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Are we going to need to police multi-use paths in future?

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Are we going to need to police multi-use paths in future?

Old 11-19-15, 08:48 AM
  #76  
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Originally Posted by wolfchild View Post
Pedestrians are not even an issue. According to law a bicycle is a vehicle and pedestrians have the right of way. The problem is speeding cyclists who use MUPS like it's an autobahn...
I agree, MUPs should NEVER be used for speed training. Which is why I almost never use them. OTOH, one of the problems with MUPs is that they re tard a rider's progression to riding in the road like a vehicle. In that respect, they're like 'training wheels' which do nothing but create a dependence on them. Cyclists start riding on MUPs because they're afraid of cars... and never learn how to deal with cars.
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Old 11-19-15, 08:49 AM
  #77  
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Halloween? Like actual clowns, now that's scary. They announced passing left, did not hit you. The problem is? Were you staying right or taking the whole lane, chatting and not paying attention. Clown indeed.
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Old 11-19-15, 10:43 AM
  #78  
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Originally Posted by indyfabz View Post
The portion of the Schuykill River Trail in Montgomery County. 15 MPH is the speed limit. https://www.montcopa.org/DocumentCenter/View/3462There is also a portion of the trail in Philadelphia with speed limit signs, albeit an unrealistically low one of 7 M.P.H. In fact, the city has rules that apply to all trails within the city limits:https://www.phila.gov/ParksandRecreat...gulations.aspx
I've only ridden on the Philadelphia County portions, East and West River Drives (or whatever name they are now called) and Forbidden Drive for over 40 years and never saw a speed limit sign. Also never had a problem with the other users of those bike paths, but then I am not a racer boy either. The Philadelphia Bicycle regulations you posted only apply to trails in Philadelphia which would include Forbidden Drive, but not the main MUPs, the East and West River Drives. I did too numerous to count rides on those MUPs between the hours of 10PM and 6AM which would be forbidden if the "trail rules" applied.

Last edited by I-Like-To-Bike; 11-19-15 at 10:50 AM.
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Old 11-19-15, 12:55 PM
  #79  
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Originally Posted by I-Like-To-Bike View Post
I've only ridden on the Philadelphia County portions, East and West River Drives (or whatever name they are now called) and Forbidden Drive for over 40 years and never saw a speed limit sign. Also never had a problem with the other users of those bike paths, but then I am not a racer boy either. The Philadelphia Bicycle regulations you posted only apply to trails in Philadelphia which would include Forbidden Drive, but not the main MUPs, the East and West River Drives. I did too numerous to count rides on those MUPs between the hours of 10PM and 6AM which would be forbidden if the "trail rules" applied.
There are signs on the "Schuykill Banks" section between the Art Museum and South St. They are relatively new. And the paths along the drives (Kelly and MLK are the names they go by, not East and West) are under the jurisdiction of the PPR.
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Old 11-19-15, 01:28 PM
  #80  
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Am I allowed to mention rail trails in this thread? They are like MUPs for mountain bikes. I love the ones in my area, but dog owners let their pets make a mess of the trails. I don't mind sharing the lane with horses - the piles are easy to see and avoid.

Common sense should inspire dog owners to take a stick and move the dog stuff off the trail. I spent a long time scrubbing it out of my knobby tires.

In my area, there is a nice, well-maintained MUP that has both paved and unpaved trails. Dog owners are much more courteous there.

Last edited by habilis; 11-19-15 at 01:33 PM.
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Old 11-19-15, 02:07 PM
  #81  
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Originally Posted by I-Like-To-Bike View Post
Which main MUP in your area has an official speed limit or special rules?
In my town, the rules are posted about every half mile. It's backed by a city ordinance:
Bikeway Rules (Ordinance No. 05-13)
  • Abide by all signage
  • Yield to cross traffic at intersections
  • Keep right except to pass
  • Announce passing
  • Avoid blocking trail
  • Respect others and private property
  • Pets must be leashed/Obey scoop law
  • Unauthorized motorized vehicles prohibited
  • Users shall observe a fifteen (15) miles per hour speed limit on all Park Trails
Some of the Erie-to-Ohio rails-to-trails network run through state parks. I've seen Ohio Department of Natural Resource rangers enforcing the rules at Little Miami State park. (Little Miami is weird - it's 50 miles long and 66 feet wide). I've seen Sheriff's departments enforce at the points the trail crosses their township's roads. In one case, an officer stopped a guy on an ATV. Right in front of him was a sign with the rules for the trail, with "No Motorized Vehicles".
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Old 11-19-15, 03:33 PM
  #82  
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THIS is the future. As long as there are multi use paths there will be ....
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Old 11-19-15, 03:47 PM
  #83  
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Originally Posted by habilis View Post
Dog owners are much more courteous there.
Not always.

