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Looking for 700c 36 hole rim that isn't a tank

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Looking for 700c 36 hole rim that isn't a tank

Old 04-20-22, 03:37 PM
  #1  
JWK
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Looking for 700c 36 hole rim that isn't a tank

Since we're still in the pandemic insanity when it comes to buying bikes, I'm trying to see if I can build a new set of wheels for my Surly Disc Trucker. I'm using the stock wheels, which are Alex Adventure (or something like that). They have an ID of about 17mm. They are fine for the 37mm panaracers I've been using, but when I put on a 42mm tire things got a bit uncomfortable. I had to add enough pressure to the point where they rode just like my 37s, so off they came.

My rides are typically 30 to 35 miles for a casual spin, and 40 to 50 miles when I have more time in the day. I take my time and I just want to be comfortable. I deal with really rough, broken pavement, and I ride on as many dirt roads as I can possibly find. Most of these are better than the broken asphalt, but some are really nothing more than jeep trails. My plan is to get RH Snoqualmie Pass tires (42mm true size) and go with tubeless to get the most cush I can get.

I don't really want to invest in new wheels. My next bike (now overdue - thanks pandemic) will be thru axles, so I don't want to put money in wheels that will only be used for a year (hopefully). I thought I would take my wheels apart and use the Deore hubs and build a new wheel with rims that are 22 - 24 ID, and aren't heavy touring tanks. However, except for heavy duty rims, 36 hole hoops do not seem available. However, I don't know much about wheel building, so I may not know where to look.

Does anyone know where I can look for a 36 hole rim? All I can find is the Velocity Cliffhangers, which are sturdy touring type rims and very heavy. If I can't make these wheels a significant notch lighter than my stock wheels, I just won't bother. Maybe someone has suggestions on where to look for a wheelset that fits the criteria without getting pricey. I figure spokes and rims shouldn't cost more than $200 or so. It would be hard (if not impossible) to find a wheelset in that price range. I'm fine with taking care of Shimano cup and cone hubs. I've been doing it all my life.

As a final note, I did consider purchasing some decent wheels with DT Swiss hubs that can convert from QR to TA. However, there is a good possibility that my next bike will have boost spacing, so there goes that.

Thanks for any info or suggestions.
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Old 04-20-22, 03:50 PM
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Velocity A23 comes in 36 hole I think as well and should be lighter than the cliffhangers
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Old 04-20-22, 03:59 PM
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Why do you need 36 hole wheels? 32 hole wheels would be plenty.
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Old 04-20-22, 06:04 PM
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Originally Posted by prj71 View Post
Why do you need 36 hole wheels? 32 hole wheels would be plenty.
Already answered:

Originally Posted by JWK View Post
I don't really want to invest in new wheels. My next bike (now overdue - thanks pandemic) will be thru axles, so I don't want to put money in wheels that will only be used for a year (hopefully). I thought I would take my wheels apart and use the Deore hubs and build a new wheel with rims that are 22 - 24 ID, and aren't heavy touring tanks. .
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Old 04-20-22, 06:58 PM
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I use Sun m13ii rims, but I only go as wide as 28mm.

I hear Sun cr-18 rims are popular with folks that use much wider rubber.
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Old 04-20-22, 08:17 PM
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DT Swiss 545d 700c rims should fit the bill. They're available in 32 and 36 hole versions and were aimed at the ebike market when it was still fairly niche, before the DT Swiss hybrid products came about. They are pinned and tough as nails, handling loads of 150 kgs and really cheap if you buy from the European online retailers like Bike24. Check to see how heavy they are, but it shouldn't matter that much on a LHT.

Also, DT Swiss have a new HU 1900 wheelset in Boost and QR (with no 142&100 TA option Edit: although maybe you could use a DT Swiss conversion kit to change a QR wheelset to 142&100 TA?), HU being Hybrid Utility, designed for touring eBikes and carrying a load of up to 180 kgs. Absolutely perfect for fully loaded touring bikes and maybe fitting the bill for your new bike? I often plan to buy a new bike and swap the wheelset out with a DT Swiss 1900 series eBike wheel to handle the combined weight of my body and bags etc.

