Do you really believe there's no difference betwEen my Specialized Allez or Cervelo S1 and a Wal-mart special other than the components?

x mart bicycles are not made from the same materials as "legit" bicycles and as such, their frames are not equal to better quality frames.

You can replace all the components but at the heart of it all you will still have a frame and fork of lesser quality and in many cases the difference between a BSO and a legit bicycle is not that much.

They have their place but like many things have become a cheap disposable commodity and if one looks deeper you have to look at where they are made, who makes them ,and the working conditions of the people who make them. There is a social cost that comes with getting products this cheaply.

The EU recently slapped China (the primary supplier of low cost bicycles) with a 47% import duty on bicycles as it was found they were dumping them on the market below cost.

Hey there Chasm!

I don't recall using the word quality. That word can possibly imply something that wasn't intended here. The words that I did use were strength and beauty. I equate a strong bicycle frame with beauty in purpose. It serves its purpose well as a bicycle frame. That's all that it was manufactured to do and it does it well. That is indeed a beautiful thing. Is there quality there? Perhaps. Depends upon the context in which you're using the word and what things are being considered.

The word "Beauty" can be very subjective....The "Quality" implies some standard by which something is being judged...

I'm simply stating that based upon my limitted observation, the Walmart frame appears to be just as tough, durable, and strong, as any other bicycle frame. If my observations are correct, I personally think that's beautiful. However, that is a very subjective conclusion.

Now, actually conducting stress tests upon all of Walmarts frames and comparing my results with a large amount of frames from many different bicycle manufacturers, that would subject all the frames to the type of judgement that would demand objective conclusions, based upon quantitative measurement and graphical analysis. In the prescence of empirical data, quality can most definitely be assessed.

- Slim :)

A bicycle is a machine that is powered by an engine with a very narrow power band and any aspect that affects efficiency will put a lot of extra stress and strain on that engine.

Poor ride quality, excessive weight, and poor quality bearings and parts all affect that efficiency... other sub standard parts have an affect on safety and longevity of that machine.

It's a shame that kids bikes are so easily outgrown. We need a real Yehuda Moon and his Grow bike.

http://www.yehudamoon.com/images/strips/2011-06-08.gif

Despite the name-dropping...

I'm saying that your welds may be smoother and greater quality control was most likely used to produce your bike. However, you shouldn't be surprised if a Walmart bike frame outlasts either one of your frames. You should not be stunned if your Cervelo S1cracks running over a crevice and the Walmart bike does not! These "cheap" Walmart bikes were over built to be tough and strong. In many cases, much tougher or stronger than bikes purchased at your friendly neighborhood LBS.

Why?

Because different geometries undergo different stress vibrations differently. One may be more subjected to greater destructive force vectors than another. In many cases, these Walmart bikes have both wider tubing with thicker walls. That makes it stronger and stiffer. It also makes it heavier, which is something that neither Cervelo nor Specialized wants for its target market consumer of road bikes.

- Slim :)

The grow bike could be timed to grow when the second set of teeth come in and then again at puberty.
No matter what you may think, there's a market for them. Just go into any Walmart, Target or other big box for that matter and head for the sporting goods dept. They are all over the place and they do look so cool. Just ask any kid there.

This has been my personal experience with Allmart bikes.

For someone that actually uses a bicycle; they are grossly inadequate.

Unless, of course, you don't mind tinkering constantly. Even then

they are constantly suspect.

Yes, Simran!

Their componentry is the worse, I agree!

- Slim :)

This gobbledegook just about sums up your understanding of this stuff, doesn't it? Do you actually know what an energy vector is? When you've looked it up, try and explain what it is doing in this sentence.

Hey there Sixty!

A heavier bike being less safe....Nah____! However, poor or substandard bearings should be changed right along with the upgraded components to better ensure safety, ride quality, and bicycle longevity.