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Old 11-19-15, 04:01 PM
  #84  
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Old 11-20-15, 07:46 AM
  #85  
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Originally Posted by Still Pedaling View Post
I'm not meaning for this thread to be for venting purposes, but yesterday my wife and I went out with some friends to one of the many popular multi-use paths where we live to enjoy a leisurely day riding on a path that is purposed for bike riders, joggers and families out for a walk. But what we encountered on numerous occasions was these idiots dressed up in full Halloween regalia flying along these paths thinking perhaps they are out training for the Tour de France or something. I think this is totally wrong. I wouldn't be a bit surprised if people are going to get injured, if not already by these thoughtless clowns. Has anybody else encountered these fools on similar paths where you live? Are we going to need to police them in the future? I have no problem with riders doing this out on the streets with designated bike paths. Usually they come up to you from behind and give you a warning sign such as "on your left". That is the courtliest way in my opinion, but to fly along on a multi-use path showing little or no consideration for other users is way out of line.
Yes, we should do it now, based on clear guidelines.
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Old 11-20-15, 07:59 AM
  #86  
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Where I live the sheriff, park ranger, or trail volunteers drive up and down the trail ll day. I see them at least once every time I'm out riding. I never worry about crime or any of the other worries I had when living in Atlanta and riding on the bike path to Stone Mtn.
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Old 11-20-15, 08:35 AM
  #87  
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Invest in a bicycle bell. Probably 50% of the walkers in the MUP don't know what 'on your left' means and they are likely to stop and turn to ask for you to explain... Everyone knows that the sound of a bicycle bell means 'a bike is coming'. Also, it might penetrate through the earbuds...

However, nothing is foolproof. Two moms with PRAMS, not strollers walking two abreast on the MUP, chatting. They hear the bicycle bell, correctly identify what it means, so they make a 2 foot opening in the MIDDLE. I stopped and explained to them that this was a huge risk, to expect the bicyclist to thread the needle (as I am sure, some would).
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Old 11-20-15, 11:02 AM
  #88  
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Originally Posted by Machka View Post
It's a bicycle path ... the roadie is on a bicycle ... the roadie is free to ride his/her bicycle on the bicycle path.
Roadies should never spend an extended amount of time on a MUP. Anyone stating otherwise is clueless or biased imo.
And btw a path is not a road so not sure where you were going with the roadie on a path analogy?
Anyone on any type of bicycle can ofc ride wherever they please. Where they actually choose to ride is is what matters. The rest is biking politics bs.

Last edited by bakes1; 11-20-15 at 11:10 AM.
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Old 11-20-15, 11:44 AM
  #89  
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The roadie is on a bicycle, the bicycle can be on the bike path.
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Old 11-20-15, 12:13 PM
  #90  
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armed checkpoints every 500 meters
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Old 11-20-15, 12:28 PM
  #91  
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Originally Posted by Caliper View Post
As far as warning people that I'm going to pass, the batty behavior of those I warn has trained me out of it. We don't warn other drivers when passing while driving a car on a two lane road (unless you count signaling the lane change), so why should it be different on a path? Maintain your path and I'll go around when safe, just like when driving. Warning people more often results in them veering/staggering left as I pass than any useful outcome.
That absolutely counts, all motor vehicles on public roads are required to have mirrors, and all states require signaling a specified amount of time before changing lanes to alert other motorists. So by law you are required to notify the people you are passing by signaling. But whether anyone pays attention, and whether it is enforced are whole different topics.
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Old 11-20-15, 12:41 PM
  #92  
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Originally Posted by fietsbob View Post
armed checkpoints every 500 meters
Don't forget barbed wire fences on each side if the path, so they can not get around the checkpoints.

