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Peugeot First-Ride 2000 project bike

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Peugeot First-Ride 2000 project bike

Old 05-25-20, 04:58 AM
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cprobertson1
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Peugeot First-Ride 2000 project bike

TL;DR -- this is mostly me just rambling about what I've been doing to my poor bike!

Things will get more interesting in future once I get some pics up - but for now, I'm afraid it's just a wall-of-text!



Right as the lockdown started, my commuting bike got grounded - the entire drivetrain was worn and needed replacing. My bad, I hadn't been taking care of it and I was paying the price.

The cost for a repair+service would be about 100, and being 18+ years old (2002), I considered a replacement. As I was pricing new bikes up, I realised that they weren't perfect for me... also they cost a lot and I would need to take them out on financing.

So, I borrowed my grandfather's bike (a pedelec - they're weird and kinda fun, but it's not a good choice for me! I like going on dirt trails too much, and this one has road tyres) and decided I wanted to learn how to maintain bikes properly - I wanted to be able to service, maintain, and repair my bike.

I then looked at the poor Peugeot - my first "real" bike - thousands of miles on the clock that bikes don't actually have - hundreds of memories... and I nodded - it was time: this was it. THIS was the project bike!

I decided this was going to be my platform for learning these skills - I would upgrade it in affordable phases - it would be reborn, rebuilt better than before!


So - I divided the task into phases.

Phase-1: get it running again with a slightly upgraded drivetrain that I can replace further down the line.
Phase-2: consumables to keep the bike running properly
Phase-3: more upgrades - replacing the freewheel hubs with cassette hubs, and swapping out the drivetrain again.
Phase-4: nice-to-have tools that make servicing much easier (like a proper stand, some of the more specialist tools, etc)
Phase-5: more upgrades - this time to push it towards touring. I want to use this for bikepacking as well as commuting (mostly panniers and a headset more suited to touring that I can still use for shorter runs)

We're in phase-1 just now: upgrading the important bits! Here's what I've done so far. Sure, it's not high-end gear, but I don't care! I'm not a rampant sportsperson who's cycling up and down the country. I'm a commuter who occasionally takes his bike on longer distance journeys, often along dirt tracks. That's it, really, I'm not a hardcore mountain biker, nor am I racer. I have no need for carbon fibre seatposts or disk brakes or microlight seats or 100-shifters. As such, my bike will never be more than a mid-tier bike - but again, I don't mind - it's for me to use, not others!
  • Old triple crankset replaced with a 22/32/44t Atlus crankset. I plan on replacing this with a 30/39/50T in future, with removable chainrings, but this one will do for now. Its a bad combo for this rear cluster though. It works, though, that's the main thing! It was also on sale, so I'm not wasting too much money.
  • Old 6-speed freewheel replaced with a 14-16-18-20-22-24-34 Shimano Megarange 7-speed cluster. The resulting gearing range is on the soft side - which is why I want to upgrade the crankset in future, but I'm also going to wear this freewheel out first - as I want to change the hub over to a cassette hub, and I want my money's worth out this lot!
  • Rear mech replaced with a shimano tourney TY300 - nothing special, but it fits the 34T sprocket, and it was cheap. The old derailleur was getting stiff despite multiple greasings. It too, was nothing special. I don't need "special" just now - I need "works"
  • Bearings replaced in front and rear hub. Happy-greasy-fun-time! The cones could do with replacement, they're on the worn side. Not a problem yet, but they will cause accelerated wear. I'm keeping an eye on them.
  • Old center pull brakes replaced with direct pull BR-T610 Shimano Deore brakes. Again, I don't need anything great - "just works" is enough. I nearly went for Shimano Alivio brakes, but these were on sale and were 2 more expensive and apparently better (though, I can't see much difference just by looking at them online?)
  • New, longer seatpost and saddle. Now, if a saddle is not a seat... why is the seatpost called a seatpost since there is no seat to post? There're mysteries in this world!
  • New pedals. Again, nothing to write home about - the old ones would have been fine, this was purely a "I would like that" scenario. I don't use cleats or footstraps - so I don't need to go overboard with what I'm buying.
  • New brake levers+shifters. I wanted rapidfire shifters and saw the ST-EF41 SHimano EZ Fire (Plus) (what a mouthful!) combo shifters on sale - so I decided to grab them. They were the direct pull variant, which prompted then new v-brakes as well. Sure they aren't technically "amazing" - but compared to the 18-year old twist-shifters they are beautiful!
  • While looking for new grips, a work colleague said they had old Ergon grips that he could give me - they have the horn-bar variants so I wont get as much use out of them as an MTB rider would, but as a change of position on longer rides they'll still be useful. Besides, they are comfy-as!

