your point. We all did. lol
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Old 01-09-22, 09:36 PM
  #34  
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Originally Posted by BikePower View Post
No I got your point. We all did. lol
Cool. So do it up. I'll wait.
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Old 01-09-22, 09:38 PM
  #35  
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Look at all the fun they are having!!


I guess times have changed.
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Old 01-09-22, 09:39 PM
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Bicycle drag racing is an idea that comes around. Not always seriously, and sometimes just trolling the forum rats. I can't find the thread now but there was a guy a couple of years ago who had everyone going with the giant sprocket he'd bought and how fast it would make him.

You're going to accelerate slower and need more time to hit top speed just because a bike is geared higher than running. That's the whole point of having a bike. Running top speed must be limited by the power needed to flail the limbs around because an athlete on a bike can go faster. The hour record is more than 34 miles. That flying start 200 listed above works out to more than 49mph and that's got to be an immense gear ratio. Track bikes don't have shifters but I feel like a hypothetical drag racing bike ought to. How fast would those track sprinters with the giant quads go if they only had a centrifugal 2-speed like SRAM used to make?
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Old 01-09-22, 10:00 PM
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Originally Posted by Darth Lefty View Post
Bicycle drag racing is an idea that comes around. Not always seriously, and sometimes just trolling the forum rats. I can't find the thread now but there was a guy a couple of years ago who had everyone going with the giant sprocket he'd bought and how fast it would make him.

You're going to accelerate slower and need more time to hit top speed just because a bike is geared higher than running. That's the whole point of having a bike. Running top speed must be limited by the power needed to flail the limbs around because an athlete on a bike can go faster. The hour record is more than 34 miles. That flying start 200 listed above works out to more than 49mph and that's got to be an immense gear ratio. Track bikes don't have shifters but I feel like a hypothetical drag racing bike ought to. How fast would those track sprinters with the giant quads go if they only had a centrifugal 2-speed like SRAM used to make?
Right on. Thats what I want to know. Those track bikes are geared for top speed not drag racing. I agree a hypothetical drag racing bike ought to have variable gears. I would say at least 2 maybe 3, preferrably gears that can be shifted under load at 33 meters, and 66 meters or if a two speed then at 50 meters. Maybe a 1.25 first and a 2.0 second and a 3.0 third gear.
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Old 01-09-22, 10:01 PM
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Originally Posted by ofajen View Post
jk
As long as you’re serious about the vroom or spoke card.
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Old 01-10-22, 12:19 AM
  #39  
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Originally Posted by urbanknight View Post
Not a chance. The world record for the flying 200m is 9.100 seconds (4.55 seconds per 100m). Going from a standing start is going to stretch that out a noticeable amount. Maybe 7 seconds?

I would also suspect that 100m isn't quite enough distance to reach a rider's overall top speed, or is that not your intention?
Seems equivalent to a drag race which never results in the top speed of the car, just who can cover the distance the fastest. My car can do the 1/4 mile at 98mph but has easily hit 125mph according to the speedo, just given more distance.

From doing 200m sprints the distance was over so fast, even the standing 200 was fast, that 100m would go so quick I'm not certain if a good take off gear and easy to spin up wouldn't be faster than the ability to shift. Be interesting to watch.
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Old 01-10-22, 01:34 AM
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Originally Posted by Russ Roth View Post
Seems equivalent to a drag race which never results in the top speed of the car, just who can cover the distance the fastest. My car can do the 1/4 mile at 98mph but has easily hit 125mph according to the speedo, just given more distance.

From doing 200m sprints the distance was over so fast, even the standing 200 was fast, that 100m would go so quick I'm not certain if a good take off gear and easy to spin up wouldn't be faster than the ability to shift. Be interesting to watch.
I believe top fuel races are so quick that they don't bother to shift either.
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Old 01-10-22, 07:17 AM
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Originally Posted by ofajen View Post
Vroom vroom sound or card in the spoke would be required. And laying down some rubber at the start, I think.

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Vroom and Wheelies. Please.
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Old 01-10-22, 07:36 AM
  #42  
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Originally Posted by cubewheels View Post
How do you train for that? I see lots of broken chains in that type of race.
Fewer if the participants don't try to buy the cheap ones.
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Old 01-10-22, 07:43 AM
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Originally Posted by cubewheels View Post
How do you train for that? I see lots of broken chains in that type of race.
Actually, doing overgeared sprints from a near stop is a reasonable training method, essentially like strength training on the bike. You start from a near stop in a tall gear which is hard yet possible to push and spin it up to the best of your ability, maximum force for some 6-7 seconds until you run out of steam. Then recover for a while and again and again.

​​​​​​The result is something like the OP envisions.

It is hard on components and bearings, but it doesn't break chains (I mean, modern, quality stuff - maybe chains did break routinely in ancient times).
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Old 01-10-22, 07:52 AM
  #44  
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These used to be pretty common. They were often called Street Sprints, though they were usually close to 200 or 250 m on a straight flat road. And it is usually done in a bracketed race - two up, winner advances.

