Hooked wheel question
 

Only been riding for 2 years but soon I'm getting my first "serious" road bike with carbon wheels which I've never used before so please don't laugh if the question is dumb but...

I've read countless arguments between people about why hookless wheels are safe or unsafe and so I've decided to go with the reserve 40/44s and I don't think at this point you can convince me to go hookless so my question is: are tubeless setups all together unsafe or is a hooked rim safe to ride tubeless? As I understood the issue isn't necessarily with the tubeless setup per say but it is with the wheel not being hooked. Therefore it is safe to ride tubeless with a hooked rim is this correct?
Thanks very much for input in advance.

Yes, tubeless tyres are safe on hooked rims.

Some tubeless tires are safe on hooked rims, but not all of them.

https://www.bikeradar.com/features/h...road-tubeless/

For example, any Continental tire more than two years old is not hookless-compatible.

Some wheel manufacturers like Zipp make the effort to list all of the tires which are certified with their wheels, and those that are not.

https://www.sram.com/en/zipp/campaig...-compatibility

One needs to make certain that the particular tire in-question is compatible with hookless rims. Also, the maximum allowed pressure of a tire may be different on hooked versus hookless rims, which is another facet to pay your attention to.

Pete, you will want to be more circumspect about providing potentially-dangerous advice, lest you get someone hurt.

Which tubeless tyres are NOT compatible with HOOKED rims?

The OP clearly stated that they are not interested in hookless rims at this point.

You consistently make yourself look like an idiot in every thread you enter.

Yes. I just read the entire Bike Radar article and skimmed the other one. Didn't see anything about it being unsafe to use tubeless tires with hooked rims, but plenty about the reverse.

This non-sequitur from TC1's post was particularly puzzling:

"Some tubeless tires are safe on hooked rims, but not all of them.

https://www.bikeradar.com/features/h...road-tubeless/

For example, any Continental tire more than two years old is not hookless-compatible."

What does the fact that older Continental tires are not hookless compatible have to do with whether tubeless tires are safe on hooked rims?

Reiterating your question: which, if any, hookless-compatible tires are not safe to mount on hooked rims?

On the plus side, I learned from the Bike Radar article that the reason some rim manufacturers rushed into production of hookless road rim designs is that molding hooked carbon rims is more difficult and costly than extruding hooked aluminum rims.

By the way, I enjoyed the part of a DT statement in that article that included a sly dig at other manufacturers:

' However, for road wheels, DT is committed to hooked rims. “For us, a more intensive manufacturing process is not an obstacle and within the R&D of new high-end wheels we have proven in measurements that there are no performance disadvantages in aerodynamics and rolling resistance,” says Eggert. '

From the product page

https://reservewheels.com/products/r...-44-road-wheel

“The 40/44 is designed to be your no fuss all round riding and climbing wheel set. There are no weight limits, no tire limitations and can be set up tubeless or with tubes”

There are tubeless tires that are for hooked/crochet rims. So I'm not certain why the OP seems to pose that going to tubeless tires will require smooth bead or hookless rims.

And the word "safe" always gets thrown around in the mix. At the speed most cyclists ride, a tire rolling off the rim or burping air is just going to result in one having to come to a stop and address the issue. Not a automatic trip to the hospital.

Hookless rims have been around since they were made of stamped steel. High pressure is where the conflict lies.

Tires can and do blow off the rim today, just the same as they did in 1972. Above and beyond all the modern advanced in manufacturing tolerance improvements, over pressurization is the constant. Nothing is user error proof. With due care and consideration, the worst that will happen is a return to the risk profile everybody simply accepted as "normal" 40 years ago.

Hooks didn't come around until everybody tried stuffing 100-120+ psi into a tires on 70 psi rims in the search for free speed.

This seems to be a recurring theme. He either:
1. Didn't read the linked article.
2. Read, but doesn't understand, the linked article.
3. Thinks others won't read the linked article, but merely linking it will bolster his position.

