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Why don't people want to pedal anymore?

Old 09-15-22, 01:31 PM
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Originally Posted by TurboTrueno
I applaud all the ebikers doing big exercise here. All I see are commuters zooming up hills with legs motionless

The bike in post 52 looks really fun
Think of the Blerch whenever you see a throttle ebike. The Blerch mentality is taking over America. https://theoatmeal.com/comics/running
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Old 09-15-22, 01:40 PM
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Originally Posted by Doubleplay
It's perfectly normal in a country where almost half of the people are obese.
I keep thinking of the people on board the space ship in Wall-E.
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Old 09-15-22, 02:30 PM
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Originally Posted by prj71
Ain't that the truth. They aren't going to lose any weight riding those e-bikes.
taken at some point along an 8hr, 117 mile ride in which i burned 5,500 calories and used 93wh of battery power:





the motor assist equates to about 10 watts per hour of effective power (hardly meaningful) but enabled rides like this for me, knowing that if i ran out of gas on the way home up a huge hill into the wind i’d still make it safely.

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Old 09-15-22, 08:11 PM
  #204  
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You guys are all a bunch grumpy Puritans.
Not every time you get on a bike has to be a dedicated workout and festival of suffering.

Sure, I do focused workouts on my bike ( I also run and lift weights, too) but I like using a bike to get around, too. You can get farther, faster than you can on foot, but also get to places that you can’t reach by car, either. (and less hassle than finding parking)

If the only reason you ride a bike is “to do X miles “ then, yeah, I can see how you’d feel like an e-bike is ‘cheating’.
Recreation or transportation, though, doesn’t need to be a workout; I think the e-bike gets a lot of people out of their cars for those shorter trips where a regular bike would feel like too much work.
Sometimes you just want to go out and enjoy the scenery.
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Old 09-15-22, 08:42 PM
  #205  
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Hello, my name is RSBob and I’m a grumpy Puritans.
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Old 09-15-22, 09:01 PM
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Originally Posted by mschwett
taken at some point along an 8hr, 117 mile ride in which i burned 5,500 calories and used 93wh of battery power:





the motor assist equates to about 10 watts per hour of effective power (hardly meaningful) but enabled rides like this for me, knowing that if i ran out of gas on the way home up a huge hill into the wind i’d still make it safely.

what does 10 watts per hour mean?
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Old 09-15-22, 09:18 PM
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Originally Posted by LarrySellerz
what does 10 watts per hour mean?
It means very little battery was used. The rider averaged 174 watts for almost ten hours and it was the equivalent of the rider putting out 184 watts over the same ten hour period. That’s a pretty stout ride!
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Old 09-15-22, 09:30 PM
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Originally Posted by prj71
Ain't that the truth. They aren't going to lose any weight riding those e-bikes.
Do you know how many calories you’ve burned on your bike this year? I can use VeloViewer to know for my ebike. I’d like to compare.

Or kilojoules or watt hours. VeloViewer will allow CSV export so if you use Strava the data is pretty easy to access. I’ll post my numbers tomorrow.

Last edited by MattTheHat; 09-15-22 at 09:41 PM.
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Old 09-15-22, 10:20 PM
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Originally Posted by wolfchild
Not unless their battery gets discharged and they're forced to pedal a 60 - 70 pound bike
LOL
My Rohloff14 tour bike is 73+ lbs all the time. I do up to 130 mile rides with NO cheater E. Maybe a dead E is a bigger drag, I don't know. Also used with a SA XL-RD5w.
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Old 09-15-22, 11:33 PM
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Originally Posted by GamblerGORD53
LOL
My Rohloff14 tour bike is 73+ lbs all the time. I do up to 130 mile rides with NO cheater E. Maybe a dead E is a bigger drag, I don't know. Also used with a SA XL-RD5w.
depends on the type of motor - but better e-bikes don't drag at all when the motor is off, other than the weight. good mid-drives have a clutch mechanism of sorts which disconnects the majority of the motor from the crank when not powered. there are similar mechanisms for many hub motors, although with those you are still spinning the motor's magnets and windings around.

it's not cheating unless there are rules. i'm not aware of anyone's rules applying to my commute.
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Old 09-16-22, 02:25 AM
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Originally Posted by prj71
There is a 52 mile paved bike trail about an hour from home that I will ride at least once a year. I've been riding this trail for 7 years now.

