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Rear rack installation and bike shop service-related questions

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Rear rack installation and bike shop service-related questions

Old 01-20-15, 08:03 AM
  #1  
stephbr
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Rear rack installation and bike shop service-related questions

Hello,

I just recently purchased a used Raleigh Port Townsend 2012.

I wanted to install a rear rack for groceries and for tours (short, 2-7 days). I went to a local bike shop who couldn't fit any of their racks. They told me to go to a Raleigh dealer that could order a rack from Raleigh that would fit.

At the local Raleigh dealer, the guy at the shop said that's not necessary, he could fit anything. He did fit it. But the rear fender got badly scratched in the process, IMO, with very little clearance between fender and rack. (PICTURES) Note: I got very good and friendly service from them, and I do appreciate him making the rack work for me! Just not sure what to do about those scratches.

Questions:
- Is there such a thing as a special bike rack from Raleigh for their bikes? (specifically the Port Townsend)
- The fender scratches: is this something I should be upset about and should I take it back to the shop and ask it be remedied? Or is this normal?

Thanks in advance for any feedback!

PS New to the forum, and the FAQ page wasn't found, so I hope I'm not breaking any rules here.

Last edited by stephbr; 01-20-15 at 09:19 AM. Reason: format
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Old 01-20-15, 08:35 AM
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My opinion of course but you must be dealing with a pretty poor bike shop that cant fit a rack. If you have threaded eyelets down by your rear dropout, they should be able to fashion some sort of attachment to the seat stays.
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Old 01-20-15, 09:23 AM
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Thanks for your opinion, rydabent.

What about the scratches, though? The second shop was able to fit a rack to it, but he scratched the fender in the process. Is that normal / expected?
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Old 01-20-15, 10:23 AM
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some ppl react strongly to scratches on their bike, I am not one of them. wrinkles are a fact of life and show life has been lived. those scratches will forever remind you that some guy did you a favor. not a bad thing. :-)
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Old 01-20-15, 10:36 AM
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Hey Rumrunn6, I do appreciate that approach. But how I'm seeing this is that I took my bike into a professional shop, and it came out with value stolen from it... Did he really do me a solid and that was the best he could do as a professional? Or could have been done better without treating it so poorly?

I guess I'm trying to gauge whether I'm overreacting here or not.
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Old 01-20-15, 10:48 AM
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That bike looks pretty standard. Rack mounts in the expected places etc. I had some difficulty fitting a rack to my wife's mixte but that's a special case, your bike isn't.

They shouldn't have scratched the fender like that either. My guess is the first shop didn't want to bother with it and the second had a very inexperienced person install the rack. Another reason to learn to do it yourself.
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Old 01-20-15, 10:50 AM
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Originally Posted by rumrunn6 View Post
some ppl react strongly to scratches on their bike, I am not one of them. wrinkles are a fact of life and show life has been lived. those scratches will forever remind you that some guy did you a favor. not a bad thing. :-)
Man, that's a sad state if you've gotten to the point where you don't care of someone damages your property. Like the OP, I would have been quite pissed off. Any scratches put on my bike will come from me.
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Old 01-20-15, 10:50 AM
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Scratches? Umm...no! When you are paying a pro0fessional to do something, they are supposed to do it without damaging anything. If you take your car to a mechanic, and he scratches it, do you just say "Oh well"?

I swear- with the LBS experiences I hear of on here, is there any wonder that I haven't been to an LBS in over 25 years? Here [this thread] is yet another example- 2 shops, which are both incompetent, even with the simplest things.
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Old 01-20-15, 10:50 AM
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I work in a shop and install racks all the time. A clean installation without damaging the bike is what the customer expects and that's what he should get.

There's nothing particularly unusual or challenging about your bike - the usual issue is that most shops want to sell you what they have in stock and don't want to order anything. Ideally the rack should have more clearance and obviously the shop didn't have a model in stock with more clearance. Or it was mounted to the wrong points at the rear axle.

I have no no clue how the fender got that badly scratched. If the guy at your shop did it then he might be a nice guy but he sure is a klutz - that's just terrible service with a smile.

