Is it a requirement for stores to provide pedal reflectors on a new bike??
06-30-09, 01:30 AM
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Is it a requirement for stores to provide pedal reflectors on a new bike??
Hi,
I made a mountain bike purchase at a performance bicycle store in California over the past weekend. Being a novice, I was very satisfy with their service up until the point that I made my bike purchase. First, they over charged me on my bike. They did not provide the cleats and clip-on platform adapters with reflector which came wiht the bike for my SDP bike pedals. I ended up making a second trip to the store. I was able to get the cleats from the sales person, but he won't give me the clip-on platform adapters with reflector. He told me that they throw those adapters out even if the bike had come with it since they are not safe to ride it. In my opinion, it should be my decision whether not I want to throw them out. At least, I could try using them till I decide whether I want to go with clip on shoes or not.
My question is that is it by law that they have to provide the pedal reflectors? I do have a reflector in the front, rear, and one on each wheel.
Thanks. Any comments would be appreciated.
I made a mountain bike purchase at a performance bicycle store in California over the past weekend. Being a novice, I was very satisfy with their service up until the point that I made my bike purchase. First, they over charged me on my bike. They did not provide the cleats and clip-on platform adapters with reflector which came wiht the bike for my SDP bike pedals. I ended up making a second trip to the store. I was able to get the cleats from the sales person, but he won't give me the clip-on platform adapters with reflector. He told me that they throw those adapters out even if the bike had come with it since they are not safe to ride it. In my opinion, it should be my decision whether not I want to throw them out. At least, I could try using them till I decide whether I want to go with clip on shoes or not.
My question is that is it by law that they have to provide the pedal reflectors? I do have a reflector in the front, rear, and one on each wheel.
Thanks. Any comments would be appreciated.
06-30-09, 01:47 AM
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I don't know if they have to provide pedal reflectors by law, I suspect pedal reflectors are not a legal requirement. However, they do have to give you what you paid for, and if you bought SPD's with the clip-on plastic platforms they're yours and they can't just throw them out. The 'they're too dangerous to ride on' argument is totally bogus.
06-30-09, 01:58 AM
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In Kansas:
(c) No person shall sell a pedal for use on a bicycle, unless such pedal is equipped with a reflector of a type approved by the secretary of transportation which is visible from the front and rear of the bicycle to which it is attached during darkness from a distance of two hundred (200) feet, and no person shall sell a new bicycle, unless it is equipped with pedals meeting the requirements of this subsection.
(c) No person shall sell a pedal for use on a bicycle, unless such pedal is equipped with a reflector of a type approved by the secretary of transportation which is visible from the front and rear of the bicycle to which it is attached during darkness from a distance of two hundred (200) feet, and no person shall sell a new bicycle, unless it is equipped with pedals meeting the requirements of this subsection.
06-30-09, 02:02 AM
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Thanks for the quick reply. One of my friend was able to find this in the California Bike Law.
(b) No person shall sell, or offer for sale, a new bicycle that is not equipped with a red reflector on the rear, a white or yellow reflector on each pedal visible from the front and rear of the bicycle, a white or yellow reflector on each side forward of the center of the bicycle, and a white or red reflector on each side to the rear of the center of the bicycle, except that bicycles which are equipped with reflectorized tires on the front and rear need not be equipped with these side reflectors.
We both have different interpretation. I want to make sure its a requirement. If they are suppose to provide it by law, I would go back and talk to them. They should not be throwing the reflector adaptors out and misinforming their customers.
(b) No person shall sell, or offer for sale, a new bicycle that is not equipped with a red reflector on the rear, a white or yellow reflector on each pedal visible from the front and rear of the bicycle, a white or yellow reflector on each side forward of the center of the bicycle, and a white or red reflector on each side to the rear of the center of the bicycle, except that bicycles which are equipped with reflectorized tires on the front and rear need not be equipped with these side reflectors.
We both have different interpretation. I want to make sure its a requirement. If they are suppose to provide it by law, I would go back and talk to them. They should not be throwing the reflector adaptors out and misinforming their customers.
06-30-09, 02:04 AM
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The cleats? I'm sure that was a total honest mistake. When you work for Performance, the last thing on your mind is, "How can I make my employer more money? Steal some cleats and sell them to another sucker.... BWAHAHAHAHAHA!" So let that one go.
The platforms on the pedals are for test rides. It should be law to remove those before leaving a shop. Ever had a pedal platform break beneath your feet? Oh the joy!
Bottom line... quit trying to sue your bike shop. I hate Performance too, but jesus. You're insane.
The platforms on the pedals are for test rides. It should be law to remove those before leaving a shop. Ever had a pedal platform break beneath your feet? Oh the joy!