I think that's everything I'm changing so far - as I said, I plan on upgrading the wheels, adding a cassette hub, and buying a better crankset, but for now it will certainly do!

Most of the above are works-in-progress as I wait for parts to arrive. I've repacked the rear hub, front hub is dismantled and cleaned, just waiting on new ball bearings to arrive (the local bike shop didn't have 3/16th bbs for some reason). Once I get the hubs sorted I can get the cones set [waiting on cone wrenches] and get the wheels on, then I can install the brakes [waiting on brakes too], then I can get the front derailleur attached [waiting on that as well], then it's time to get the headset back on and do the cabling, before putting the crankset and rear mech on and set properly [I have all of those parts at least!], and finally it's just the finishing touches... like the saddle [which I'm waiting on too].

It's a bit annoying being held up by random parts like this, but hey-ho - I do what I can whenever I can manage it, and in the meantime I can clean the existing parts and get ready for the big fit!

I can also pine over my poor choice in gearing... Sure, I dont think it's a bad combination for a mountain biker... but I'm a hybrid - this is a MTB-flavoured road bike: I want it to have the harder gearing of a road bike, with the option to drop down into much softer gearing for the trails and hills (which is why I went for that 34T megarange rear cluster... which is really a 14-24t with a 34t sprocket stuck on the low end. Literally, it's just riveted on there! I think it's cute!). I probably won't get much use out of it until I get the crankset upgrade though.

BUT. That is a discussion for another day (and a lesson learned on my apart!).

I'll hopefully get pics up soon, which should transform the thread from a wall-of-text to something actually interesting!

Last edited by cprobertson1; 05-25-20 at 06:00 AM.
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Old 05-25-20, 07:32 PM
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There are at least three references to "seat" on a bike: seat stay, seat tube, and seat post. So I think the thing on which you perch your pedal-pusher is probably also a seat, but we're too elite a bunch to settle for the obvious.
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Old 05-26-20, 01:21 AM
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Originally Posted by hokiefyd View Post
There are at least three references to "seat" on a bike: seat stay, seat tube, and seat post. So I think the thing on which you perch your pedal-pusher is probably also a seat, but we're too elite a bunch to settle for the obvious.
That explains so much!

Hrm... well I suppose the word "seat" is derived from the germanic word for "sit" - so you know what... I'm going to call it a "sit" from now on. Actually, being Scottish, I'd probably just sound like a teuchter.

So, got an interesting one for you... well, maybe not interesting - but certainly a "huh that ain't right" moment.

I am right in thinking most front wheels take 3/16th bearings, right? I grabbed a set of bearings from the local bike shop who's been around longer than I have! Rear bearings were fine - but he didn't know the size of the front bearings - he just said "front wheel?" and passed a bag of bearings over... they looked about the right size so I took them, and trusted in his judgement.

Turns out he gave me 5/32 bearings which are a tad too small for the front wheel - is that a common size in the UK? Has he accidentally picked up the wrong bag of bearings? If he has given me his "most commonly used front wheel bearings" that suggests that he doesn't usually see 3/16th wheels - which I thought were the "standard" (or at least most common) size!

Any idea what's up with that? Are 5/32 bearings common elsewhere on the bike (maybe in the head tube?)

--EDIT--
Apparently 5/32" bearings are indeed common in the fork bearings - my guess is he grabbed the wrong baggie of bearings

Last edited by cprobertson1; 05-26-20 at 04:53 AM.
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Old 05-26-20, 07:40 AM
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3/16" sounds right for front hub bearings. I think the rear hub bearings are typically 1/4".

https://bike.bikegremlin.com/2255/st...ng-ball-sizes/
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Old 05-28-20, 06:14 AM
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Originally Posted by hokiefyd View Post
3/16" sounds right for front hub bearings. I think the rear hub bearings are typically 1/4".
I saw your post minutes before I went to write up a post about the common sizes - you couldn't have timed it better!

