Originally Posted by tandempower

I didn't say it to start a discussion on the topic. I was just pointing out that 'overpopulation' can and does get used as a scapegoat for any social problem that people don't want to look at more closely.

E.g. "X wouldn't be a problem if the world has less people in it," and then that's the end of it for them.

Originally Posted by cooker

Agreed. However, overpopulation is also a problem.

Originally Posted by bp2k8

I appreciate another member having these sentiments. Good luck on this in florida.

Originally Posted by bp2k8

Very well put. I appreciate another member having these sentiments. Good luck on this in florida. Land of 6-packs and F350's. People I believe would rather die then give up driving.

Originally Posted by indyfabz

Hello. What's this thread about?


P.S. I have not contributed to the earth's population other than by being born, which I had nothing to do with.

Originally Posted by bp2k8

agreed. I can only hope central florida overall as well as Tampa does not turn into more urban or suburban sprawl as it has some really nice state roads and back roads great for cycling. Once a lizard or salamander so common was on my bike for a 2 hour ride the whole way There is a working trail that takes you from Tampa area all the way to Melbourne so from west of Florida Gulf Coast all the way to east coast of the state on the Atlantic side.

Do you think its because people WON'T ride a bike or they CAN'T due to not wanting to improve fitness, sweat etc. I feel like some people find it is beneath them and its quite sad.

Originally Posted by indyfabz

Hello. What's this thread about?


...

Originally Posted by bp2k8

It would be a shame if you were not some sort of author or writer. You took my exact sentiments and eloquently persuaded it into words. I agree completely though. Even something as autonomous as grocery stores etc. If we all stopped shopping they would be forced to change entire way grocery stores cater to customers etc. This applies to all aspects of society. This conversation could go into a deep rabbit hole real quick so I will just say I do think its human psyche as well as industrialization and construction of society that fosters this dumbing down of the human mind where expected norm is embraced and comfortable. Often the "changes" that are made or action taken by many humans often is an erroneous one but one they feel they are empowered to do. The truth is if we all united no malevolent force or injustice nor structure could stop us. Instead, cars would rather cut off cyclists and such as a way of utilizing this potentiality of union as a power struggle and it gets a more negative and selfish expression instead. Its like kick the little guy cause one feels too powerless to fight the real bully...

Originally Posted by bp2k8

It would be a shame if you were not some sort of author or writer. You took my exact sentiments and eloquently persuaded it into words. I agree completely though. Even something as autonomous as grocery stores etc. If we all stopped shopping they would be forced to change entire way grocery stores cater to customers etc. This applies to all aspects of society. This conversation could go into a deep rabbit hole real quick so I will just say I do think its human psyche as well as industrialization and construction of society that fosters this dumbing down of the human mind where expected norm is embraced and comfortable. Often the "changes" that are made or action taken by many humans often is an erroneous one but one they feel they are empowered to do. The truth is if we all united no malevolent force or injustice nor structure could stop us. Instead, cars would rather cut off cyclists and such as a way of utilizing this potentiality of union as a power struggle and it gets a more negative and selfish expression instead. Its like kick the little guy cause one feels too powerless to fight the real bully...

Originally Posted by bp2k8

It would be a shame if you were not some sort of author or writer. You took my exact sentiments and eloquently persuaded it into words. I agree completely though. Even something as autonomous as grocery stores etc. If we all stopped shopping they would be forced to change entire way grocery stores cater to customers etc. This applies to all aspects of society. This conversation could go into a deep rabbit hole real quick so I will just say I do think its human psyche as well as industrialization and construction of society that fosters this dumbing down of the human mind where expected norm is embraced and comfortable. Often the "changes" that are made or action taken by many humans often is an erroneous one but one they feel they are empowered to do. The truth is if we all united no malevolent force or injustice nor structure could stop us. Instead, cars would rather cut off cyclists and such as a way of utilizing this potentiality of union as a power struggle and it gets a more negative and selfish expression instead. Its like kick the little guy cause one feels too powerless to fight the real bully...

