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Titanium “super bikes”

Old 02-03-24, 04:45 AM
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Originally Posted by rekmeyata
. . . . Look, Sean Kelly won the TDF on by far the most noodly bike I have ever ridden, a Vitus 992 small diameter tubing aluminum bike with bonded aluminum lugs, so don't be concerned about the flex in TI frames, that flex is what makes them comfortable. . .
Sean Kelly never won the TDF. He did win the Vuelta in 1988, though. Amazing rider.
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Old 02-03-24, 08:56 AM
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Originally Posted by rekmeyata
Look, Sean Kelly won the TDF on by far the most noodly bike I have ever ridden, a Vitus 992 small diameter tubing aluminum bike with bonded aluminum lugs
Originally Posted by Trakhak
Sean Kelly never won the TDF. He did win the Vuelta in 1988, though. Amazing rider.
And he won the Vuelta on a carbon fiber bike.
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Old 02-03-24, 12:11 PM
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Facts have no place here
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Old 02-03-24, 06:32 PM
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Originally Posted by Trakhak
Sean Kelly never won the TDF. He did win the Vuelta in 1988, though. Amazing rider.
Thanks for correcting that, I got his wins mixed up with another race.
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Old 02-03-24, 07:06 PM
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https://vitusbikes.com/blogs/stories...0eight%20years.
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Old 02-04-24, 05:59 AM
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Originally Posted by nomadmax
Facts have no place here
This is the place for alternative facts.
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Old 02-04-24, 09:25 AM
  #132  
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I've ridden Moots and Litespeed & currently own an Airborne Valkyrie. Early titanium frames patterned off steel designs proved you need stouter dimensions with this material, and I think in the case of my current ti ride the designers went hardline. The rear triangle is very stiff and it's a great climber -- but pretty rough over big bumps compared to other materials. Echoing others here -- general pavement buzz on ti is muted compared to steel/aluminum. It's a thing.
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Old 02-14-24, 02:11 PM
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Litespeed