I'll write up a quick table for other novices like myself who come across this post

Front hubs*: 3/16" (4.76mm) -- 10x per side (20 total)
Rear hubs: 1/4" (6.35mm) -- 9x per side (18 total)
Cup-and-cone bottom brackets: 1/4" (6.35mm) -- 11x per side (22 total)
Front steerer: 5/32" (3.97mm) -- count varies (as far as I am aware)
Pedals: 5/32" (3.97mm) -- count varies (as far as I am aware)

*Rarely, some front Hubs, such as the Campagnolo Record, Nuovo Record, and Super Record, as well as some other random exotic hubs usee 7/32" (5.56mm) bearings.
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Old 05-29-20, 02:05 AM
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Right - I got the wheels on and cones adjusted last night.

Those rims are a little worse for wear - they're not worn down, but they've been bumped a few times and are no longer perfect circles - theres a bit of lateral wobble)

I take it I should really be re-truing them? Pretty sure there's a sheldon-brown article on it so I'm not scared to do it... just worried it might take a while since I'll probably end up making quite a few attempts as I learn the ropes/spokes!

I mean, I can probably run with them as-is - they're not so out-of-true that they're striking the brake pads - but I take it it's worth the effort to learn how to do it right? (plus, it's a free learning opportunity!)
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Old 05-29-20, 06:15 AM
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If there is lateral runout, then the rims could be trued, yes. You'll need a spoke wrench...these are available as single size and multi-size tools (to fit various nipple sizes). There's definitely a science to wheel truing (physics of the spokes pulling the rim left or right), but there also seems to be an "art" to it as well...trying to balance spoke tension to not overload one side or the other, etc.
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Old 05-29-20, 07:25 AM
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Originally Posted by cprobertson1 View Post
TL;DR -- this is mostly me just rambling about what I've been doing to my poor bike!

Things will get more interesting in future once I get some pics up - but for now, I'm afraid it's just a wall-of-text!



Right as the lockdown started, my commuting bike got grounded - the entire drivetrain was worn and needed replacing. My bad, I hadn't been taking care of it and I was paying the price.

The cost for a repair+service would be about 100, and being 18+ years old (2002), I considered a replacement. As I was pricing new bikes up, I realised that they weren't perfect for me... also they cost a lot and I would need to take them out on financing.

So, I borrowed my grandfather's bike (a pedelec - they're weird and kinda fun, but it's not a good choice for me! I like going on dirt trails too much, and this one has road tyres) and decided I wanted to learn how to maintain bikes properly - I wanted to be able to service, maintain, and repair my bike.

I then looked at the poor Peugeot - my first "real" bike - thousands of miles on the clock that bikes don't actually have - hundreds of memories... and I nodded - it was time: this was it. THIS was the project bike!

I decided this was going to be my platform for learning these skills - I would upgrade it in affordable phases - it would be reborn, rebuilt better than before!


So - I divided the task into phases.

Phase-1: get it running again with a slightly upgraded drivetrain that I can replace further down the line.
Phase-2: consumables to keep the bike running properly
Phase-3: more upgrades - replacing the freewheel hubs with cassette hubs, and swapping out the drivetrain again.
Phase-4: nice-to-have tools that make servicing much easier (like a proper stand, some of the more specialist tools, etc)
Phase-5: more upgrades - this time to push it towards touring. I want to use this for bikepacking as well as commuting (mostly panniers and a headset more suited to touring that I can still use for shorter runs)