It was answered once, but deserves repeating since the thread went sideways with some poster posting unrelated nonsense-

Tires that are designed to be used tubeless are totally safe to use with hooked tubeless rims.

You can take solace in the hundreds of thousands of riders riding millions of miles on the road on tubeless over the past 20 years, to say nothing of MTB and gravel riders on tubeless setups, and nearly every car on the road running tubeless.

While an improperly set up tubeless tire can be dangerous, it isn't rocket science. Enjoy your hooked tubeless setup. If and when you get ready to try hookless, you'll want to similarly note the number of riders on properly setup hookless systems riding without incident.

25 mph, after a hill on a gentle descent. Hard helmet hit, broken collarbone, ribs (how many and whether cracked or broken I do not know as I passed on declaring them, the subsequent at least 4 chest X-rays, several hundred dollars out of my pocket to hear the words "there's not much we can do. They'll hurt a while and heal up doing nothing". An acre of road rash. Tire came off rim and jammed in seatstay. Prior to that I was riding on the aluminum rim trying to nurse the bike around a slightly off camber turn. Think winter ice.

And no, it wasn't a trip to the hospital. I had a bystander call a cab that took me to an urgent care.

Edit: And yes, I came to a stop (lying on the road) and addressed the issues. (With my body; concussion? boken bones? The bike got the attention a few weeks later.)

When hooked rims came around, they were regarded as such an obvious improvement that hookless rims quickly disappeared from the market. Good riddance.

As someone who dealt daily with seating tires on hookless rims, with the hearing loss to show for it, I was happy to not have to deal with that garbage. But like all things in the bike tech world, knowledge doesn't get passed to the next generation, who have to experience the crappy technology of the past when it reemerges as the "next great thing".

This is the only reply that matters for the OP, and it is 100% correct.

Thanks very much all of your answers I was not expecting this much feedback. I should have known it would start an argument lol my apologies.

I feel much better knowing I can safely descend which I love. If it wasn't for being able to fly down the hills at 55mph I would still enjoy riding but not as much as I do. That is why I was scared to even go tubeless because of all the stuff I've read about the dangers of descending with a hookless rim.

Appreciate all the input, once again.

You indicated that the Reserve wheels you are planning to purchase have HOOKED rims -- so the above is an odd statement. Why are you worried about something that you aren't using?

If your tubeless tires are set up properly and you keep the sealant topped up, they are SAFER than running tubes, as small punctures will be non-issues. That's true whether you're running hooked or hookless, assuming you're using compatible tires with the latter. And as others have noted, ANY tubeless tires are compatible with your hooked rims. So you are good-to-go.

For belt and braces you might want to consider adding run-flat tubeless tire liners like these:-

https://www.bicyclerollingresistance...oria-air-liner

I haven’t used them personally, but I might give them a try next year. If you did ever get a sudden blow out on a fast descent these could make all the difference. But tubeless sealant takes care of most small punctures pretty effectively.

https://reservewheels.com/products/r...-44-road-wheel

These are safe tubed or tubeless. They are not hooked rims.

I presume you meant not hookless. They are hooked rims.

Um, you're wrong. They are are hooked.

deleted since others have commented.

And a little fun with the thread title. Hooked wheels in bike races almost always end up a bad situation. Hooked wheels - what happens when a rider in front but not clear of the bike behind moves over to directly in front; placing his rear wheel where the front wheel of the bike behind is. Tires touch, perhaps hard, QRs can rip out spokes. End result is very frequently the following rider crashing; often taking out the next 1-5 riders. Now if we could just get novice racers to ride "hookless wheels", ie wheels that always ride straight in their proper lanes, racing would be much safer!

I managed to pull out an upright stop after having that hooking wheel's QR take out 8 consecutive spokes on that side. With hookless Weinmann Concave rims. :rolleyes: (1979) The grace - those were perhaps the stiffest side-to-side rims ever made. The wheel still went through the fork (just barely; taking the brand new Imron to pare metal)

Now, back to the regular programming ...

I have gravel rims. I should have refrained from commenting. The FAQ further muddies the waters:

https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...f876564285.png