- Slim :)

Yes they are...but where would the DIY longbike thread in the utility biking forum here be without their swingarms? :roflmao2:

(meaning,they may be crap as sold,but they can be recycled into something better sometimes :):thumb:)

Said nothing about a heavier bike being less safe but rather, the sub standard parts attaches to that heavier bike.

Once you go through the process of upgrading that BSO you would have been better off buying a "legit" bicycle as there are many decent bicycles out there that cost more than a BSO but are not inordinately expensive either.

This is something I can see full suspension BSO's as being good for... my DIY longtail uses a swing arm from a lower end CCM but if I was to do it all over again would just build up a custom rear end.

Yes Chasm!

You're right, I typed too fast! That was a typo. Please forgive me! I meant to say force vectors!

Thank you, Sir!

- Slim :)

Ah, I see. Typing fast causes you to type completely different words.

After careful consideration, I have decided it's unlikely that anyone is as stupid as you are contriving to appear. So I conclude that you're a troll. I won't be feeding you any more.

Actually typing before thinking caused me to use the wrong word...

That's too bad Chasm, I rather looked forward to further instruction

I'll miss you, dearly!

- Slim :)

I can assure you that Slim is not a troll. As a matter of fact he has been one of the nicer posters on this forum. He's just trying to make a point. I've got a Wal-Mart bike and he's right. The frame is strong and the components are crappy. But for someone that doesn't have the money to fork out for a Trek, you can always upgrade the components when needed.

They use cheap crap to keep price points low. They are not selling to the higher end users who require reliabilty, light weight and good looks. They are not the only mega-corporation that does this either. I do not see a "lack of concern for the American consumer" instead I see the American consumer given an option to buy their snot nosed American kids a bike and still put a meal on the table at the end of the bike ride.
If you want better, dig into your pockets a bit deeper. You are free to spend your borrowed money where ever you want.
Some people don't take cycling to the extemes you obviously do. A cheap bike at least gets people out for a ride once in a while. They don't all want to wear Lycra and act as pretend racers. A nice stroll around the neighborhood my be good enough for them.
Why do you care so much what other people ride?

Thank you, my friend!

I can assure you that your kindness will be reciprocated...

- Slim :)

I wasn't being sarcastic or knocking the use of those swingarms in the least (not saying you took it that way,but some may have),I really dig your conversion...I had planned on building my own (inspired by yours,no less) but never got around to it...wasn't that high a priorety living where we did (where utility cycling just wasn't that realistic,being out in the middle of nowhere and disabled enough that riding the 20+ miles across 2 mtn roads each way to get anywhere wasn't something I looked forward to....20+ miles yeah,on a loaded rig,not so much)...but now that we're living in the city,I'm regretting the hauling off of the donor-for-the-swingarm Walgoose. If I find another dirt cheap or freebie,I may still do it (save me from buying/building a trailer for grocery runs).

Slim- I think in this day and age,even here,people just aren't used to someone being friendly/polite,possibly thinking there's an agenda,LOL! (I know sometimes I can come across as a real prick,for eg,though I don't necessarily mean to :o) Keep posting,and keep being kind,Brother,hopefully it'll spread :thumb:

Sir, I believe in freedom of choice...

What you ride is of no concern of mine as long as you don't jeopardize the safety of others when you do it!

Lycra! WRONG!!! I don't wear lycra!

If you don't see Walmart's lack of concern for the American consumer, then you need corrected vision!

If you can't see the large green dot to the right ---->..........Then you need to seek counseling!

- Slim :)

I can already see your next thread...

Lycra... Why You Don't Need It.

:lol:

I agree there Sixty!

The price paid by so many human beings who work under the heavy yoke of industrial profiteers is insurmountable I can assure you. It won't get any better if world cyclists continue to bite bait and participate in the foolish art of self-destruction. Since many of us represent a segment of that work force, it would behoove all of us to strive for better working conditions, as well as better goods and services for the entire world population.

- Slim :)