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Old 11-20-15, 12:53 PM
  #93  
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people riding bikes on bike paths. It never ceases to amaze me what people complain about online. There is a speed limit already suppose. The MUP's here are patrolled.Cops drive right down the path in their cars don't think the run radar though.
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Old 11-20-15, 01:57 PM
  #94  
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Originally Posted by indyfabz View Post
There are signs on the "Schuykill Banks" section between the Art Museum and South St. They are relatively new. And the paths along the drives (Kelly and MLK are the names they go by, not East and West) are under the jurisdiction of the PPR.
I bicycled on "Schuykill Banks" section this summer and did not see any signs about speed limits.
Are there any signs about alleged bicycling speed limits or curfews let alone ANY enforcement of these "rules", ANYWHERE on the Kelly or MLK MUPs?
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Old 11-20-15, 02:10 PM
  #95  
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Originally Posted by TheLibrarian View Post
Cops drive right down the path in their cars don't think the run radar though.
I did come across one 'speed trap' on our local MUP. A motorcycle cop was partially hidden behind a bush with his radar gun out checking speeds on the path. It was on the downhill side of a road overpass making it the only place on the 40 mile path where cyclists could exceed the 15mph speed limit by simply coasting. My guess is that he was stationed there in response to neighborhood concerns since it was near a spot where many students cross the path on their walk to a middle school. (And no, I did not get cited.)

(bakes1: "Roadies should never spend an extended amount of time on a MUP. Anyone stating otherwise is clueless or biased imo.")
I see no reason why I wouldn't continue to use this path for quite a few of my trips. It was by far the quickest way to go for my commutes to work since a somewhat slower speed was more than compensated for by being the most direct route with far fewer intersections and traffic lights/stop signs. At the time I saw the radar motorcycle cop I was on my way to serve on the jury in a murder trial and was on the path for about 20 miles each way - again because it provided the most direct and quickest route to get there.
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Old 11-20-15, 02:36 PM
  #96  
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Originally Posted by I-Like-To-Bike View Post
I bicycled on "Schuykill Banks" section this summer and did not see any signs about speed limits.
Speed limit is 15 mph. Presumably it's posted at the trail heads.
https://www.montcopa.org/DocumentCenter/View/3462
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Old 11-20-15, 05:00 PM
  #97  
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Originally Posted by FrenchFit View Post
Complicated for runners, who run against traffic on the road if they are knowledgeable. Running against traffic is much safer from the runner's point of view - - runners are not vehicles. Additionally, in some cultures your walk on the left, not right...very noticeable practice around here. There is also a 15mph speed limit for cyclists on MUPs around here, I bet about 25% of local users are aware.
Which drives cyclists nuts, as the runners force the cyclists into traffic. If runner was going same direction as traffic, at least the cyclist has option to slow down to same or slower pace as runner until it's safe to pass.
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Old 11-20-15, 09:08 PM
  #98  
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Originally Posted by BlazingPedals View Post
Speed limit is 15 mph. Presumably it's posted at the trail heads.
https://www.montcopa.org/DocumentCenter/View/3462
The Schuylkill River Trail is in Montgomery County, where the rules you cited may be applicable. Schuylkill Banks as well as the MLK and Kelly Drive MUPs under discussion are in Philadelphia, Philadelphia County where Montgomery County rules carry no weight.
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Old 11-20-15, 09:47 PM
  #99  
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Entitlement much? Q: What is the difference between you riding your bike on a MUP and expecting to not be hindered, and a motorist on the roads with the same attitude? A: about 2000 pounds.
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Old 11-21-15, 12:03 AM
  #100  
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Originally Posted by Funduro View Post
Policing MUP? Police are going to do what on MUP ? Enforce a non existing speed limit ? Enforce a 3.45 foot buffer in order to pass if going 7.95MPH higher then overtaken biker, roller bladder, runner, walker, wheelchair user, birder, horse rider, . . . .
Ta hell is a birder?
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