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Why do bike manufactures not supply parts lists etc?

Old 05-24-14, 08:52 AM
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Why do bike manufactures not supply parts lists etc?

I have to admit I am new to bike store quality bicycles and havent had a bike at all for the last 20 years but I fail to see why bike manufactures do not supply parts listings for particular bikes showing what thread size this is, that is etc for buying accessories.

I understand that they are trying to support their dealer structure but I sure would like to know what I should be buying without first having to take it off the bike and measure it etc.
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Old 05-24-14, 09:24 AM
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Many Bike company websites have a "Specs" tab that lists the components.
Most threadings are standard across bike components.
You may find the detail you want if you go to the component website (Shimano, Campagnolo etc...) and look up the specific part you are interested in.
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Old 05-24-14, 11:01 AM
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+ Most bikes are not made by the company/Brand that is selling them, but a contract manufacturer .

thread standards are National .. but Asia is using the standards of the British Builders of old.

Italy and france have variations , but the world market has them falling in line of late ..


Sutherland's hand book for Bicycle Mechanics .. is a good reference book to buy .. its for Bike shop's Mechanics..

Last edited by fietsbob; 05-24-14 at 11:05 AM.
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Old 05-24-14, 11:56 AM
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Not only talking about threads, just in general. I don't have much bike knowledge yet at all.

One of the things I am frustrated with is knowing if certain things I look up will actually fit my bike, right now I am just looking for a fork mount so I can transport my bike in the back of my truck and am wondering if all forks will mount on a 9mm rack.
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Old 05-24-14, 07:44 PM
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Old 05-24-14, 07:53 PM
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Originally Posted by WVU_Engineer View Post
Not only talking about threads, just in general. I don't have much bike knowledge yet at all.

One of the things I am frustrated with is knowing if certain things I look up will actually fit my bike, right now I am just looking for a fork mount so I can transport my bike in the back of my truck and am wondering if all forks will mount on a 9mm rack.
Most 9mm and 10mm forks will fit on there.

Many of the newer, nicer MTB forks will not, QR15, for instance. If you have that it's likely listed in the specs for the bike, but you might have to check fork website.

Some 70s and before bikes actually had skinnier axles and their forks will not fit.

Bike manufacturers don't list all that stuff because they leave that up to mechanics.
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Old 05-24-14, 07:55 PM
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If you're asking about the Raleigh Venture, then yeah, 9mm quick release will fit fine.
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Old 05-24-14, 08:13 PM
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The Raleigh Venture is a comfort bike aimed at the low end of the legitimate bike shop market ($400 and under). The target buyer for this bike probably couldn't give a damn about anything but being able to hop on the seat and ride down the road. They generally aren't concerned about thread size or installing their own accessories. BTW, most bolt on accessories like water bottle cages and fenders use 8mm hex head bolts. They either come with the accessory or may already be on a new bike.
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Old 05-24-14, 08:15 PM
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Originally Posted by LesterOfPuppets View Post
If you're asking about the Raleigh Venture, then yeah, 9mm quick release will fit fine.
Yea that's it.

I have been able to fix/work on things more complicated than bicycles with parts listings/exploded parts diagrams and think it would be very nice to have this. Not having these available just seems really odd.
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Old 05-24-14, 08:23 PM
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Originally Posted by WVU_Engineer View Post
Yea that's it.

I have been able to fix/work on things more complicated than bicycles with parts listings/exploded parts diagrams and think it would be very nice to have this. Not having these available just seems really odd.
Bolt sizes and threads. Could you give me an example of a consumer product that routinely publishes that information?
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Old 05-24-14, 08:30 PM
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Old 05-24-14, 08:33 PM
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Originally Posted by VegasTriker View Post
The Raleigh Venture is a comfort bike aimed at the low end of the legitimate bike shop market ($400 and under). The target buyer for this bike probably couldn't give a damn about anything but being able to hop on the seat and ride down the road. They generally aren't concerned about thread size or installing their own accessories. BTW, most bolt on accessories like water bottle cages and fenders use 8mm hex head bolts. They either come with the accessory or may already be on a new bike.
I usually go with 4mm allen head M5s, myself. To each his own, however.

Fenders often come with Phillips head M5s, though, so there's that.

Then there are frames that don't have M5 holes...