Originally Posted by bp2k8

easy... tell amtrak to stop being greedy and open their trains/tracks for a more public domain and proper usage or a similar setup to a flat fee of 5-10$. Trains are a very efficient form of transportation even older ones that are not as clean energy using like coal etc. Trains come every 45 mins or so and even faster for light rail style that do not use fuel. Between trains, and buses, and bikes I do not see any reason for a car. If for some reason a car is needed I think an app like uber could be used but it would organize a carpool for a specific purpose (and there are already apps like this) and also there would be a limitation so a person would have 3 of these passes to use a week. Something like that. 50% OF driving in my opinion is out of leisure and boredom and if that is the case just get a bike lol

Point is - it is very possible but does require some lessening of greed.

There are already cities doing quite well and its just a matter of stopping the car usage. NYC could easily be car-free but I think it takes more so legislation than convincing people

Originally Posted by bp2k8

easy... tell amtrak to stop being greedy and open their trains/tracks for a more public domain and proper usage or a similar setup to a flat fee of 5-10$. Trains are a very efficient form of transportation even older ones that are not as clean energy using like coal etc. Trains come every 45 mins or so and even faster for light rail style that do not use fuel. Between trains, and buses, and bikes I do not see any reason for a car. If for some reason a car is needed I think an app like uber could be used but it would organize a carpool for a specific purpose (and there are already apps like this) and also there would be a limitation so a person would have 3 of these passes to use a week. Something like that. 50% OF driving in my opinion is out of leisure and boredom and if that is the case just get a bike lol

Point is - it is very possible but does require some lessening of greed.

There are already cities doing quite well and its just a matter of stopping the car usage. NYC could easily be car-free but I think it takes more so legislation than convincing people

Originally Posted by I-Like-To-Bike

It is easy to see why you and Tandempower find so much in common.

Originally Posted by bp2k8

Can't tell if that is a good or bad thing but I will take it as a major compliment considering the thoughtful and profetic content and style of TandemPower's speech and writing.






So you presume that people in cars HAVE to be in them? I am not disrespecting you but simply asking. They simply could not be on the bus, train, or bike?

You might think that is a realistic question but only if you haven't pondered the most common answer, because the majority of people don't want to. They will work extra hours just so they don't have to.

I am very aware of suburb and rural area situation but the answer is to improve central routing of people thru public trans not to have people feel the need to buy more cars. It goes back to the main quote of the century. Its cheaper to move people.

It is easier to move cattle and chickens by shoving them shoulder to shoulder in a truck but I would imagine people would rather not travel that way.

Why do we import produce, take trips to tropical areas etc when we could simply move people there that want to go.

I am having a hard time believing you believe it would be better to move people to where the food is than move food to where people are? You do realize big cities do no grow their own food?


I live in South Florida where people have no idea where they are going and there are tourists and snowbirds everywhere I stand by my statement and I am quite the realist actually. I am not a mathematician so forgive me for a random percentage but I still abide by my statement and dont expect others to understand.


Do you know what portion of the economy of south Florida relies on with Snowbirds and tourists. Without a tax base you cannot afford to build infrastructure you know?

It is the same thing for people like the nyc mayor who has a private car take him to a gym 10 miles from his home. He could have literally biked there instead of driving to use aerobic equipment.

He could have taken a helicopter or armored car as well. One of the things that make this a great place to live, we have the freedom to move around anyway we want.

I never claimed to be a government worker or have the knowledge therein and I am not speaking from a soap box nor with entitlement or authority. I am just simply passing a skeleton structure of what COULD BE.

You do know realism requires a realistic solution? What could be requires a plan supported by a group that has the support to do something. Otherwise it is called dreaming.

I appreciate the amtrak article as I was under the impression they or the states they pass thru, own the tracks. Kind of like how in california the metrolink shares the same rails as Amtrak but I think Amtrak leases them from Metrolink or the state.

And now you know your plan won't work.

As for uber I stand by my statement. I never said to recycle every single car and erase them from history!

And if you limit the people or times someone can use their service how long do you expect the service to be available?

I said stop idiots from driving to a store 3 miles away and these folks are often all over the road. For example Why not have 10 cars to go downtown and people carpool in them rather than have 50 individual people to go the same direction one person in one car x 50.