We're in phase-1 just now: upgrading the important bits! Here's what I've done so far. Sure, it's not high-end gear, but I don't care! I'm not a rampant sportsperson who's cycling up and down the country. I'm a commuter who occasionally takes his bike on longer distance journeys, often along dirt tracks. That's it, really, I'm not a hardcore mountain biker, nor am I racer. I have no need for carbon fibre seatposts or disk brakes or microlight seats or 100-shifters. As such, my bike will never be more than a mid-tier bike - but again, I don't mind - it's for me to use, not others!
  • Old triple crankset replaced with a 22/32/44t Atlus crankset. I plan on replacing this with a 30/39/50T in future, with removable chainrings, but this one will do for now. Its a bad combo for this rear cluster though. It works, though, that's the main thing! It was also on sale, so I'm not wasting too much money.
  • Old 6-speed freewheel replaced with a 14-16-18-20-22-24-34 Shimano Megarange 7-speed cluster. The resulting gearing range is on the soft side - which is why I want to upgrade the crankset in future, but I'm also going to wear this freewheel out first - as I want to change the hub over to a cassette hub, and I want my money's worth out this lot!
  • Rear mech replaced with a shimano tourney TY300 - nothing special, but it fits the 34T sprocket, and it was cheap. The old derailleur was getting stiff despite multiple greasings. It too, was nothing special. I don't need "special" just now - I need "works"
  • Bearings replaced in front and rear hub. Happy-greasy-fun-time! The cones could do with replacement, they're on the worn side. Not a problem yet, but they will cause accelerated wear. I'm keeping an eye on them.
  • Old center pull brakes replaced with direct pull BR-T610 Shimano Deore brakes. Again, I don't need anything great - "just works" is enough. I nearly went for Shimano Alivio brakes, but these were on sale and were 2 more expensive and apparently better (though, I can't see much difference just by looking at them online?)
  • New, longer seatpost and saddle. Now, if a saddle is not a seat... why is the seatpost called a seatpost since there is no seat to post? There're mysteries in this world!
  • New pedals. Again, nothing to write home about - the old ones would have been fine, this was purely a "I would like that" scenario. I don't use cleats or footstraps - so I don't need to go overboard with what I'm buying.
  • New brake levers+shifters. I wanted rapidfire shifters and saw the ST-EF41 SHimano EZ Fire (Plus) (what a mouthful!) combo shifters on sale - so I decided to grab them. They were the direct pull variant, which prompted then new v-brakes as well. Sure they aren't technically "amazing" - but compared to the 18-year old twist-shifters they are beautiful!
  • While looking for new grips, a work colleague said they had old Ergon grips that he could give me - they have the horn-bar variants so I wont get as much use out of them as an MTB rider would, but as a change of position on longer rides they'll still be useful. Besides, they are comfy-as!

I think that's everything I'm changing so far - as I said, I plan on upgrading the wheels, adding a cassette hub, and buying a better crankset, but for now it will certainly do!

Most of the above are works-in-progress as I wait for parts to arrive. I've repacked the rear hub, front hub is dismantled and cleaned, just waiting on new ball bearings to arrive (the local bike shop didn't have 3/16th bbs for some reason). Once I get the hubs sorted I can get the cones set [waiting on cone wrenches] and get the wheels on, then I can install the brakes [waiting on brakes too], then I can get the front derailleur attached [waiting on that as well], then it's time to get the headset back on and do the cabling, before putting the crankset and rear mech on and set properly [I have all of those parts at least!], and finally it's just the finishing touches... like the saddle [which I'm waiting on too].

It's a bit annoying being held up by random parts like this, but hey-ho - I do what I can whenever I can manage it, and in the meantime I can clean the existing parts and get ready for the big fit!

I can also pine over my poor choice in gearing... Sure, I dont think it's a bad combination for a mountain biker... but I'm a hybrid - this is a MTB-flavoured road bike: I want it to have the harder gearing of a road bike, with the option to drop down into much softer gearing for the trails and hills (which is why I went for that 34T megarange rear cluster... which is really a 14-24t with a 34t sprocket stuck on the low end. Literally, it's just riveted on there! I think it's cute!). I probably won't get much use out of it until I get the crankset upgrade though.

BUT. That is a discussion for another day (and a lesson learned on my apart!).

I'll hopefully get pics up soon, which should transform the thread from a wall-of-text to something actually interesting!
A bottom bracket overhaul would be advisable, if not a new bottom bracket is highly recommended. UN55 is the one to get now, for the hollow spindle.

Deore V brakes have cartridge pad holders, and Alivio have non cartridge pads. Cartridge is better as it avoids re-setup, but there are better pads than Shimano pads. Kool Stop pads can be purchased as replacement slide-ins or with cartridge holders.

You might've gummed up your derailleur; you don't grease a derailleur. What I do is throw it in the ultrasonic cleaner to get all the grease and gunk off, lube the pivots with a very light oil, and disassemble/lube the pulleys. A little smear of grease on the spring is a good idea but that's it.

Rim brakes like clean, parallel, flat, true, and round brake tracks so IMO it is worth the time to make them so.