This past weekend I spent a day riding it and was amazed that roughly ~80% of the users I encountered were on e-bikes and the majority of them were young people...20's and 30's. Not the older people that may have some disability or other physical limitation that would otherwise prevent them from riding. This is something that I never seen before in the years I've been riding it and found it somewhat disturbing.

Then to top it off...some of them almost ran into me causing a crash. You could tell that they lacked biked handling skills (probably their 3rd time riding a bike in years) and were weaving all over the trail instead of sticking to the side and normally wouldn't be riding that fast if they had to pedal.

I just don't get this e-bike craze.
For commuting time, electric bikes can reach their destination faster than trampling them.
When faced with longer commuting distances, trampling can make them tired and not invest more quickly, while electric bikes can make them effortless.
But I think that while young people buy electric bikes, they also need to understand the basic operation skills, normal traffic regulations, rather than let them rampage.
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Old 09-16-22, 02:31 AM
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I like to pedal, at least it's kind of free compared to the fuel prices. But I always sweat a lot. which is not good if you are going to meet someone formally or informally.
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Old 09-16-22, 07:54 AM
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Originally Posted by mschwett
taken at some point along an 8hr, 117 mile ride in which i burned 5,500 calories and used 93wh of battery power:
Nice ride. Nothing bad about that.

However...A person riding that same route on a regular bike without any e-assist would have burned way more calories.

Here is a recent ride I did on my road bike which is not an e-bike. Notice that I rode 7 less miles than you, had half the elevation and yet my calories burned are pretty close to yours.


Last edited by prj71; 09-16-22 at 08:03 AM.
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Old 09-16-22, 08:12 AM
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Originally Posted by prj71
Nice ride. Nothing bad about that.

However...A person riding that same route on a regular bike without any e-assist would have burned way more calories.

Here is a recent ride I did on my road bike which is not an e-bike. Notice that I rode 7 less miles than you, had half the elevation and yet my calories burned are pretty close to yours.

actually, since i know that 92wh of battery was used, i can say pretty definitively that the same ride with the motor turned off the entire ride (it was turned off 90% of the time) would have burned about 280 more calories. so… no, not “way more calories.” science is cool that way, especially with a power meter.

comparing calories burned between two people, different bikes, one with a power meter and one without is nowhere near reliable.

you also would have burned more calories per mile because you were going much faster, which is the key driver of cycling energy consumption on level ground! i’m slow.
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Old 09-16-22, 08:19 AM
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I think it's caring
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Old 09-16-22, 08:48 AM
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For commuters without the benefit of a shower at their employer, who tend to sweat (not their employer, but the commuter) a pedal assist e-bike, in my humble opinion, makes perfect sense. It is a conveyance other than a gas vehicle, which is wonderful in itself and they can get a much or as little exercise as they want. The person can enjoy the outdoors, cars, exhaust, terrifying noise of a double dump truck bearing down on them, near-death experiences and not get to work a sweaty mess. If those were my circumstances, I would jump at one.

Full disclaimer, my wife has a pedal assist e-bike, and she used to do centuries on a conventional bike. She was never able to keep up with me other than on our tandem, and now we can ride together for the first time since the tandem is too painful with her RA. I have nothing but praise for the one she owns, Specialized Como.
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Old 09-16-22, 09:00 AM
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Originally Posted by mschwett
actually, since i know that 92wh of battery was used, i can say pretty definitively that the same ride with the motor turned off the entire ride (it was turned off 90% of the time) would have burned about 280 more calories. so… no, not “way more calories.” science is cool that way, especially with a power meter.
So since the motor was turned off 90% of the time, it sounds like you have good fitness. Which then begs the question of why are you riding an e-bike?