Last edited by LesterOfPuppets; 05-24-14 at 08:40 PM.
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Old 05-24-14, 08:49 PM
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Originally Posted by Retro Grouch View Post
Bolt sizes and threads. Could you give me an example of a consumer product that routinely publishes that information?
My Table Saw, Band Saw, Ikea Furniture, Office Chair, Lawn Mower, Attic Fan, and you can buy the documentation for your car if you desire. I have the manual/exploded parts diagram for everything that I own that included one.

Bicycles are the first thing I have ran into that "hide" this info, I could understand for the cheap Walmart stuff like with cheap throw away tools but the good stuff always includes proper documentation.

Here is an example of a toy monster truck documentation. http://traxxas.com/explodedviews/Sta...ssion-Assembly

Also washing machine
https://www.geapplianceparts.com/sto...y/GTWN8250D0WS

Last edited by WVU_Engineer; 05-24-14 at 09:08 PM. Reason: Added example
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Old 05-24-14, 09:01 PM
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Most average riders don't assemble their bikes from a pile of parts and would just throw away a parts list if it were included. It is not "industry standard" even for bikes costing a couple thousand dollars. I did assemble my most recent acquisition sent to me as a frame and a separate box of components. The company has an online assembly manual with detailed instructions on which order to assemble the parts. Even then there is no "parts list" as detailed as you suggest.
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Old 05-24-14, 09:27 PM
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Originally Posted by WVU_Engineer View Post
My Table Saw, Band Saw, Ikea Furniture, Office Chair, Lawn Mower, Attic Fan, and you can buy the documentation for your car if you desire. I have the manual/exploded parts diagram for everything that I own that included one.

Bicycles are the first thing I have ran into that "hide" this info, I could understand for the cheap Walmart stuff like with cheap throw away tools but the good stuff always includes proper documentation.

Here is an example of a toy monster truck documentation. Stampede (36054) Transmission Assembly | traxxas.com
If the bike company made every part of the bike then they might be inclined to share the info but they have product managers that source the parts from different companies. Sometimes parts used on same make/model/year will vary during production run.

They'd probably have to sell a complete manual for $100 or so. Not many people wanna spend that kinda dough on a bike book.

If your bike had Shimano hubs you could check techdocs for info. They don't even give axle thread info but you can surmise it from cone thread info.

http://techdocs.shimano.com/media/te...9830608959.pdf
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Old 05-24-14, 10:02 PM
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Originally Posted by LesterOfPuppets View Post
If the bike company made every part of the bike then they might be inclined to share the info but they have product managers that source the parts from different companies. Sometimes parts used on same make/model/year will vary during production run.

They'd probably have to sell a complete manual for $100 or so. Not many people wanna spend that kinda dough on a bike book.

If your bike had Shimano hubs you could check techdocs for info. They don't even give axle thread info but you can surmise it from cone thread info.

http://techdocs.shimano.com/media/te...9830608959.pdf
Now that is pretty good documentation. I doubt it would cost that much to publish documentation because the assembly documentation has to exist somewhere to get the bikes made to specs, the Asian sweat shops don't just wing it or build it from a drawing scribbled on a napkin.

I am leaning to it being purposely being omitted as a favor to bike shops/dealers because if bike shops can't stay open then their sales infrastructure is destroyed, the Raleigh website even says they don't publish the information go to your nearest dealer.

Remember I am looking at this from the point of view of an outsider, not someone who has accepted this practice as just the way it is.
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Old 05-25-14, 06:28 AM
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As you become more familiar with bikes, you will find that it is not that complicated. Most parts are standardized. When there are several standards, as in bottom brackets, the difference will be obvious. You probably don't spend a lot of time worrying about which bulb to screw into your table lamp. Bikes are only a couple of steps beyond that. Don't be intimidated!
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Old 05-25-14, 09:58 PM
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Originally Posted by WVU_Engineer View Post
...... I am leaning to it being purposely being omitted as a favor to bike shops/dealers because if bike shops can't stay open then their sales infrastructure is destroyed, the Raleigh website even says they don't publish the information go to your nearest dealer......
I had a Raleigh Venture for awhile, Raleigh and the dealer were total ______. The bike frame was well made, the wheels were not; and the dealer sold me a bike two sizes too small for me...... This bad experience led me to become somewhat bike knowledgeable.

Most new bicycles under $1000- retail are designed and manufactured in China by a surprisingly small number of companies, many are Taiwanese owned. The various designs are offered to importers. Raleigh - as us older people remember it - is long dead, having passed through a multitude of owners in the last couple of decades. Raleigh USA has no idea about the bikes they sell to dealers, they are just a sales and marketing company, with less knowledge than the corner used car dealer.