Bottom line... quit trying to sue your bike shop. I hate Performance too, but jesus. You're insane.
06-30-09, 02:07 AM
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Ok.... this is the best thread ever.
06-30-09, 02:59 AM
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Some people just have to find something to complain about in order to make their first post here on the forums.
OP ... you can buy those platform pedal clip on things. Decathlon in France sells them for about 7 Euro. That's where I got mine.
OP ... you can buy those platform pedal clip on things. Decathlon in France sells them for about 7 Euro. That's where I got mine.
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06-30-09, 03:11 AM
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Thanks for your comment. I am not trying to sue them or anything. I am just trying to get what I pay for and an understanding since I was told that the cleats and a reflector platform came with the bike. I was also told that California bike law requires when you purchase a new bike that it be equipped with pedal reflectors. If it is the requirement, I don't understand why the sales threw them away. I have not seen reflector platform, so I do not know if it is used for test riding only.
06-30-09, 03:27 AM
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Thanks for your comment. I am not trying to sue them or anything. I am just trying to get what I pay for and an understanding since I was told that the cleats and a reflector platform came with the bike. I was also told that California bike law requires when you purchase a new bike that it be equipped with pedal reflectors. If it is the requirement, I don't understand why the sales threw them away. I have not seen reflector platform, so I do not know if it is used for test riding only.
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06-30-09, 10:21 AM
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In Illinois, it is against the law to sell a bike, or pedal, without reflectors on the pedals.
06-30-09, 10:43 AM
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In Montana you can still shoot an Indian from a covered wagon. Can we drop the, "But the law says...."
06-30-09, 10:57 AM
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I'm a bit confused over this whole thread...but here goes.
I'm reasonably sure it's not a requirement. I really doubt (although can't confirm w/o going to the shop) that high-end bikes come with reflectors. Many don't come with pedals, since this is a separate purchase based on preference.
so...drop this complaining...it's a huge name in cycling, do you really expect them to be insanely accommodating and courteous to each and every customer?
06-30-09, 01:00 PM
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Interesting as most medium to high end pedals do not come with reflectors or any provision for mounting them. Technically this apparently makes them illegal to sell in many states it looks like. I would bet such laws are totally ignored by most bike shops.
The only Shimano SPD pedals I have seen with the platforms are a pair of PD-M515 dual sided SPD pedals and they are the cheapest SPD pedals I have seen.
The only Shimano SPD pedals I have seen with the platforms are a pair of PD-M515 dual sided SPD pedals and they are the cheapest SPD pedals I have seen.
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06-30-09, 02:29 PM
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06-30-09, 04:32 PM
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noisebeam;
Based on the photo you linked to similar but not identical. The Shimano # on mine are SM-PD21. Due to the plastic cleat design they do not clip in and out like standard shoes with cleats. Difficult to both install and remove. Also slippery when wet or with hard sole shoes.
As others noted maybe good for a test ride but otherwise about useless IMO.
Based on the photo you linked to similar but not identical. The Shimano # on mine are SM-PD21. Due to the plastic cleat design they do not clip in and out like standard shoes with cleats. Difficult to both install and remove. Also slippery when wet or with hard sole shoes.
As others noted maybe good for a test ride but otherwise about useless IMO.
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06-30-09, 06:13 PM
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noisebeam;
Based on the photo you linked to similar but not identical. The Shimano # on mine are SM-PD21. Due to the plastic cleat design they do not clip in and out like standard shoes with cleats. Difficult to both install and remove. Also slippery when wet or with hard sole shoes.
As others noted maybe good for a test ride but otherwise about useless IMO.
Based on the photo you linked to similar but not identical. The Shimano # on mine are SM-PD21. Due to the plastic cleat design they do not clip in and out like standard shoes with cleats. Difficult to both install and remove. Also slippery when wet or with hard sole shoes.
As others noted maybe good for a test ride but otherwise about useless IMO.
I've since switched to the Shimano pedals where you can clip in on one side and flip them to have platforms on the other.
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06-30-09, 06:30 PM
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I agree with you that if they sold you a bike equipped with pedals, they are legally required to provide reflectorized pedals:
I still don't understand why you'd want them.
Originally Posted by Cal. Veh. C.
21201.5. (a) No person shall sell, or offer for sale, a reflex reflector or
reflectorized tire of a type required on a bicycle unless it meets
requirements established by the department. If there exists a federal
Consumer Product Safety Commission regulation applicable to bicycle
reflectors, the provisions of that regulation shall prevail over provisions of
this code or requirements established by the department pursuant to this code
relative to bicycle reflectors.
