'I just can't stop': Cyclist dies after confessing he was addicted to riding
12-07-22, 03:24 PM
#101
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Originally Posted by rsbob
Nothing that a coffee colon cleanse and a tin foil hat wouldn’t have prevented. Gallos humor, sorry, not sorry.
First hand experience? Perhaps. Perhaps not.
First hand experience? Perhaps. Perhaps not.
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12-07-22, 03:26 PM
#102
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...I knew this thread would take off, if I just gave it enough time.
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12-07-22, 03:27 PM
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Originally Posted by Koyote
I'm reminded of Jim Fixx, who wrote The Complete Book of Running -- and then dropped dead at age 52 on his daily run. Standup comics had a field day with that, but his autopsy and history suggested that he would've died even younger if not for the running. (Congenital heart problems and previously unhealthy lifestyle.)
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12-07-22, 03:29 PM
#104
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Originally Posted by 3alarmer
...I knew this thread would take off, if I just gave it enough time.
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12-07-22, 03:45 PM
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Originally Posted by 3alarmer
...I knew this thread would take off, if I just gave it enough time.
Everyone in that GIF is dead. Think it's just a coincidence?
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12-07-22, 03:47 PM
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Originally Posted by genejockey
But he had made a poor choice of ancestry.
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12-07-22, 04:29 PM
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Originally Posted by genejockey
Gallos humor? What's so funny about roosters?
12-07-22, 04:31 PM
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You cannot be too fit. Too fat?
https://www.jacc.org/doi/10.1016/j.jacc.2022.05.031
Results
During follow-up (median 10.2 years, 7,803,861 person-years of observation), 174,807 subjects died, averaging 22.4 events per 1,000 person-years. The adjusted association of CRF and mortality risk was inverse and graded across the age spectrum, sex, and race. The lowest mortality risk was observed at approximately 14.0 METs for men (HR: 0.24; 95% CI: 0.23-0.25) and women (HR: 0.23; 95% CI: 0.17-0.29), with no evidence of an increase in risk with extremely high CRF. The risk for least fit individuals (20th percentile) was 4-fold higher (HR: 4.09; 95% CI: 3.90-4.20) compared with extremely fit individuals.
12-07-22, 04:46 PM
#109
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Originally Posted by indyfabz
Fify
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12-07-22, 06:39 PM
#110
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Originally Posted by GhostRider62
You cannot be too fit. Too fat?
https://www.jacc.org/doi/10.1016/j.jacc.2022.05.031
Results
During follow-up (median 10.2 years, 7,803,861 person-years of observation), 174,807 subjects died, averaging 22.4 events per 1,000 person-years. The adjusted association of CRF and mortality risk was inverse and graded across the age spectrum, sex, and race. The lowest mortality risk was observed at approximately 14.0 METs for men (HR: 0.24; 95% CI: 0.23-0.25) and women (HR: 0.23; 95% CI: 0.17-0.29), with no evidence of an increase in risk with extremely high CRF. The risk for least fit individuals (20th percentile) was 4-fold higher (HR: 4.09; 95% CI: 3.90-4.20) compared with extremely fit individuals.https://www.jacc.org/doi/10.1016/j.jacc.2022.05.031
- CRF - cardiorespiratory fitness
- MET - metabolic equivalent of task (one MET is the energy used while sitting quietly). A measure of fitness.
- HR - health risk (risk of mortality)
- 95% CI - ninety-nine percent confidence interval
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12-07-22, 06:48 PM
#111
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Originally Posted by livedarklions
Obviously, if he wasn't going above zone 2, he wasn't doing HIIT any more, and there's no telling from the article when he stopped. It could've been years ago.
There's really no telling what caused his heart problems, especially with the very, very limited information we have available and neither of us being pathologists.
If he was having chest pains associated with any level of exertion, he should have had it checked out, but that's a lot less attractive as click bit as "his cycling habit killed him".
There's really no telling what caused his heart problems, especially with the very, very limited information we have available and neither of us being pathologists.
If he was having chest pains associated with any level of exertion, he should have had it checked out, but that's a lot less attractive as click bit as "his cycling habit killed him".
He did report chest pains while exercising at high zone 2, which is a classic symptom of a coronary blockage.
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Last edited by terrymorse; 12-07-22 at 06:58 PM.
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12-07-22, 06:54 PM
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The key takeaway in the summary, "The risk for least fit individuals (20th percentile) was 4-fold higher (HR: 4.09; 95% CI: 3.90-4.20) compared with extremely fit individuals." Or the conclusion statement, "No increased risk was observed with extreme fitness. Being unfit carried a greater risk than any of the cardiac risk factors examined." was also pretty good.
There have been other studies showing retention of VO2 max as well as possible in old age is inversely correlated with mortality and is the biggest factor. Training volume is the best way to increase and also to maintain VO2 max. None of the four Cardiologists that I have been evaluated by had any objection to my training volume and it was more than 2,000km per month at the time. They were all high fiving me and telling me not to stop. Listen to your Docs. I listen to mine. 2000km in a month? That is a modest amount on a long distance tour.
There have been other studies showing retention of VO2 max as well as possible in old age is inversely correlated with mortality and is the biggest factor. Training volume is the best way to increase and also to maintain VO2 max. None of the four Cardiologists that I have been evaluated by had any objection to my training volume and it was more than 2,000km per month at the time. They were all high fiving me and telling me not to stop. Listen to your Docs. I listen to mine. 2000km in a month? That is a modest amount on a long distance tour.