There was a local series here a few years ago that was called the Friday Night Fights. It often drew a crowd, though many showed up expecting actual brawling.

Still, it's a pretty good spectator event if you can get enough people - and beer.
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Old 01-10-22, 08:54 AM
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Originally Posted by topflightpro View Post
These used to be pretty common. They were often called Street Sprints, though they were usually close to 200 or 250 m on a straight flat road. And it is usually done in a bracketed race - two up, winner advances.

There was a local series here a few years ago that was called the Friday Night Fights. It often drew a crowd, though many showed up expecting actual brawling.

Still, it's a pretty good spectator event if you can get enough people - and beer.
When I was into car drag racing I accidentally came across this on youtube videos. I agree, the distances I saw in the videos were much more like 250m. A couple videos actually looked more like 500m to 1km to me as they had video of the start and finish from two cameras and the finish camera couldn't see the crowd/bikes at the start. In 250m you'd easily see in a camera shot the start. And one guy pretty sure I saw had shown up with a pursuit track bike setup.

Personally 100m sounds like taking your car to a 1/16th mile drag strip, which don't exist. Not enough time to go fast to make it worth it. The "fun ratio" of going fast but also making the race short enough to cater to the format is important.

I think 500m is good for the local yokels out for a good time.

And for the other guy above..........again, no idea what he's talking about with breaking chains. I guess as he's no idea. Track bikes run a different chain less prone to breaking than a typical 11spd road chain. I also doubt local yokels out doing this will have the quads of a 1km or flying 200 dedicated track racer who actually goes to the velodrome. I would expect to see a lot of State Bicycle fixie bikes and maybe even bmx bikes. That's bmx racing holeshot sprinting and gearing.
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Old 01-10-22, 08:55 AM
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Originally Posted by cubewheels View Post
How do you train for that? I see lots of broken chains in that type of race.
And then the chains will fall off and get run over by cars.

Oh, the humanity...
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Old 01-10-22, 12:03 PM
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Originally Posted by WhyFi View Post
My guess is that, if you were to go beyond idle musing, you'd quickly find practical reasons for the absence. Or are you assuming that you've had a unique thought that hasn't occurred to anyone in the hundred plus years of bicycle racing?
'If it's such a great idea how come nobody's done it before' is not a good argument in general. They didn't have 50m swim races before the 1988 Olympics neither. Now it is a regular event and now there are specialists who specialize in this distance and it's exciting to watch. The closest thing in the cycling world would be the mass start in a BMX race. And that is always exciting to watch.
In a world where competitive eating is a sport, you can't convince me that a 100m bike race is somehow more pointless than hot dog eating.
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Old 01-10-22, 12:11 PM
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Two more things to add for the OP.

Look up Chariot Races - they are usually one lap, standing start races at a track.

Also, look up the track TT (kilo or 500): It's a standing start effort for 500m or 1000m. They are full on sprints. In many cases, splits are taken at half laps (125m). Jeffrey Hoogland ran 10.819 for the first 125m in his sea level world record kilo.


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Old 01-10-22, 12:11 PM
  #49  
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Originally Posted by Branko D View Post
Actually, doing overgeared sprints from a near stop is a reasonable training method, essentially like strength training on the bike. You start from a near stop in a tall gear which is hard yet possible to push and spin it up to the best of your ability, maximum force for some 6-7 seconds until you run out of steam. Then recover for a while and again and again.

​​​​​​The result is something like the OP envisions.

It is hard on components and bearings, but it doesn't break chains (I mean, modern, quality stuff - maybe chains did break routinely in ancient times).
I had a coach assign me a workout that he called drag races. Alternating big ring and little ring. Mid cassette either way for a straight chain line. Go from zero (or as close as possible) to as fast as you can go for 15 seconds. When you're in the big ring, the challenge is to get on top of the gear at the start, when you're in the small ring the challenge is to keep on the gear at the end. He put an asterisk on this one: *make sure you are good and warmed up and that your bike is in good condition; you can break your bike or yourself if you aren't careful.

Also, I would only do these once I had done a couple of months of base training, transitioning into shorter/higher intensity work.
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Old 01-10-22, 12:31 PM
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Originally Posted by icemilkcoffee View Post
'If it's such a great idea how come nobody's done it before' is not a good argument in general. They didn't have 50m swim races before the 1988 Olympics neither. Now it is a regular event and now there are specialists who specialize in this distance and it's exciting to watch. The closest thing in the cycling world would be the mass start in a BMX race. And that is always exciting to watch.
In a world where competitive eating is a sport, you can't convince me that a 100m bike race is somehow more pointless than hot dog eating.
Cool. I'm sure that the OP would happily accept volunteers and/or investors.
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