I actually have a wheelset being rebuilt at the moment with one of those 545d rims and a new deore hub, replacing a torn XT hub. Probably destined for some guy's touring bike, because I just make Shimano hubs pitted, no matter how often the bearings are changed and fresh grease applied. I get along much better with DT swiss hubs.
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Old 04-20-22, 10:40 PM
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Both the Sun CR18 and the Velocity a23 others recommended won't be any wider than the rims you have so not much use. The bigger issue you're running into is 36h has really become synonymous with heavy duty and lighter isn't a big consideration with HD, while most modern rims with the best features and weight come in at 32 and 28h. Best I could think of is available on ebay https://www.ebay.com/itm/25547721258...AAAOSwzupiT5iq
Halo makes some decent stuff, 36h, supposedly tubeless compatible and 21mm internal, you didn't state wheel size but I assumed 700c though I know the LHT does use other wheel sizes. Otherwise can't think of much that meets you're criteria. Future wheels when you're building are better of being 32h with heavy duty spokes, I use wheelsmith 13/14 single butted spokes on my touring bike with 32h. Much more rim and hub choices available at this spoke count and the thicker spoke heads make up for the deficiency. Spokes I typically buy from ebay for cheap or check out BMX guru, who sells fairly cheap spokes cut to length, as cheap as .25 per spoke in some sizes and usually about .50 for a basic spoke.
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Old 04-21-22, 12:20 AM
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imi
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Are Mavic A719 regarded as ”tanks”.

I believe the somewhat cheaper A319 is heavier
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Old 04-21-22, 07:11 AM
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I know this is not what you are asking, but since you will already be investing in new rims and (most likely) new spokes and the expense or time of a wheelset build, do you really want to limit your rim options and lose an existing wheelset just to re-use a set of Deore hubs?

I know you said you don’t want to invest in new wheels, but with the plan you outline, you are basically already doing that.

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Old 04-21-22, 07:19 AM
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If you are asking where to look for rims, then try here.

https://www.universalcycles.com/shop...p?category=856

Check the filters on the top of the left hand sidebar. You can select to show only products that are in stock. They seem to have a lot of 700C rims. Don't know if any are 36 hole.

They also sell complete wheel sets and will custom build a wheel set for you.

https://www.universalcycles.com/wheelkit.php
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Old 04-21-22, 07:28 AM
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Originally Posted by JWK View Post
Since we're still in the pandemic insanity when it comes to buying bikes, I'm trying to see if I can build a new set of wheels for my Surly Disc Trucker. I'm using the stock wheels, which are Alex Adventure (or something like that). They have an ID of about 17mm. They are fine for the 37mm panaracers I've been using, but when I put on a 42mm tire things got a bit uncomfortable. I had to add enough pressure to the point where they rode just like my 37s, so off they came.
I thought I would take my wheels apart and use the Deore hubs and build a new wheel with rims that are 22 - 24 ID, and aren't heavy touring tanks.
https://www.modernbike.com/36-700c-rims


Some options to look thru.

I am not aware of a 36h rim that is 22-24mm wide internal AND light. Something like this is wide enough, but not light- https://www.modernbike.com/velo-oran...isc-silver-36h and same goes for this one- https://www.modernbike.com/sun-ringl...s-presta-valve

Best of luck in the search.
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Old 04-21-22, 07:58 AM
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I would think the first step is to weigh the wheels you currently have. Some Alex rims are quite heavy. You might be riding on 2500 gram wheels (less rotors/bolts, cassette, skewers). If that is the case, even a Rhyno Lite wouldn’t be more of a tank.

It has already been pointed out that by the time you buy rims and spokes you might be close to the cost of an inexpensive 32 hole wheelset (Deore/Rhyno Lite).

For a year’s worth of use, it might be better to keep your current wheels, buy another set, and sell them for half what you paid a year from now.