On most bikes, the water bottle and fender threads are M5 x 0.8 - standard M5 screws. Most front axles are 9x1, most rear are 10x1. Most BB are 1.37 x 24tpi with a 68mm shell width. Handle bars at the clamp are most commonly one of three diameters: 25.4mm (most bars), 26.0 (many drop bars) or 31.8 (newer). On flat/riser bars, the 25.4 usually tapers quickly to 22.2 - the size most grips, shifters, brakes and many brackets are designed for.
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Old 05-25-14, 10:24 PM
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Originally Posted by WVU_Engineer View Post
Now that is pretty good documentation. I doubt it would cost that much to publish documentation because the assembly documentation has to exist somewhere to get the bikes made to specs, the Asian sweat shops don't just wing it or build it from a drawing scribbled on a napkin.

I am leaning to it being purposely being omitted as a favor to bike shops/dealers because if bike shops can't stay open then their sales infrastructure is destroyed, the Raleigh website even says they don't publish the information go to your nearest dealer.

Remember I am looking at this from the point of view of an outsider, not someone who has accepted this practice as just the way it is.
It's more because mechanics don't really need it. You can get by pretty well with Barnett's or Park's Blue Book.

And the various suppliers. One of my bikes has a front hub from Formula, rear hub from Shimano, Sram Shifters, some kinda Chinese stem, some other kinda Chinese handlebar, yet another Chinese seatpost, Sugino cranks, SR Pedals, some other brand bottom bracket, Dia-compe headset, Dia Compe brake levers, Tektro brake arms, Shimano Derailleurs. Now remember they may have 50 models per year in the North American market, then 50 in the Euro market, of which maybe 25 overlap with the N/A market, then 50 models in the Asian market, of which only some are the same as in the other two markets. That's a lot of material to source from a lot of different vendors, to print up a bunch of manuals.

A full-fledged repair manual for an automobile costs in excess of $500 and quite a few of those get sold. Most home auto mechanics just try to get by with a Haynes, which are kinda sketchy at times but better than nothing. I'd guess much fewer bike shop manuals could be sold so you don't get a volume discount on printing.
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Old 05-26-14, 05:47 AM
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Originally Posted by nfmisso View Post
Most new bicycles under $1000- retail are designed and manufactured in China by a surprisingly small number of companies, many are Taiwanese owned.
Tools are like that, most people have no idea that there is no such thing as a Craftsman tool. The same $5000 Powermatic saw is cheapened up, painted a different color, and sold for a thousand.

So far the bike industry fascinates me, I paid three times as much for my bike as I could have got one at Walmart for. What other item would you pay three times as much for than one at Walmart and it be considered cheap? I also find the business model of local bike shops fascinating, they are one of the few specialty stores able to survive the big box/bad economy world that has become the new normal.
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Old 05-26-14, 07:02 AM
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Originally Posted by WVU_Engineer View Post
...I paid three times as much for my bike as I could have got one at Walmart for...
The crank on my bike cost 3 times what I could get a bike at Walmart for.
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Old 05-26-14, 07:06 AM
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Originally Posted by Looigi View Post
The crank on my bike cost 3 times what I could get a bike at Walmart for.
Other than being proud of your crank, so?
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Old 05-26-14, 08:22 AM
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The main reason is the fact that mfg change componets quite often. Altho the frame is the same, they hang different brands of componets on it due to the cost. They im sure go for low bids on each batch they order.
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Old 05-26-14, 08:35 AM
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Many Bike companies Don't even Make the bicycles they sell, they have a Contract Manufacturer make the frames, with their name on it, for them,
then partially assemble wrap and pad, and box them up and container ship them around the globe ..

the Bike company Distributes the Cartons with the bikes in them to dealers to assemble, finally for sale.

and the dealers contact the Distributor when any warrantee issues come up.
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Old 05-26-14, 08:55 AM
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Originally Posted by WVU_Engineer View Post
Other than being proud of your crank, so?
so

you asked and he told you

other things that 3x walmart price is still on the low end

car tires
tools
hourly wages

you got your bike for three times the price of the least expensive walmart bike
remember that walmart has multiple price points for most items
including 700 dollar bikes
which x3 gives you a 2100 dollar bike
which most would agree is not a cheap bike

as for documentation
just about every brand lists a complete component spec on their website
and the component manufacturers generally have available documentation on their products

so while i agree that the information that comes with a bike is pretty weak
you can get it without too much trouble
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