livedarklions

I think I just did that, didn't I? Until you said lycra/spandex, I wasn't aware that's what we were discussing as being "high end", so I clarified that right away as soon as I saw your post.


The point I'm making, if any, is that sensitivities to elastic fabrics are actually quite common, so it's going to be irrational for a lot of people to experiment with such stuff in search of comfort, and I don't think it's doing them any favors to overstate the supposed evils of cotton as if comfort was an objectively measured factor. By its very nature, it has to be subjective.

I'm not telling you that you aren't more comfortable in good technical fabrics. Even if I was familiar with all of the technical specifications, I wouldn't be able to tell you how those fabrics are going to feel to you. I don't doubt your word that you are. I think we should just give people credit for knowing when they are or aren't comfortable as we're never getting better data than their own statements..

Koyote

I don't know which of the 15 jerseys (on that page) you won, so I don't have an answer for you.

I do know that I've worn cheap jerseys, and I've worn nice ones, and I can quite easily discern the differences. So, either you've not really tried a nice jersey, or you don't discern the differences; that's all I can conclude from your claims that $20 jerseys are not much different from "expensive" jerseys. There's nothing wrong with either possibility, so you needn't be so defensive. If you're happy with $20 jerseys, that leaves more money for beer. I'm not telling you what to wear.

For reference, this is the best LS jersey I own, and this is one of my fave SS jerseys.

seypat

Keep it up, people. 11 pages and going strong!

prj71

Nice looking jerseys. I refuse to pay that much for one though.

Leaves me more money for beer, bikes, bike parts, fly fishing equipment, ice fishing equipment, hunting equipment etc. I become selective on where I'll spend the high dollar and where I won't. I will spend the high dollar on a good pair of bike shorts though. I found it does make a difference in the saddle.

Koyote

That's been my point all along: you don't really have an accurate frame of comparison for your claims. Now that you've acknowledged it, I hope you'll stop arguing.

And again, I'm not telling you to wear different clothes, nor to have different values.

wolfchild

A lot of what you call subjective statements are undeniable truths...Technical synthetic fabrics being more comfortable than cotton is just one of those undeniable truths.

Koyote

EXACTLY! And some other "undeniable truths" are that blue is the prettiest color, mint chocolate chip is the best ice cream flavor, and The Godfather Part II is better than The Godfather.

Undeniable truths, all of them.

livedarklions

Burn me at the stake for my apostacy then because I'm sure that skin sensitivity is going to more than negate that undeniable truth.

We all know people who are more comfortable in things and conditions we would find absolutely intolerable. You want to enlighten us with an objective way to measure comfort?

BTW, did you find anywhere I "advocated" cotton or told anyone else to ride in it? You still owe me an apology.

livedarklions

I kinda think mint chocolate chip might be the most "love it or hate it" flavor. Nobody is neutral on it.

Making a pitch for Godfather III would be great for trolling, but I've never managed to sit through enough of it to make the pitch convincingly sincere.

Eric F 

My trainer is in my non-climate-controlled garage. On warmer days, I wear a sleeveless UA base layer, which does a really nice job handling my sweat. On cooler days, I've found that I'm actually too cold in the UA, and prefer the warmer layer of a cotton t-shirt.

Eric F 

I'm with you on 2 of 3. See below.

I'm neutral on mint chocolate chip. I like it okay, but it's not in my top 3.

WhyFi

Sure, I don't disagree with that. To me, though, the crux of it is this -

"I'm comfortable in X."

Awesome! No problems whatsoever.

"I'm more comfortable in X than I am in Y."

This is more thorny because it implies both subjective superiority of one over the other and adequate familiarity with both X and Y. If the adequate familiarity is there - sweet. But, if follow-up comments are diametrically opposed to the general consensus, I think that it raises question marks about their level of familiarity and I think that it's fair to ask qualifying questions about their level of familiarity. That's essentially where we were with my head-scratching emoji after your "pooling under the poly" comment, because it was SO contrary to my experience and, I think, that of the vast majority of my peers.

Honestly, about a dozen years ago, I wasn't too far off from your position - I didn't like synthetic jerseys and I avoided them; the jerseys that I had were fine merino wool. Synthetics have made big strides since then, IMO. While I still like merino in certain conditions, good synthetics now comprise the majority of my cycling attire. If one doesn't have recent experience with good quality synthetics, I think any judgement calls on their shortcomings are suspect, at best. It's like someone saying that Android/iOS does this and that poorly when they haven't used it since 2.0.

WhyFi

To me, mint chocolate chip is like hanging out with a small-doses friend - it's great fun once in a blue moon, but it gets old quick.

Wildwood

Have not read all 11 pages of input, ,

BUT, as a cyclist on the road, being somewhat unique, everyone makes a statement. Bland or colorful, neutral or exotic.

I go both ways.
Also, this thread could use more jersey pics.

A unique logo for a select Team



I ride bikes. I do not name them. Sometimes I buy them jerseys.

One for the Swiss Mondia

Front pockets are handy

apologies for big nose, facilitates big lungs.



Banesto - team logo in my dreams.



edit: needed = AustroDaimler size XL Qty 3???

SpeedyBlueBiker

Nice looking jerseys. They aren't splattered all over with team logos making someone looking like a TDF wannabe. I'd only balk at the expense. $190 & $200 is a lot of $$ to fork over for a jersey.

livedarklions

If it's better to state "I'm more comfortable in cotton than the polyesters I'm not sensitive to", I'll be happy to stipulate to that. I cannot have the capacity to test whether I'd experience the fabrics you're discussing as more comfortable than cotton given the fact that the inherent characteristics of those fabrics will cause me discomfort. Had I realized that we were discussing lycra/spandex up front, I would've stated that.

I still think that a statement that something is objectively or scientifically more comfortable is an inherent contradiction in terms, but I don't think we're arguing about that. I agree that in making purchasing decisions, I'm far more likely to listen to the experiences and opinions of people who can actually use the product. OTOH, my condition being far from unique or even unusual, I think it could be interesting to someone similarly "afflicted" to know that someone has acclimated to the point of being comfortable in cotton.

livedarklions

And there's a good game there--find the COVID haircut.

Eric F 

Almost all of the cycling clothing I own is made in the US. My road team/club kit stuff is Voler. The jerseys I tend to wear on the MTB are Twin Six.

If $20 Chinese jerseys work for you, cool. Do your thing. However, some of us appreciate the small details that are included in current higher-end jerseys (multiple fabrics, seam profiles, etc.).

livedarklions

Drop the cone, take the cannoli. (Godfather call back).

Eric F 

I am. 7 hours averaging almost 200W is a pretty damn good effort.

indyfabz

What about a team Lego jersey?

msu2001la

All of those are amazing and awesome. Well done.

Trakhak

I've lost track of this thread. I hope the fashion police posting here will provide concise lists of which outfits are compulsory and which are forbidden.

Rolla

Subjective opinions are not and can not be undeniable, nor truths, except for the holder. But you know this. You just like to post your nonsense because it's an undeniable truth that you are a troll.

tomato coupe

As he pointed out, however, those power numbers are Strava estimates.

For perspective, I did a very similar route to the one you're referring to: 83.5 miles, 4,002 ft., 197 W ave (measured), 18.6 mph ave. His 12 mph ave for 86.3 miles, 4,144 ft. implies much less than 197 W, unless he weighs significantly more than my 80 kg.