Think that through, who's 50 cars, who's insurance? How many will be going the same place at the same time? How will the people get back?

If you want my opinion it seems like the real reason people dont like to carpool is they dont want to be bothered sharing with people. I took public transportation to middle and high school so I do not mind riding a public bus let alone a transportation means with people whom could possibly be not my style - still there is depth and value in every single creature so i like to engage with people regardless.

Yes there is value in every person. There is value in their privacy as well isn't there? But thanks for your opinion, it is immaterial as to why someone would not care to ride the bus however. Their opinions obviously are different.

It does not have to be uber it can be buses. Do you not understand my point? The goal is to stop people from thinking their car is a tank and they can drive anywhere at any time and no respect for pedestrians and cyclists and such.

Who's goal exactly? Can they take their car if they have respect for pedestrians and cyclists? Car to guess the percentages of people that have a car "and" are pedestrians and cyclists? Do you think it is more than 50 percent?

My question is what is to prevent people from taking public trans? If its a slowness or time issue we can increase the frequency by 1 so if a bus comes every hour we can make it come every 30 mins. The power is in your hands...

Originally Posted by bp2k8

Can't tell if that is a good or bad thing but I will take it as a major compliment considering the thoughtful and profetic content and style of TandemPower's speech and writing.






So you presume that people in cars HAVE to be in them? I am not disrespecting you but simply asking. They simply could not be on the bus, train, or bike? I am very aware of suburb and rural area situation but the answer is to improve central routing of people thru public trans not to have people feel the need to buy more cars. It goe s back to the main quote of the century. Its cheaper to move people. Why do we import produce, take trips to tropical areas etc when we could simply move people there that want to go.

I live in South Florida where people have no idea where they are going and there are tourists and snowbirds everywhere I stand by my statement and I am quite the realist actually. I am not a mathematician so forgive me for a random percentage but I still abide by my statement and dont expect others to understand.

It is the same thing for people like the nyc mayor who has a private car take him to a gym 10 miles from his home. He could have literally biked there instead of driving to use aerobic equipment.








I never claimed to be a government worker or have the knowledge therein and I am not speaking from a soap box nor with entitlement or authority. I am just simply passing a skeleton structure of what COULD BE.

I appreciate the amtrak article as I was under the impression they or the states they pass thru, own the tracks. Kind of like how in california the metrolink shares the same rails as Amtrak but I think Amtrak leases them from Metrolink or the state.

As for uber I stand by my statement. I never said to recycle every single car and erase them from history!

I said stop idiots from driving to a store 3 miles away and these folks are often all over the road. For example Why not have 10 cars to go downtown and people carpool in them rather than have 50 individual people to go the same direction one person in one car x 50. If you want my opinion it seems like the real reason people dont like to carpool is they dont want to be bothered sharing with people. I took public transportation to middle and high school so I do not mind riding a public bus let alone a transportation means with people whom could possibly be not my style - still there is depth and value in every single creature so i like to engage with people regardless.

It does not have to be uber it can be buses. Do you not understand my point? The goal is to stop people from thinking their car is a tank and they can drive anywhere at any time and no respect for pedestrians and cyclists and such.

My question is what is to prevent people from taking public trans? If its a slowness or time issue we can increase the frequency by 1 so if a bus comes every hour we can make it come every 30 mins. The power is in your hands...

Originally Posted by Mobile 155

Good point, so put it to a vote and see what happens. See who wants to buy more buses and hire more drivers. I think you might discover the "we" you are talking about will be voting as "them." The why not of public transportation has been answered many times in this forum. To really work it has to take people from where they are to where they want to go when they want to go there. That is the main flaw you might need to solve.

Originally Posted by bp2k8

My question is what is to prevent people from taking public trans? If its a slowness or time issue we can increase the frequency by 1 so if a bus comes every hour we can make it come every 30 mins. The power is in your hands...

Originally Posted by bp2k8

My question is what is to prevent people from taking public trans? If its a slowness or time issue we can increase the frequency by 1 so if a bus comes every hour we can make it come every 30 mins. The power is in your hands...