John
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Old 04-21-22, 12:23 PM
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I can think of a couple light and wider 700C rims available in 36-hole, but the prices ($85 and up, each) probably don't make sense for wheels you only expect to ride for a year. I invest my dollars and time in "keeper" wheels that I plan to use for a long time.

It seems to me that there are still lots of options for 36-spoke wheels, so I wouldn't let trends or fashion alone dissuade me from building up more of them. It's not as big a deal for the front wheel, of course.

BTW, "ID" stands for "inner diameter" and isn't the right term to use for the inner width of a rim.
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Old 04-22-22, 05:00 PM
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I’ve been using the Snoqualmie Pass tire you mention long enough to have worn out a few. No problem at all on 17mm rims. Currently on Velocity Dyads which were a good buy, but not the greatest or the lightest. They work fine at about 18.5 internal.

If I were getting new rims first choice would be Pacenti Brevet. Second choice H+Son TB-14. Sun CR-18 has been hyper variable in quality over the decades, current production looks very good a few years now. All of these are light enough. Availability in 36 for any might need a search. I wouldn’t even enquire which was a millimeter wider or narrower.

Published weights are notoriously unreliable and then there is sample variance. Width varies less but it does vary. If you were going tubeless and pushing the tires very hard on sketchy trails and you were very sensitive and very discriminating yes there could be a small performance advantage to wider rims.

Jan Heine who sells the Snoqualmie and uses the equivalent 650B on his own rides mounts them on Pacenti. Those were once 17, think they are 18 now,
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Old 04-22-22, 07:09 PM
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I hade some H-Plus son wheels built up with ultegra hubs in 36 and they are awesome. Not extremely light but lighter than others. Has a aero profile and rolls awesome!
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Old 04-23-22, 11:59 PM
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My bike had Alexrim 36 hole A23 rims stock. I had a second wheelset built with 36 hole Velocity Dyads for more rough riding or carrying a light load. Since you were looking at Velocity Cliffhangers @ 675g, I was going to say take a look at the Velocity Dyads @ 525g (150g or 5.24 oz. lighter) which fit up to 38mm tires. I have been running 36 hole Dyads since 2019 with great results using Rene Herse Stampede Pass 32mm tires and Schwalbe 700C x 18-26 mm Superlight (SV20), 65g tubes. The SV18 tubes are closer in size, but I have had no issues when I went from the 28mm Chinook Pass on the A23s to the 32s on the Dyads using the same tubes. I am was considering moving to possibly the 35mm Bon Jon Pass or more likely the 38mm Barlow Pass, both using Schwalbe UL tubes.

I have the Velocity Velo Plugs in my Dyad rims and love them. Even with being a near Clyde, I have not had to do any truing since I have had them.
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Old 04-24-22, 05:02 PM
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Thank you everyone for the suggestions and info. I know a lot more after reading through this and looking things up than I did a number of days ago. Yeah, 36 holes and light do not go together anymore. It looks like I'll be spending a good chunk of change for new wheels, or build something up a lot cheaper (sun ringle rhyno lite), heavier, and without the ability for tubeless. More decisions and trade-offs.

What I really want is a new bike, but we all know how that is going right now. I just asked one of my local LBS when they thought they would have any Jamis bikes. They said they might see something trickle in this coming fall, but they're not counting on it. Same story everywhere around here.
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Old 04-24-22, 05:42 PM
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Originally Posted by prj71 View Post
Why do you need 36 hole wheels? 32 hole wheels would be plenty.
36 spokes makes the wheel stronger.... 32 may be plenty for most people but some of us prefer a little bit of extra durability.
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Old 04-25-22, 12:05 AM
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Velocity A23
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Old 04-25-22, 07:04 AM
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Originally Posted by wolfchild View Post
36 spokes makes the wheel stronger.... 32 may be plenty for most people but some of us prefer a little bit of extra durability.
I am convinced that 36 straight gauge spokes on a 14mm deep rim is not as strong as 32 double butted spokes on a 30mm rim. There is absolutely more to wheel reliability than a simple spoke count.
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