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Increase in Ambulances on the Road - Ear Plugs While Riding

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Increase in Ambulances on the Road - Ear Plugs While Riding

Old 04-19-22, 06:56 AM
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Part of what the OP is experiencing could be due to changes in traffic flow resulting in more ambulance routes lining up with the OPs cycling routes.

Or changes to the OPs routes or time of day on those routes.
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Old 04-19-22, 07:04 AM
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Originally Posted by prairiepedaler
Hello, there is. I certainly won't post them here though. It is also not a personal responsibility to change another's mind therefore I'll just leave it there.

Obviously, you are just bluffing. You have no such data.

If you make a claim, it is your "personal responsibility" to back it up, not mine to do your homework for you.
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Old 04-19-22, 07:05 AM
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Originally Posted by prairiepedaler
I'm saying that you must come to your own conclusions.

Cop out.
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Old 04-19-22, 07:14 AM
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Originally Posted by Kapusta
Same here. But those piccolos have been joined by an ever expanding woodwind section.

Our built world is way too effing loud.

Honest question since I'm lucky enough never to have experienced this--do you think that tinnitus makes sirens more or less harmful to your hearing, or does it have any relevance to it at all?

I'd almost wonder if you weren't at greater risk for noise induced hearing loss because you might be less likely to notice how loud the sound was given the baseline level of internally generated noise you're constantly putting up with.
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Old 04-19-22, 07:27 AM
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Originally Posted by livedarklions
Honest question since I'm lucky enough never to have experienced this--do you think that tinnitus makes sirens more or less harmful to your hearing, or does it have any relevance to it at all?

I'd almost wonder if you weren't at greater risk for noise induced hearing loss because you might be less likely to notice how loud the sound was given the baseline level of internally generated noise you're constantly putting up with.
Sirens are bad for anyone's hearing. The difference is that with certain types of chronic tinnitus, the resulting hearing damage is accompanied by more ringing in the ears.

I am not sure I understand your second point. The ringing is not loud enough to drown out a siren. Its not like I am functionally deaf. Loud still sounds loud. If anything, I am MORE aware of loudness than most people due to my being acutely aware of the damage that it causes. I'm the first one to stick earplugs in on a long drive or when hearing loud music. But I would not even THINK about wearing them when riding a bike. No way.
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Old 04-19-22, 07:57 AM
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Originally Posted by livedarklions
90db is obviously way too low, that's quieter than a motorcycle. Sirens are as loud as they are because they're supposed to give drivers ahead sufficient notice to get out of the way. In a crowded city, that takes some time. They need to be loud enough to be heard at a distance from inside a motor vehicle. The link you provided states that MC engines are 95db (which is a lot louder than 90). When you're driving, how close does the motorcycle need to be before you can hear it inside your car?

I think we have to appreciate that the loudness of sirens is not calibrated for warning cyclists, and look at it as an issue of personal hearing protection if it poses a problem for us. After all, if we get hit by a car, we definitely might need the EMTs to have an effective way to clear the road to get to us.
Good point. I would still say limit it to 110 since that’s where instant hearing damage starts. I’m sure everyone’s hearing experience is different, but I feel like I hear sirens before they’re even close enough to worry about (in a car). I’m talking 3-4 city blocks away, and sometimes not even coming down the street I’m on. Then again, I don’t blast loud music or have a 95dB engine on my vehicle.
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Old 04-19-22, 08:07 AM
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Originally Posted by Kapusta
I am not sure I understand your second point. The ringing is not loud enough to drown out a siren. Its not like I am functionally deaf. Loud still sounds loud. If anything, I am MORE aware of loudness than most people due to my being acutely aware of the damage that it causes. I'm the first one to stick earplugs in on a long drive or when hearing loud music. But I would not even THINK about wearing them when riding a bike. No way.
Yeah, that question was definitely one from lack of knowledge. I was trying to think of an analogy, and the best I could think of was that if I have a serious sharp pain sensation in my foot chronically, I might be in danger of not noticing when I step on glass or something else actually sharp. I think what you're telling me is that the ringing is distinct enough from actual sounds that you don't confuse the two and may actually be more acutely aware of the actual sounds.

I don't impair my hearing when I ride because it is a sense I use effectively for safety reasons, so my practice agrees with yours. I'm not bothered by other people finding they have other needs and strategies, however.
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Old 04-19-22, 08:12 AM
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I just looked it up.....Ambulance sirens can be 125dBA 100 feet away. That sound level can be a real problem. Even good earplugs might only bring that down to 100 dba. Maybe adjust your route to bypass the hospital areas?
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Old 04-19-22, 08:25 AM
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Originally Posted by livedarklions
Yeah, that question was definitely one from lack of knowledge.