(b) No person shall sell, or offer for sale, a new bicycle that is not
equipped with a red reflector on the rear, a white or yellow reflector on each
pedal visible from the front and rear of the bicycle, a white or yellow
reflector on each side forward of the center of the bicycle, and a white or
red reflector on each side to the rear of the center of the bicycle, except
that bicycles which are equipped with reflectorized tires on the front and
rear need not be equipped with these side reflectors.
(c) Area reflectorizing material meeting the requirements of Section 25500
may be used on a bicycle.
*
Last Affected Bill - ( )
(Amended by Stats. 1980, Ch. 399, Sec. 2. Effective July 11, 1980.)
reflectorized tire of a type required on a bicycle unless it meets
requirements established by the department. If there exists a federal
Consumer Product Safety Commission regulation applicable to bicycle
reflectors, the provisions of that regulation shall prevail over provisions of
this code or requirements established by the department pursuant to this code
relative to bicycle reflectors.
(b) No person shall sell, or offer for sale, a new bicycle that is not
equipped with a red reflector on the rear, a white or yellow reflector on each
pedal visible from the front and rear of the bicycle, a white or yellow
reflector on each side forward of the center of the bicycle, and a white or
red reflector on each side to the rear of the center of the bicycle, except
that bicycles which are equipped with reflectorized tires on the front and
rear need not be equipped with these side reflectors.
(c) Area reflectorizing material meeting the requirements of Section 25500
may be used on a bicycle.
*
Last Affected Bill - ( )
(Amended by Stats. 1980, Ch. 399, Sec. 2. Effective July 11, 1980.)
06-30-09, 08:17 PM
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The cleats do come with the pedals. The plastic test ride inserts don't. Once the inserts are removed, they are impossible to reinstall. Your shoes probably have a reflective element on the back, filling the legal reflective requirement as the shoes are attached to the pedals.
Now, STFU and ride the bike.
Now, STFU and ride the bike.
06-30-09, 09:30 PM
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I could see the possibility of an argument being made in court following an accident at night that the cyclist was partially at fault if his bike didn't comply with all sections of the CVC in regard to lights and reflectors. So I've added reflective tape to provide side reflectors and also on the back part of my cycling shoes. But I can see a customer wanting to have the pedal reflectors as well since they are required to be provided at the time of sale.
It also seems to leave the retailer subject to a possibly costly lawsuit if they don't at least offer the customer the option of the full set of reflectors.
It also seems to leave the retailer subject to a possibly costly lawsuit if they don't at least offer the customer the option of the full set of reflectors.
06-30-09, 10:16 PM
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Maybe this is common sense chiming in, but how about a set of lights. Front light, rear light, call it a day.
07-01-09, 02:11 PM
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A local bike shop here has some bikes that come with Eggbeater pedals installed from the factory. In order to let people test ride, they also come with some plastic covers on the pedals.
If by chance they are the same covers, I would say they are actually dangerous to bike with. They're really slippery, hard plastic. Just adding my 2 cents, I'm not even sure if they're the same thing.
If by chance they are the same covers, I would say they are actually dangerous to bike with. They're really slippery, hard plastic. Just adding my 2 cents, I'm not even sure if they're the same thing.
07-01-09, 02:25 PM
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Those are demo pedals. Mine was left on my bike but I was told that because they are plastic, the part where it latches onto the pedal will eventually wear down in a matter of a few rides and the demo platforms will fall off. He advised me not to use them.
I think liability is an issue to the bike shop should it come off, your foot slides off and you hit yourself really hard 'there'.
As for reflectors in California, I have yet to see it enforced. There are too many OTHER illegal things of more importance for them to tend to and with the cutbacks, they probably are focusing on bigger issues.
Hence the reason people still drive and talk on the cell phone.
I think liability is an issue to the bike shop should it come off, your foot slides off and you hit yourself really hard 'there'.
As for reflectors in California, I have yet to see it enforced. There are too many OTHER illegal things of more importance for them to tend to and with the cutbacks, they probably are focusing on bigger issues.
Hence the reason people still drive and talk on the cell phone.
07-01-09, 02:28 PM
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I thought (at least in most US states) that a pedal reflector was a requirement for a new bike being sold, but not a requirement for a bike being used.
07-01-09, 03:18 PM
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https://www.cpsc.gov/BUSINFO/regsumbicycles.pdf
"What requirements must pedals meet?
...
(2) Bicycle pedals must have reflectors. See
§1512.16(e) for this requirement. Sidewalk
bicycle pedals do not have to have reflectors. "
In the US, the (federal) CPSC regulates how new bicycles from dealers must be sold--in all fifty states. ...
(2) Bicycle pedals must have reflectors. See
§1512.16(e) for this requirement. Sidewalk
bicycle pedals do not have to have reflectors. "
~