Don't overlook simple things like cable routing. Make sure you have all the stops for V brakes, if you have a headset mounted hanger, get a spacer to replace it.

If you don't have a modern seat, you should consider one. I love vintage bikes, but I don't miss my old seats.

Last edited by DorkDisk; 05-29-20 at 07:29 AM.
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Old 05-29-20, 03:46 PM
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^^I'll respond properly soon! Just finished tinkering and I'm knackered!

That's it almost ready to ride - everything's fitted and adjusted.

Got a mystery click in the rear wheel, once per revolution, whether pedaling not.

I suspect it's either something dodgy I've done when repacking the hubs, or a loose spoke - either way, I won't ride it until I have the source located.

I'm so close I can taste it!... Oily rubber. I wish I couldn't taste it - it's nasty! Time to get the swarfega out!
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Old 05-30-20, 05:11 AM
  #10  
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If there is lateral runout, then the rims could be trued, yes. You'll need a spoke wrench...these are available as single size and multi-size tools (to fit various nipple sizes). There's definitely a science to wheel truing (physics of the spokes pulling the rim left or right), but there also seems to be an "art" to it as well...trying to balance spoke tension to not overload one side or the other, etc.

I'll 3D print a key and get on it... I'm sure it'll be a fun experience - there's a Sheldon Brown article and plenty of other online stuff - so I'm happy to give it a go.

I gave it a good spin yesterday and it definitely needs fixin'!



Originally Posted by DorkDisk View Post
A bottom bracket overhaul would be advisable, if not a new bottom bracket is highly recommended. UN55 is the one to get now, for the hollow spindle.
It had a UN55 square taper bracket installed about a two years ago, should have about 5000-6000km on it. I didn't plan on changing it, buuuuut... I have chainline problems... the largest chaining won't fit under the derailleur! D'oh!

The new (front) derailleur doesn't extend out far enough - I've got the old derailler on just now so I can still ride it. Still, I done-a-dum-dum. Never occurred to me the front derailer would have a different max-extension!

The one I installed is an FD-A073 which apparently is intended for a chainline of 45mm. The crankset is an FC-M371, which is a 50mm chainline - so something needs to be changed. Do you reckon a 45mm chainline bottom bracket would do me, or would I be better chaning the front derailleur? To be fair, the current derailer doesn't really need changed - it looks worn and sad and the plating is blotchy, but it works.


Originally Posted by DorkDisk View Post
Deore V brakes have cartridge pad holders, and Alivio have non cartridge pads. Cartridge is better as it avoids re-setup, but there are better pads than Shimano pads. Kool Stop pads can be purchased as replacement slide-ins or with cartridge holders.
Oooh - I shall change the pads over once these are worn down


Originally Posted by DorkDisk View Post
You might've gummed up your derailleur; you don't grease a derailleur. What I do is throw it in the ultrasonic cleaner to get all the grease and gunk off, lube the pivots with a very light oil, and disassemble/lube the pulleys. A little smear of grease on the spring is a good idea but that's it.
Sorry, I mis-spoke. It was gummed up, but not because of grease! When I said "greased" I just meant "lubricated". It just hadn't had maintenance... or even cleaning... in a very long time - I dismantled it and gave it a deep clean, as I want it as a spare... I removed nearly 100g (dry weight) of dirt from it... it was crazy. Black cement. It was nasty! I'll properly maintain the new one though!

So, I was always told that you grease any heavy-load areas and oils were for exposed and areas where you need the oil to seep into. Applying that principle to a derailer, I would have thought that you would have greased the inside of the jockey wheels, and oiled pretty much anything else. Does that sound reasonable? If not, do let me know! last thing I want to do is gum this one up (though, to be fair, if it's getting regular maintenance as it should be, it probably won't be a huge problem as long as I dont go overboard). Let me know anyway!

Anyway, that's all been replaced with a new derailleur that accommodates the 34T chainwheel


Originally Posted by DorkDisk View Post
Rim brakes like clean, parallel, flat, true, and round brake tracks so IMO it is worth the time to make them so.
I'll 3D print a key or two for it and teach myself then. Gonna be.... fun?