I’ve been riding the same 1998 Litespeed Classic for the last 45K miles. Updated to R8000 Ultegra 11 speed, HED Ardennes Plus wheelset, 28mm GP5Ks. Not the lightest bike at 8 Kg but still a smooth ride and fabulous looks. I’d post a photo but 10 post requirement.
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Old 02-14-24, 03:54 PM
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Originally Posted by Jno
While dreaming idly about all the bike-related stuff I wished Santa might bring me (I got socks and a hug), I got to wondering about some of the Rolls Royce titanium bikes I’ve read about, but never ridden. While I have ridden some snazzy higher-end carbon bikes, I’m just an average cyclist who appreciated the ride but couldn’t really discern any crucial difference between various brands’ offerings. I got to wondering if that same thing might be true of the ti “legends”: would an average cyclist be likely to feel they were generally great but be unable to distinguish one brand’s ride from another, regardless of how exalted it might be. So, my question: Has anybody on the forum had 1st hand experience with a Moots bike, for example, or any of the other much-admired, very expensive titanium bikes? If so, was the ride “worth it/better” or was it more the subtle pleasure of riding something so grand?
I never got to ride a Moots or Seven but I have owned a couple Litespeeds and a Lynskey and I can say Titanium is great but appeal is very niche. For me Titanium is a great gravel bike or endurance bike or for someone looking for a N+1 but IMO since it will always be heavier than carbon and even aluminum, cost more to produce, less manufactures produce Ti bikes, and Ti bikes are less aero, Ti bikes are rarely on my radar. Would I love another one? Sure, 100% but that supple ride everyone claims TI has is really overrated unlike Steele because on higher end Ti bikes that use lighter grade Ti, which is more brittle and stiffer thus that springy feel people claim to feel IMO in placebo in most cases and most of it is just the tires. I am not going to lie, not having to worry about paint, dropped chains, or cracking is awesome and more of a selling point more than anything in my book. I think with the rise of integrated Ti bikes, the idea of Ti coming back to amature road is more and more appealing to me
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Old 02-14-24, 05:08 PM
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Originally Posted by Jrasero
...not having to worry about paint, dropped chains, or cracking is awesome and more of a selling point more than anything in my book.
Ti frames break, too.
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Old 02-14-24, 05:22 PM
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Originally Posted by Eric F
Ti frames break, too.
Anything can break and I am not insane and think that Ti is lifetime frame that I will pass down like some people do, but the chances it “breaks” compared to a carbon bike from over torquing, chain drop, rock strike, or minor crash is very minor. This doesn’t mean I threw my Ti bikes down flights of stairs but the fact that I could buff out minor scratches and tolerances usually on Ti bikes are usually spot on which is a much bigger problem with carbon press fit bottom brackets since making a perfect circle via carbon is nearly impossible.
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Old 02-14-24, 05:53 PM
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Originally Posted by Jrasero
Anything can break and I am not insane and think that Ti is lifetime frame that I will pass down like some people do, but the chances it “breaks” compared to a carbon bike from over torquing, chain drop, rock strike, or minor crash is very minor. This doesn’t mean I threw my Ti bikes down flights of stairs but the fact that I could buff out minor scratches and tolerances usually on Ti bikes are usually spot on which is a much bigger problem with carbon press fit bottom brackets since making a perfect circle via carbon is nearly impossible.
The chances of a CF frame breaking from those things is also very minor.
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Old 02-14-24, 09:21 PM
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Originally Posted by Eric F
The chances of a CF frame breaking from those things is also very minor.
I guess I was one of the very minor as was my brother..
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Old 02-14-24, 09:42 PM
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Originally Posted by easyupbug
I guess I was one of the very minor as was my brother..
All frame materials can break. Personally, I’ve broken more aluminum frames than CF.
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Old 02-15-24, 08:47 PM
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Originally Posted by Acadianbob
I’ve been riding the same 1998 Litespeed Classic for the last 45K miles. Updated to R8000 Ultegra 11 speed, HED Ardennes Plus wheelset, 28mm GP5Ks. Not the lightest bike at 8 Kg but still a smooth ride and fabulous looks. I’d post a photo but 10 post requirement.
NEVER EVER say titanium has a smooth ride, you'll get people saying that all bike materials ride the same...of course you and I know better, but just sayin.
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Old 02-15-24, 09:08 PM
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Originally Posted by mikeoverly
I've ridden Moots and Litespeed & currently own an Airborne Valkyrie. Early titanium frames patterned off steel designs proved you need stouter dimensions with this material, and I think in the case of my current ti ride the designers went hardline. The rear triangle is very stiff and it's a great climber -- but pretty rough over big bumps compared to other materials. Echoing others here -- general pavement buzz on ti is muted compared to steel/aluminum. It's a thing.
Mike, with my vintage and newer Litespeeds and Moots you clearly boiled my experience into a coherent brief statement. Now 73 with higher bars, etc., my miles are going on my old Litespeed and my '91 Vitus:
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Old 02-16-24, 02:54 AM
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Originally Posted by easyupbug
Mike, with my vintage and newer Litespeeds and Moots you clearly boiled my experience into a coherent brief statement. Now 73 with higher bars, etc., my miles are going on my old Litespeed and my '91 Vitus:
Dead sexy.
My team coach Mark at Esprit Velo Club had a copper-colored all-aluminum Vitus-caboose that would flex so much, you could upshift by simply stomping at the right moment while standing. It would even shift his lightweight plastic Modolo downtube shifters, which gave him a leg-up while everyone else was mandatorily seated and reaching for their shifters.

