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Front der better or null ?

Old 07-07-18, 05:17 PM
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Front der better or null ?

Would the Shimano Sora R3030 be a nice direct upgrade from a Altus M313 if both are priced the same?
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Old 07-07-18, 07:29 PM
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Originally Posted by Troul View Post
Would the Shimano Sora R3030 be a nice direct upgrade from a Altus M313 if both are priced the same?
It's probably a materially better derailer, but the Sora is a road groupset and the Altus is a mountain groupset, and I believe the two derailers will have a different pull ratio. I think you'll need to also install a road front shifter to go along with that Sora front derailer.
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Old 07-07-18, 07:37 PM
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9 speeds vs. 8 speeds. Sora is one better than Altus. It's simple arithmetic.

Seriously: if it fits nicely into the system you have, Sora is probably better price/performance. If it doesn't fit nicely into the system you have, it's complicated.
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Old 07-07-18, 10:48 PM
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Originally Posted by hokiefyd View Post
It's probably a materially better derailer, but the Sora is a road groupset and the Altus is a mountain groupset, and I believe the two derailers will have a different pull ratio. I think you'll need to also install a road front shifter to go along with that Sora front derailer.
It'd be supporting a 48/38/28 triple. Not a good combo?
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Old 07-07-18, 10:49 PM
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Originally Posted by tyrion View Post
9 speeds vs. 8 speeds. Sora is one better than Altus. It's simple arithmetic.

Seriously: if it fits nicely into the system you have, Sora is probably better price/performance. If it doesn't fit nicely into the system you have, it's complicated.
That's what I'm trying to figure out before buying anything. They both seem to support a triple FSA
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Old 07-07-18, 10:55 PM
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Originally Posted by Troul View Post
That's what I'm trying to figure out before buying anything. They both seem to support a triple FSA
Sorry, maybe I sounded a little flippant there.

What FD shifter do you have?
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Old 07-07-18, 11:38 PM
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Right now its an altus with M360 Acera's.
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Old 07-08-18, 06:05 AM
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What would throw the pull amount off between the two FDs to deem it necessary for a different shifter? If they both support a triple & the current FSA is very close with some road cranks for #'s, it seems the shifter should ideally work.
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Old 07-08-18, 07:27 PM
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Originally Posted by Troul View Post
What would throw the pull amount off between the two FDs to deem it necessary for a different shifter? If they both support a triple & the current FSA is very close with some road cranks for #'s, it seems the shifter should ideally work.
"Road" front derailers have a different pull ratio than "mountain" front derailers. It's not about the number of chain rings supported -- it's the distance the derailer moves with each click of the indexed shifter. With friction shifting, it doesn't matter. But it matters with indexed shifting. Your Altus shifter will "pull" a certain amount of cable with each click of the shifting ratchet. It's designed to work correctly with a "mountain" front derailer, so that the amount of cable pulled by the shifter is exactly the amount needed to make the derailer move enough to make the shift. Your Altus shifter won't know that you're using a "road" derailer, and it'll either pull too much cable or not enough cable (I don't recall which), and shifting won't work well. I think that "mountain" front derailers require more cable pull, so an Altus shifter would pull a "road" derailer too far with each click, and it would over-shift.

See this Sheldon Brown page and scroll down to "Indexing Road/MTB" for more information. To shift a Sora front derailer, you'll either need to replace your Altus shifter or use a workaround like a Shiftmate as suggested on Sheldon Brown's website.
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Old 07-09-18, 02:44 PM
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Originally Posted by hokiefyd View Post
See this Sheldon Brown page and scroll down to "Indexing Road/MTB" for more information. To shift a Sora front derailer, you'll either need to replace your Altus shifter or use a workaround like a Shiftmate as suggested on Sheldon Brown's website.
HokieFyd is correct, apples and oranges. That said the Sora provably is comparable in quality/function as an Altus. All FD are all about the same; it's the fit that's different. And if you shop around there isn't much difference in price between different levels of MTB (or road) FDs.

Reality is the shifters and crank quality affects front shifting more than the FD.
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Old 07-09-18, 02:56 PM
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the shift action is good & I wouldn't see a need to address the shifter. It's the high/lo fine adjustment. It seems the triple FSA was not meant to be paired with the FD as it can rub ever so slightly when in the worse case of sprockets (X chaining) . Which I know should be avoided, but if it were not an option for use, the designer of the system should have put in place a prevention mech to inhibit such selections.
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Old 07-09-18, 03:24 PM
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Originally Posted by Troul View Post
the shift action is good & I wouldn't see a need to address the shifter. It's the high/lo fine adjustment. It seems the triple FSA was not meant to be paired with the FD as it can rub ever so slightly when in the worse case of sprockets (X chaining) . Which I know should be avoided, but if it were not an option for use, the designer of the system should have put in place a prevention mech to inhibit such selections.
It is what it is. Cross chaining will rub, even with the best derailleurs. Best you can do is make sure your have the right fit/installation. I have an Alivio and I just barely avoid rubbing after lots of tweaking. FD come in many fitments, mostly the seat tube angle and the large chain ring. A better FD doesn't make for better shifting; the right derailleur is more important.
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Old 07-09-18, 03:58 PM
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the current fd has seen better days, therefore i was looking to just go to the next better option. Doesnt seem possible unless I upgrade many other items to support it. rats!
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Old 07-09-18, 05:34 PM
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Originally Posted by pjthomas View Post
Reality is the shifters and crank quality affects front shifting more than the FD.
This is right, and sometimes, unexpectedly. The single best front-shifting bike I have is my early-90s Motiv Stonegrinder MTB with its original Tourney TY-series triple crank, original Altus C30 (or similar) top swing derailer, and newer Shimano Revoshift shifters. I don't know why it is, but front shifting on that bike is just absolutely perfect. The chain never struggles to get into a higher ring (it never really even clicks -- it just silently and smoothly climbs up), and it never hesitates when downshifting. I would never have guessed that that specific combination would shift so well, but it's just perfection...somehow.
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