Originally Posted by DorkDisk View Post
Don't overlook simple things like cable routing. Make sure you have all the stops for V brakes, if you have a headset mounted hanger, get a spacer to replace it.
I followed Sheldon Brown's article (sorry I can't link until I have 10 posts ) - tried to keep it short, neat, and going in the right direction. I think it's alright - I took my time doing it and triple-checked everything before cutting. They're currently too long because I rotated the brake levers forward a little - causing every cable to stick forward. Lesson learned. I'll know for future, and I can adjust it for now once I fully confirm the handlebar/lever positions with a bit of testing.

Originally Posted by DorkDisk View Post
If you don't have a modern seat, you should consider one. I love vintage bikes, but I don't miss my old seats.
Bet you to it!

The old one wasn't actually too bad - solid plastic with a very slight cushion. I got a modern mountain-biking seat for general use - I fear it's too soft for my liking though. Butt But, time will tell
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Old 05-30-20, 05:17 AM
  #11  
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Originally Posted by cprobertson1 View Post

It had a UN55 square taper bracket installed about a two years ago, should have about 5000-6000km on it. I didn't plan on changing it, buuuuut... I have chainline problems... the largest chaining won't fit under the derailleur! D'oh!

The new (front) derailleur doesn't extend out far enough - I've got the old derailler on just now so I can still ride it. Still, I done-a-dum-dum. Never occurred to me the front derailer would have a different max-extension!

The one I installed is an FD-A073 which apparently is intended for a chainline of 45mm. The crankset is an FC-M371, which is a 50mm chainline - so something needs to be changed. Do you reckon a 45mm chainline bottom bracket would do me, or would I be better chaning the front derailleur? To be fair, the current derailer doesn't really need changed - it looks worn and sad and the plating is blotchy, but it works.
Old triple FDs have the most range, modern stuff has more limited swing. Seems like you need another BB with a narrower spindle.
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Old 06-01-20, 12:48 AM
  #12  
cprobertson1
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Originally Posted by DorkDisk View Post
Old triple FDs have the most range, modern stuff has more limited swing. Seems like you need another BB with a narrower spindle.
That sounds like what's happened - it wasn't even something I would have thought about thinking about! I had no reason to consider the possibility it'd have reduced swing...... but now I know!

I'll run with the old FD for now while I order a new bottom bracket in - just need to double and triple check the ranges and dimensions first!

Apart from that, I've discovered a much more dangerous problem - the old handlebar has been pinched at the center, making it an elliptical - you can tighten it in any orientation, but with a sharp knock it will cam out of position to align the ellipsis of the handlebar with the ellipsis of the quill's grabby-bit... IN other words, the handlebars can go from perfectly tight to perfectly loose in a fraction of a second... usually when you hit a pothole... which is exactly the sort of behaviour that you want in a good handlebar!

I'm going to try putting a steel or lead shim in there - but if that doesn't work, I'll just give up and put a tack weld at one side... They can support up to 400kg, so unless I'm being insane, that isn't going to fail anytime soon. Sure I'll never be able to adjust the handlebars again - but I planned on replacing the headset at some point anyway - I just need to find an optimum angle to get by!

Its one problem after another - and I caused every single one of them!

Last edited by cprobertson1; 06-01-20 at 02:16 AM.
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Old 06-01-20, 09:23 AM
  #13  
cprobertson1
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Right - I need a quick sanity check! (Sorry to double-post btw!)

How do I figure out the spindle length I need?

Purely eyeballing it, the new FD reaches to just under the outermost chainring. If I measure the distance from the outer to the middle-chainring, and subtract twice that distance from the current spindle length, will that give me the approximate desired spindle length?

(According to Shimano, the FD has a chainline of 45mm, and the crankset has a chainline of 50mm: not sure if it can also be worked out from there?)
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Old 06-15-20, 12:19 PM
  #14  
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After faffing around with the FD, changing the bottom bracket (twice) and getting things running almost perfectly (there is a mystery "cooing" noise... like a pigeon... comes in pairs... Coo! Coo! - again, like a pigeon, seems to happen once every complete chain revolution...) - BUT apart from the cooing-like-a-pigeon-on-every-gear - I can now access every gear and can hopefully get it out the kitchen and into the real world. I mean, I've already had it in the real world with my old derailleur, but the phase-I upgrades area nearly complete!

Pics to follow as soon as I get it to stop cooing, and give it a little wipe down
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