But I've also seen one of those Vituses (Viti?) snapped loose at the bottom bracket when the glue gave up the ghost.
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Old 02-16-24, 12:01 PM
  #143  
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Originally Posted by easyupbug
Mike, with my vintage and newer Litespeeds and Moots you clearly boiled my experience into a coherent brief statement. Now 73 with higher bars, etc., my miles are going on my old Litespeed and my '91 Vitus:
Beautiful survivor. I remember the Alan and Vitus being exotic stuff back in the day. It didn't even cross my mind that the things would be flexy built-up with 1" tubes, but luckily at the time I was so caught up in experimenting with what and what not to buy while chasing component grams that lightweight frames were off my radar -- and out of my financial reach.
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Old 02-16-24, 02:08 PM
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Originally Posted by Eric F
The chances of a CF frame breaking from those things is also very minor.
Without a doubt wrong
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Old 02-16-24, 02:10 PM
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Originally Posted by Eric F
All frame materials can break. Personally, I’ve broken more aluminum frames than CF.
aluminum is soft, that's why is crumbles and eventually fatigues but still is a great choice. I am not saying Carbon or Ti is superior, but I think it depends on the rider's wants and discipline.
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Old 02-16-24, 05:36 PM
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Originally Posted by rekmeyata
NEVER EVER say titanium has a smooth ride, you'll get people saying that all bike materials ride the same...of course you and I know better, but just sayin.
Not me. No difference in materials - in my aluminum, steel CF and titanium bikes and experience - that can't be attributed to geometry, fit, contact parts and tires. They all are as comfortable as can be or not.

But as I've said in other contexts, I don't doubt that others may feel, or think they feel things that I don't. Maybe I just don't have the refined sensitivity that others do.

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Old 02-17-24, 02:16 AM
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Originally Posted by Jrasero
I never got to ride a Moots or Seven but I have owned a couple Litespeeds and a Lynskey and I can say Titanium is great but appeal is very niche. For me Titanium is a great gravel bike or endurance bike or for someone looking for a N+1 but IMO since it will always be heavier than carbon and even aluminum, cost more to produce, less manufactures produce Ti bikes, and Ti bikes are less aero, Ti bikes are rarely on my radar. Would I love another one? Sure, 100% but that supple ride everyone claims TI has is really overrated unlike Steele because on higher end Ti bikes that use lighter grade Ti, which is more brittle and stiffer thus that springy feel people claim to feel IMO in placebo in most cases and most of it is just the tires. I am not going to lie, not having to worry about paint, dropped chains, or cracking is awesome and more of a selling point more than anything in my book. I think with the rise of integrated Ti bikes, the idea of Ti coming back to amature road is more and more appealing to me
I agree with this sensible summary, and I have huge love for my custom Ti road bike.

If we leave the "unbreakable" bun fight to one side....

I've got bikes of carbon, aluminium, 531 steel and titanium, all in closely matched geometry and similar tyre size.

My ti bike has a similar comfort level to the steel and carbon bikes (maybe slightly better on that corrugated tarmac we get in rural Scotland but even that might be attributable to its fork) but the main benefits over the others is the lack of worry over denting or scratching the frame when riding over gravel, or chucking it in the van for holiday or leaning it with other bikes or against a wall/fence on a cafe stop, or EVER chipping paintwork. It looks as beautiful and untouched as the day it was built ten years ago. This one its own is a clear benefit that no carbon bike can ever match.

Last edited by Groasters; 02-17-24 at 02:20 AM.
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Old 02-24-24, 10:16 PM
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Originally Posted by 50PlusCycling
I’ve had experience with 3 titanium bikes, an old Teledyne, a Panasonic MTB, and a Litespeed Tuscany. I am not a particularly aggressive rider, but all three bike developed cracks. I wouldn’t buy another titanium bike.
Sad to hear this. Do you happen to have photos of the cracks? I own a Ti bike and now am anxious to check it for imminent cracks. I need to know where to look for them.
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Old 02-25-24, 04:23 AM
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Cracks

45K crack free miles on my 1998 Litespeed Classic.
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Old 02-25-24, 05:16 AM
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Originally Posted by tankist
Sad to hear this.
Jeez, me too. Never owned a ti superbike, but I always imagined they were indestructible as an SR-71. I've chipped a lot of paint off a steel Schwinn Peloton in Cat4 criteriums, and bent the bejeezus out of my Masi Gran Criterium on a guard rail, and snapped a carbon Felt frame while sprinting (and not even crashing). I just assumed Ti and the complex process needed to weld those tubes together meant it was impossible to break them.
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