With the motor turned on for only 10% of that ride I'm sure you could have done the whole thing without e-assist because the bike would be lighter offsetting how much harder you had to push for that 10%.
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Old 09-16-22, 09:04 AM
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Originally Posted by rsbob
For commuters without the benefit of a shower at their employer, who tend to sweat (not their employer, but the commuter) a pedal assist e-bike, in my humble opinion, makes perfect sense. It is a conveyance other than a gas vehicle, which is wonderful in itself and they can get a much or as little exercise as they want. The person can enjoy the outdoors, cars, exhaust, terrifying noise of a double dump truck bearing down on them, near-death experiences and not get to work a sweaty mess. If those were my circumstances, I would jump at one.
I have thought about buying an e-bike for commuting to work so I don't arrive sweaty. But I haven't pulled the trigger due to a house remodeling project sucking my $$ right now. Until then I'll keep driving my gas guzzling V-8 truck 2 miles to work every day.
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Old 09-16-22, 09:55 AM
  #219  
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Originally Posted by rsbob
Hello, my name is RSBob and I’m a grumpy Puritans.
Grumpy Puritans=Retro Grouch. Now go back to riding your Schwinn Varsity. LOL!

Last edited by Jan Feetz; 09-16-22 at 09:59 AM. Reason: spell check
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Old 09-16-22, 11:24 AM
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Originally Posted by Jan Feetz
Grumpy Puritans=Retro Grouch. Now go back to riding your Schwinn Varsity. LOL!
Let’s hear it for the Nederlanders!
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Old 09-16-22, 11:53 AM
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Originally Posted by prj71
There is a 52 mile paved bike trail about an hour from home that I will ride at least once a year. I've been riding this trail for 7 years now.

This past weekend I spent a day riding it and was amazed that roughly ~80% of the users I encountered were on e-bikes and the majority of them were young people...20's and 30's. Not the older people that may have some disability or other physical limitation that would otherwise prevent them from riding. This is something that I never seen before in the years I've been riding it and found it somewhat disturbing.

Then to top it off...some of them almost ran into me causing a crash. You could tell that they lacked biked handling skills (probably their 3rd time riding a bike in years) and were weaving all over the trail instead of sticking to the side and normally wouldn't be riding that fast if they had to pedal.

I just don't get this e-bike craze.
This too shall pass. A couple decades ago when dirt cheap 49cc scooters and minibikes showed up they were all over town riding sgainst traffic, hopping curbs and crossing four lanes of traffic. Then they disappeared. Ebikes won’t dissapear but they’ll get socialized eventually. Same thing happened w mtn bikes in the 80’s out on hiking trails when hikers and horse riders were being terrorized by high speed descenders.
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Old 09-16-22, 12:24 PM
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Originally Posted by I_like_e_bike
For commuting time, electric bikes can reach their destination faster than trampling them.
When faced with longer commuting distances, trampling can make them tired and not invest more quickly, while electric bikes can make them effortless.
But I think that while young people buy electric bikes, they also need to understand the basic operation skills, normal traffic regulations, rather than let them rampage.
Rampage? Like this? Suprised this is not reported more often. That though, would be a different thread.
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Old 09-16-22, 01:01 PM
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Originally Posted by prj71
Ain't that the truth. They aren't going to lose any weight riding those e-bikes.
Originally Posted by MattTheHat
Do you know how many calories you’ve burned on your bike this year? I can use VeloViewer to know for my ebike. I’d like to compare.

Or kilojoules or watt hours. VeloViewer will allow CSV export so if you use Strava the data is pretty easy to access. I’ll post my numbers tomorrow.


To follow up, I downloaded the CSV file and looked at just my ebike riding this year. Came to 164,444 calories so far, almost on pace for a quarter million calories for 2022.
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Old 09-16-22, 01:52 PM
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Originally Posted by Ironfish653
You guys are all a bunch grumpy Puritans.
Not every time you get on a bike has to be a dedicated workout and festival of suffering.

Sure, I do focused workouts on my bike ( I also run and lift weights, too) but I like using a bike to get around, too. You can get farther, faster than you can on foot, but also get to places that you can’t reach by car, either. (and less hassle than finding parking)

If the only reason you ride a bike is “to do X miles “ then, yeah, I can see how you’d feel like an e-bike is ‘cheating’.
Recreation or transportation, though, doesn’t need to be a workout; I think the e-bike gets a lot of people out of their cars for those shorter trips where a regular bike would feel like too much work.
Sometimes you just want to go out and enjoy the scenery.
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Old 09-16-22, 03:23 PM
  #225  
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Originally Posted by prj71
It's not about the distance. It's about the effort. No way anyone on an e-bike gets the same exercise benefit as a regular bike.
I leave mine on the lowest setting and I get just as tired. I tend not to ride as far on my regular bike but that's me.
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