Last edited by Burton; 01-20-15 at 11:02 AM.
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Old 01-20-15, 12:36 PM
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BTW There is No More Raleigh Nottingham UK factory , Now Raleigh USA is another Asian contract factory ..


with 4 Mounting Points 2 at the bottom, by the Hub axle, and 2 on the seat stay , there are a Lot of racks that can fit , literally Hundreds..

Q: how much Weight do you expect to carry ? will you want a Bag that Contents stays Dry , or accept things will be damp or get plastic bagged inside?

the radius of the wheel dictates the rack strut length so a 26" rack may not be ideal, on a 28" wheel, Bike. particularly with Mudguards ..

+ If You have Big Feet the bags need to be moved Further back to not Kick Them , pedaling. influincing how the rack will be Mounted.
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Old 01-20-15, 12:44 PM
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Thanks all for your feedback! I'm feeling more justified about reacting the way I did towards the scratches.
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Old 01-20-15, 12:46 PM
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Originally Posted by fietsbob View Post
Q: how much Weight do you expect to carry ? will you want a Bag that Contents stays Dry , or accept things will be damp or get plastic bagged inside?
A: (to @fietsbob)
I've got two Ortlieb panniers that are very waterproof. I used the rear rack on my old bike everyday for general commuting needs and grocery shopping, so ditto for this new one. Although not often, I also plan on packing them for longer trips (weekend to week-long) - so food, camping gear, backup accessories and maintenance tools, etc.

Could you recommend a rack that would fit and work well for my use?
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Old 01-20-15, 01:19 PM
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I like the Tubus Racks* I have one of these on My Bike tubus - Logo classic

the rear Pannier hook is on the part behind the rear strut. so it wont shift Forward,

the bottom hook faces Backwards so It wont shift Rearwards .

the Newer Logo evo adds a brazed on bearing ball to look like a rear shifting Stop.

and a Cast rather than a Sheet steel Piece at the Bottom Mount Point .
tubus - Logo evo

I have a Big saddle Bag on the back , the lower bag support rail is always Clear.

You can look around on the site and see other rack Models they Make .

The Locc is made to have a Clip to place a particular Abus U lock on It tubus - Locc


Cargo Evo the top support is wider than the Logo model tubus - Cargo evo

* Importer to US is the same one as Ortlieb ..


http://www.thetouringstore.com/ is a good Online seller if online is your preference , they are also sold thru REI and many distributors to Shops .

Last edited by fietsbob; 01-20-15 at 01:23 PM.
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Old 01-20-15, 01:33 PM
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Butttttt, Bob, he is inquiring about the damage foisted on his bike, by the LBS..............................
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Old 01-20-15, 02:12 PM
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To the OP, you intend to tour with this bike, but aren't able/willing to locate and install your own rack? I simply don't get that.

When you tour, you have to capable of improvising/adapting/rigging all types of mechanical things to keep your bike in safe, working order. Installing a rack should be child's play in comparison to the routine problems you might face on the road (broken rear drive side spoke, slipping freehub/freewheel pawls, bent derailleur, broken shifter internal part, gashed sidewall, broken pedal spindle, broken axle...the list goes on).

Anyway, if it's a touring bike, it'll get scratched plenty. Just touch up the fenders and be done with it. PG
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Old 01-20-15, 03:11 PM
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You should talk to the shop about the scratches.

I wouldn't do it (my personal style), but you have every right to expect no extra scratches when a bike is worked on, and since it obviously bothers you, the shop can do more than we can to make it right.
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Old 01-20-15, 07:02 PM
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When it comes to selecting a rack, you need:
Sufficient height above the fender to avoid contact and fit straps (>1") but no more.
Solid, stiff stays that don't interfere with brake straddle cable
3 legs, pref with full triangulation
Round-section rod or tube to fit QR locking hooks.
Real lamp bracket
I prefer:
Non-adjustable height (no need for more bolts and bits)
No dogleg required with quality panniers.
Black paint will always wear down to the metal.

Tubus usually do the job.

Fit using stainless steel allen bolts (usually mm) of the correct length. Leave 1-3 threads protruding. Most rack hardware is cheap, soft, cheddar steel. Lower rack bolts take a beating.
Fit using washers and nylok nuts and grease/anti-sieze the threads
On Alu frames, I like anti-rotation star washers.