Originally Posted by terrymorse
That's an awful lot of acronyms! Here's a cheat sheet:
- CRF - cardiorespiratory fitness
- MET - metabolic equivalent of task (one MET is the energy used while sitting quietly). A measure of fitness.
- HR - health risk (risk of mortality)
- 95% CI - ninety-nine percent confidence interval
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12-07-22, 08:37 PM
#113
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Originally Posted by genejockey
Gallos humor? What's so funny about chickens?
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12-07-22, 09:28 PM
#114
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Originally Posted by rsbob
Earnest and Julio to be precise.
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12-08-22, 08:55 AM
#115
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Originally Posted by terrymorse
That's an awful lot of acronyms! Here's a cheat sheet:
- CRF - cardiorespiratory fitness
- MET - metabolic equivalent of task (one MET is the energy used while sitting quietly). A measure of fitness.
- HR - health risk (risk of mortality)
- 95% CI - ninety-nine percent confidence interval
Originally Posted by GhostRider62
The key takeaway in the summary, "The risk for least fit individuals (20th percentile) was 4-fold higher (HR: 4.09; 95% CI: 3.90-4.20) compared with extremely fit individuals." Or the conclusion statement, "No increased risk was observed with extreme fitness. Being unfit carried a greater risk than any of the cardiac risk factors examined." was also pretty good.
There have been other studies showing retention of VO2 max as well as possible in old age is inversely correlated with mortality and is the biggest factor. Training volume is the best way to increase and also to maintain VO2 max. None of the four Cardiologists that I have been evaluated by had any objection to my training volume and it was more than 2,000km per month at the time. They were all high fiving me and telling me not to stop. Listen to your Docs. I listen to mine. 2000km in a month? That is a modest amount on a long distance tour.
There have been other studies showing retention of VO2 max as well as possible in old age is inversely correlated with mortality and is the biggest factor. Training volume is the best way to increase and also to maintain VO2 max. None of the four Cardiologists that I have been evaluated by had any objection to my training volume and it was more than 2,000km per month at the time. They were all high fiving me and telling me not to stop. Listen to your Docs. I listen to mine. 2000km in a month? That is a modest amount on a long distance tour.
I hate to speculate on a particular case, but it sure sounds like the guy discussed in the OP didn't tell his doctor about his chest pains because he just assumed he was too fit for a heart attack to occur.
I absolutely agree with Ghostrider that one should listen to the individualized advice given to you by a doctor, but the advice of the doctor is only going to be as good as the quality of information she has to work from.
BTW, when I did have a blood clot induced heart attack, I was told that my extreme fitness may very well have saved my life.
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12-08-22, 10:32 AM
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Forum members are not stupid.
Every medicine has risk. And benefit.
Metformin for metabolically disadvantaged has nowhere near the benefit to the entire population as exercise and reasonable diet would have been.
If a member has a medical condition and their Doc places restrictions, of course follow them. OTOH, if they like going on 4-5 hour hikes everyday is good, tee it up and let it fly. Want to ride your bike cross country over 4 month? I doubt any single thing would improve the vast majority of fat Americans than a long slow tour.
Every medicine has risk. And benefit.
Metformin for metabolically disadvantaged has nowhere near the benefit to the entire population as exercise and reasonable diet would have been.
If a member has a medical condition and their Doc places restrictions, of course follow them. OTOH, if they like going on 4-5 hour hikes everyday is good, tee it up and let it fly. Want to ride your bike cross country over 4 month? I doubt any single thing would improve the vast majority of fat Americans than a long slow tour.
12-08-22, 12:24 PM
#117
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Originally Posted by GhostRider62
Forum members are not stupid.
Every medicine has risk. And benefit.
Metformin for metabolically disadvantaged has nowhere near the benefit to the entire population as exercise and reasonable diet would have been.
If a member has a medical condition and their Doc places restrictions, of course follow them. OTOH, if they like going on 4-5 hour hikes everyday is good, tee it up and let it fly. Want to ride your bike cross country over 4 month? I doubt any single thing would improve the vast majority of fat Americans than a long slow tour.
Every medicine has risk. And benefit.
Metformin for metabolically disadvantaged has nowhere near the benefit to the entire population as exercise and reasonable diet would have been.
If a member has a medical condition and their Doc places restrictions, of course follow them. OTOH, if they like going on 4-5 hour hikes everyday is good, tee it up and let it fly. Want to ride your bike cross country over 4 month? I doubt any single thing would improve the vast majority of fat Americans than a long slow tour.
Who said anything about people being stupid? I don't think people have to be stupid to rationalize away an existential threat, just human with all our capacity to want to believe the best. All I said was that people should seek advice if they have what appear to be heart symptoms even if they are super-fit. Just FYI, in the two years post heart attack, I believe I've done about 50 or so solo rides of a 100 miles or greater.
I get that you can't be honest and quote me when you're arguing wth me, but this one baffles me. I was agreeing with you about following doctor's advice, just pointing out that if you omit telling the doctor you're having chest pains, that advice isn't going to be based on sound information.
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12-08-22, 06:15 PM
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Originally Posted by genejockey
He also outlived his father by a few years at least, which he might not have done without the running. But he had made a poor choice of ancestry.
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12-09-22, 08:51 AM
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His cycling was actually alerting the guy to his heart condition. His only mistake was ignoring the symptoms.
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