I don't impair my hearing when I ride because it is a sense I use effectively for safety reasons, so my practice agrees with yours. I'm not bothered by other people finding they have other needs and strategies, however.
No worries, I took it as an honest question.

Same as you, I use auditory clues a lot.

And realistically, when I do encounter an emergency siren at close range, I just pull over and plug my ears. But it is not like I encounter them at close range all that often.
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Old 04-19-22, 08:48 AM
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Originally Posted by livedarklions
Yeah, that question was definitely one from lack of knowledge. I was trying to think of an analogy, and the best I could think of was that if I have a serious sharp pain sensation in my foot chronically, I might be in danger of not noticing when I step on glass or something else actually sharp. I think what you're telling me is that the ringing is distinct enough from actual sounds that you don't confuse the two and may actually be more acutely aware of the actual sounds.
Tinnitus is generally a neurological response to hearing loss (so we're not actually hearing a sound), which usually starts at the higher frequencies, and tinnitus has been described as the brain trying to replace those lost pitches. Although sirens have overtones at those frequencies, their fundamental pitches are much lower. I have read that it can in fact be perceived as loud enough to distract someone, and some people will even turn up their TV or radio to try and drown it out, but my personal experience is that the intensity is low enough to hear all other sounds fairly normally. As a matter of fact, the intensity seems louder when I am consciously thinking about it, but otherwise can be ignored when going about my daily business.

That's my rudimentary understanding of it. Hope that helps.
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Old 04-19-22, 08:50 AM
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Originally Posted by Kapusta
Our built world is way too effing loud.
I have taken to wearing my musicians earplugs in movie theaters, and a crude dB sensor app on my phone tells me that's a good choice.
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Old 04-19-22, 08:58 AM
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Originally Posted by urbanknight
I have taken to wearing my musicians earplugs in movie theaters, and a crude dB sensor app on my phone tells me that's a good choice.
I can’t believe how freaking loud some movies are in theaters.
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Old 04-19-22, 09:21 AM
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Originally Posted by urbanknight
Tinnitus is generally a neurological response to hearing loss (so we're not actually hearing a sound), which usually starts at the higher frequencies, and tinnitus has been described as the brain trying to replace those lost pitches. Although sirens have overtones at those frequencies, their fundamental pitches are much lower. I have read that it can in fact be perceived as loud enough to distract someone, and some people will even turn up their TV or radio to try and drown it out, but my personal experience is that the intensity is low enough to hear all other sounds fairly normally. As a matter of fact, the intensity seems louder when I am consciously thinking about it, but otherwise can be ignored when going about my daily business.

That's my rudimentary understanding of it. Hope that helps.

Thank you!
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Old 04-19-22, 12:43 PM
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Originally Posted by prairiepedaler
Hello, there is. I certainly won't post them here though.
Certainly not! That would only substantiate the entire premise of the thread, and you certainly don't want that.
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Old 04-19-22, 03:09 PM
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Years ago i pulled onto the shoulder for an ambulance to pass and once past me I moved back onto the edge of the lane.

Almost got hit by the second one right behind that didn't have the siren on.

Are fire engine and police sirens have less db than an ambulance?
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Old 04-19-22, 03:55 PM
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Originally Posted by GlennR
Years ago i pulled onto the shoulder for an ambulance to pass and once past me I moved back onto the edge of the lane.

Almost got hit by the second one right behind that didn't have the siren on.

Are fire engine and police sirens have less db than an ambulance?

I'm pretty sure the loudest ones around here are fire engines.
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Old 04-20-22, 05:17 PM
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Originally Posted by Rolla
Certainly not! That would only substantiate the entire premise of the thread, and you certainly don't want that.
Nah, not at all. I let people beleive what they want to and it isn't my responsibility to be an evangelical on anything. Experience is the greatest teacher. It is an expensive way to learn sometimes, but the best. Although some don't learn from it.

I initiated the thread to ask if anyone else had similar experiences about the increase in number of ambulances on the road and that's it.
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Old 04-21-22, 10:07 AM
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Originally Posted by prairiepedaler
I let people beleive what they want to and it isn't my responsibility to be an evangelical on anything.
Weak.
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Old 04-21-22, 10:35 AM
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Originally Posted by prairiepedaler
There has been a marked increase in the number of heart and stroke events during this recent timeframe of a year and half with no signs of slowing down. Others have noticed this proliferation of ambulances too, from all over the place.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t2HwvQ3hMgU&t=160s
Originally Posted by prairiepedaler
Nah, not at all. I let people beleive what they want to and it isn't my responsibility to be an evangelical on anything. Experience is the greatest teacher. It is an expensive way to learn sometimes, but the best. Although some don't learn from it.