Scratching a mint bike is unprofessional, but touring bikes are used hard and will show wear.
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Old 01-21-15, 07:14 AM
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Thank you all for the feedback and rack recommendations.

I understand this bike will get scratched, I guess I'm not worried about that.

I came here trying to gauge whether the scratch collateral was acceptable for this type of job, and it sounds like it's not.

Got my question answered, and lots more. So thank you all!











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Old 01-21-15, 07:30 AM
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Did you ask the lbs person why the fender was damaged? What was the reply?
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Old 01-22-15, 04:36 PM
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Originally Posted by Kai Winters View Post
Did you ask the lbs person why the fender was damaged? What was the reply?
No, I didn't directly ask. But I think you can get an idea from the set up. Pictures here. Very little clearance near the screws. So I can imagine the reason is because the rack was just barely fitting the bike. It was a very tight fit.
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Old 01-22-15, 11:04 PM
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Actually that looks like more than a "scratch" to me. It looks like out right damage. I would ask them to provide some touch up paint at least.

Its kind of the pits when one shop cant even install a rack, and another damages the bike installing one. And these are professionals? I guess I would keep looking for a competent bike shop.
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Old 01-24-15, 08:42 PM
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Originally Posted by stephbr View Post
No, I didn't directly ask. But I think you can get an idea from the set up. Pictures here. Very little clearance near the screws. So I can imagine the reason is because the rack was just barely fitting the bike. It was a very tight fit.

Whoa those bolts are far too long for their intended use. I've worked in two bike shops for twenty years and have installed many racks, many on bikes that were not designed for racks and I've never used a bolt that had so many threads through the nut. No wonder it scratched the fender.

Were I you I'd have been very angry at the damage to my bike and I'd have let the owner know, with no room for misunderstanding, that the wrench that installed the rack is a moron and the shop is responsible for the damage to the fender. I'd not realistically expect them to have it repainted but I'd expect the cost of the rack and labor given to me for the craptastic work of the wrench.

I was also the head wrench/supervisor at the last shop I worked and would have had a serious conversation with the wrench that installed the rack...hoping it was in fact a wrench and not just one of the sales people, etc. that may have very limited experience working on a bike...if such was the case I'd be more upset.

What you decide to do is up to you but were it me I'd at the very least tear a piece off the manager/owner.
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Old 01-25-15, 12:11 PM
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Thank you, Kai. Appreciate your input.

The update: My partner took the bike back into the shop while I was at work. Manager offered to replace the fenders with a new set for free (generic black type). He also reinstalled the rack so it's a better fit and overall a cleaner job. I don't think I'll be going back, though.

Lessons learned! Thank you all for your input.
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Old 01-25-15, 12:42 PM
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Butttttt, Bob, he is inquiring about the damage foisted on his bike, by the LBS..............................
If all that worried about a few scratches, Now, I have a hard time seeing how they will cope with the inevitable scratches and Bumps in the road on an actual Tour.


Perhaps Touring is not what they are suited to Do , Owning a spotless Touring bike is a separate thing ..

I still have the Rattle can Touch Up on my touring bike from a Re welding repair I got in Ireland, 17 years ago.

Burned off the Powder Coat in that portion to get clean metal for the welding job.
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Old 01-25-15, 02:51 PM
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Originally Posted by fietsbob View Post
If all that worried about a few scratches, Now, I have a hard time seeing how they will cope with the inevitable scratches and Bumps in the road on an actual Tour.


Perhaps Touring is not what they are suited to Do , Owning a spotless Touring bike is a separate thing ..

I still have the Rattle can Touch Up on my touring bike from a Re welding repair I got in Ireland, 17 years ago.

Burned off the Powder Coat in that portion to get clean metal for the welding job.
It's one thing if YOU damage your own property- whether inadvertantly or in the course of using it for it's intended purpose; it's entirely different if you're paying someone to perform a service, and they damage your property while doing so. I don't recall ever seeing a bike that was scratched that badly from regular use and even abuse in the real world.
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