I initiated the thread to ask if anyone else had similar experiences about the increase in number of ambulances on the road and that's it.
I'm putting this down as an obvious lie. You made a very strong factual assertion and now you're making grand supposedly principled statements that you won't even bother to back it up for....reasons(?).. You're clearly embarrassed by the fact that you can't, and this "not my job" stuff is a rather ineffective smokescreen..

And no, I haven't noticed any dramatic increase in ambulances and I'm highly skeptical that you or anyone else has except maybe at the height of a pandemic wave unless they're in Ukraine right now.
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Old 04-21-22, 08:59 PM
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Not all sirens are the same... When I was riding in the back seat of the bus, our bus had a nice electronic noise maker connected to the PA system. Not all that loud: we could go over the call in route so that everyone on the team knew their role.

That way all the tools we would likely need would go in the house with us. No " where is the IV kit" on scene.

But one of our engines had an old school mechanical Federal siren. That thing was loud, but well below the level of instantaneous damage.

But you couldn't hear what the person sitting next to you was saying. Ever noticed that the crew in any fire apparatus are wearing headsets? You need them to discuss assignments.

And if you want to know why the sirens are so loud look around when an ambulance or fire apparatus goes by. Notice all the cars that don't get out of the way?

I believe that some high end vehicles have noise canceling systems. Same idea as noise canceling headphones. A sound wave with a complementary phase cancels out the sound so the energy reaching the ear is reduced.

​​​​​​No matter. When you hear the siren please just get to the side of the road. And don't match my candidate for all time <expletives deleted> and pass any public safety vehicle traveling lights and siren.

Edit: the reason that an ambulance goes out with a fire apparatus is that it is an OSHA and an NFPA (they set fire fighting standards) requirement. Sometimes things go askew on a fire scene and having the tools needed ready to go can save a life.

And if a fire apparatus goes on a medical call you can be sure that it is a medical quick response team on the apparatus and they will be doing the initial patient care.

Or maybe there is a safety issue that may require their support. You would be amazed at how much of the cost of an emergency response is not billed. At least it was not 10 years ago...

Last edited by DangerousDanR; 04-21-22 at 09:23 PM.
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Old 04-22-22, 12:24 AM
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Originally Posted by DangerousDanR
And if you want to know why the sirens are so loud look around when an ambulance or fire apparatus goes by. Notice all the cars that don't get out of the way?
The thing is, I don't believe for a second that those drivers don't hear or see the vehicle by the time it is upon them. But if so, they're a danger to anyone on the road they are oblivious to the existence of (like cyclists).
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Old 04-22-22, 04:38 AM
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Philly tries to bill for EMT response. I got a $1000+ bill a couple of years ago. The fire station was literally 2 blocks from where I passed out. The ride to the hospital was about 12 blocks. Insurance covered a little bit of the bill. I didn’t pay the rest and the city never pursued me. Excuse me, but what are my substantial city tax dollars for?
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Old 04-22-22, 11:39 AM
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The mother of all sirens is the Federal Signal Corporation Q-Siren mounted on the front of most all fire apparatus in all it's chrome glory, as mentioned by Dangerous Dan.

Rated at 123 decibels at 10 feet.
The Engineer and the Officer up front both have a foot pedal to actuate it. I was driving a brand new engine up to a bad multi car, multi department extrication. A big parade of emergency response on both sides of the interstate. Our Q Siren decided to have a stuck switch or relay or something and would not wind down. As soon as we got there and got stopped it was my responsibility to get out and get a bolt cutter and cut the high amp power supply about a foot behind that screaming sob. I did have my headset on. Shutting the engine down and hitting the master kill switch is never an option.
The Medics around here don't have Q sirens but have an electronic versions with electronic imitation "air horns". Still loud.
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Old 04-23-22, 04:49 PM
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Originally Posted by 10 Wheels
This is Serous Thread.

Friend was hit by an ambulance.,
Punchered Lung, Broken shoulder, Broken arm.
Brain damage
5 Cracked Ribs
Why didn't he yield?
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Old 05-01-22, 02:14 PM
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People are under a lot more stress with the pandemic problems for those in the working classes. I avoid areas with high traffic volumes as far too many drivers are distracted by their cell phones or drive while eating a burger or drinking a cup of coffee or a soft drink or a beer. Auto accident of all types have increased greatly with the advent of cell phones and in my state there is a law that prohibits hold a phone while driving but it is never enforced and few motorists bother to go hands free.

Most roads where I have ridden my bike for decades are now not safe for cyclists and not worth the risk. Two friends have been hit by motorists in the past two years and one had a broken collar bone and the other had three broken ribs and they were lucky to survive at all.
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