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Ride-sharing + driver-sharing?

Old 06-04-19, 04:27 PM
  #76  
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Originally Posted by Mobile 155 View Post
I think having the person sponsoring this driving program should buy the car and have to go find it every day after the last driver has dropped it off wherever that might be. After all the car still has to be funded.
Or the ride-share network could fund/subsidize it, i.e. the way Amazon was subsidizing delivery vans for their contractors.

The app would obviously keep track of where the vehicle is. Drivers would have to leave the car someplace authorized by the network if there was no other driver to take it over. If nothing else, the person who wants to get up the next morning to use it would meet the last driver of the evening somewhere to pick up the car.
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Old 06-04-19, 04:35 PM
  #77  
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Originally Posted by tandempower View Post
Or the ride-share network could fund/subsidize it, i.e. the way Amazon was subsidizing delivery vans for their contractors.

The app would obviously keep track of where the vehicle is. Drivers would have to leave the car someplace authorized by the network if there was no other driver to take it over. If nothing else, the person who wants to get up the next morning to use it would meet the last driver of the evening somewhere to pick up the car.
So you are talking about being more wasteful and inefficient, oh and not only non profit but losing $$. If that is the case it no longer matters what you do.
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Old 06-04-19, 10:34 PM
  #78  
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Originally Posted by pedex View Post
So you are talking about being more wasteful and inefficient, oh and not only non profit but losing $$. If that is the case it no longer matters what you do.
Maybe if Opra gave them a free car and they were all on the title? But then they wouldn't be car free by the forum rules. Ok scratcch that idea.
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Old 06-05-19, 01:30 AM
  #79  
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Originally Posted by tandempower View Post
Or the ride-share network could fund/subsidize it, i.e. the way Amazon was subsidizing delivery vans for their contractors.

The app would obviously keep track of where the vehicle is. Drivers would have to leave the car someplace authorized by the network if there was no other driver to take it over. If nothing else, the person who wants to get up the next morning to use it would meet the last driver of the evening somewhere to pick up the car.
Oh that sounds convenient.


So ...

8 am - I use my car to get to university. On the way I pick up another student also going to university who pays me nothing. I park at the university (parking fees).

9 am - Someone picks up my car and drives into north Hobart.

10 am - I don't have a car because it is in north Hobart, so I have to walk to work.

5 pm - I still don't have a car because it's out in Sorell, so I have to take the bus home.

The car travels around Hobart and greater Hobart throughout the day and finally ends up in New Norfolk late in the evening.

9 pm - I realise that I'm going to need to get to the university early.

Now I've got a couple choices:

A) I can take the early bus to the university and try to track down my car later in the day if I've got time ... but I do have work and I've got an assignment coming due which I need to work on in the evening. Maybe someone will drive it into my vicinity but if not, I'll just walk or take the bus.

B) Rather than doing my homework, I use a combination of bus and taxi to travel the 50 km out to New Norfolk to get my car and drive home ... arriving home shortly before midnight. I realise that my fuel tank is now empty because people have been using my car all day, and I've got to get up even earlier so that I can swing by a service station on the way to university. I squeeze an hour of homework in before collapsing into bed exhausted knowing I'd better get some sleep because I need to be up at 6:30 am in order to fork over $80 to fill my car with fuel I'll hardly use.

And another day. And another day.

Last edited by Machka; 06-05-19 at 03:49 AM.
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Old 06-05-19, 08:04 AM
  #80  
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Originally Posted by Machka View Post
8 am - I use my car to get to university. On the way I pick up another student also going to university who pays me nothing. I park at the university (parking fees).
If the car is yours, you would get paid at the regular rate the ride-share pays to owner-drivers.

9 am - Someone picks up my car and drives into north Hobart.
Why would you pay parking fees if someone takes your car and drives it elsewhere?

10 am - I don't have a car because it is in north Hobart, so I have to walk to work.
No, but you are being paid for the time your car is being used for ride-sharing.

5 pm - I still don't have a car because it's out in Sorell, so I have to take the bus home.
Or you could hail a ride-drive share ride, and your car or some other car might show up. There might also be a way to let the system know you want your car back at 5pm, so the system favors rides/drives that work your car back in your direction throughout the day.

The car travels around Hobart and greater Hobart throughout the day and finally ends up in New Norfolk late in the evening.

9 pm - I realise that I'm going to need to get to the university early.

Now I've got a couple choices:

A) I can take the early bus to the university and try to track down my car later in the day if I've got time ... but I do have work and I've got an assignment coming due which I need to work on in the evening. Maybe someone will drive it into my vicinity but if not, I'll just walk or take the bus.

B) Rather than doing my homework, I use a combination of bus and taxi to travel the 50 km out to New Norfolk to get my car and drive home ... arriving home shortly before midnight. I realise that my fuel tank is now empty because people have been using my car all day, and I've got to get up even earlier so that I can swing by a service station on the way to university. I squeeze an hour of homework in before collapsing into bed exhausted knowing I'd better get some sleep because I need to be up at 6:30 am in order to fork over $80 to fill my car with fuel I'll hardly use.

And another day. And another day.
You would not be good at programming the ride/drive-share routing app.
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Old 06-05-19, 08:12 AM
  #81  
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Originally Posted by tandempower View Post
Why would you pay parking fees if someone takes your car and drives it elsewhere?
Because the car sits there for an hour before someone comes to get it. The car is not always going to be on the move.


Originally Posted by tandempower View Post
Or you could hail a ride-drive share ride, and your car or some other car might show up. There might also be a way to let the system know you want your car back at 5pm, so the system favors rides/drives that work your car back in your direction throughout the day.

You would not be good at programming the ride/drive-share routing app.
So explain what should happen if this ride/drive-share routing app did exist in a situation where a person travels to more than one location and lives a full and busy life.

It could be my scenario above or it could be a family transporting kids to various locations.
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Old 06-05-19, 08:16 AM
  #82  
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Originally Posted by tandempower View Post


You would not be good at programming the ride/drive-share routing app.
The "app" you are so fixated on does not waive the laws of physics or economics. Nor solve all the problems you think.

We had car2go here for awhile. On demand usage rental cars that used an app to find and drive the car, drop it off wherever you want in the operational area when done. The hourly rate was about $15 an hour.
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Old 06-05-19, 08:34 AM
  #83  
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Originally Posted by Machka View Post
Oh that sounds convenient.


So ...
[SKIP]

And another day. And another day.
Welcome to the latest Screenplay:

Groundhog Day in an LCF Dreamland
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Old 06-05-19, 08:38 AM
  #84  
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Originally Posted by Machka View Post
Because the car sits there for an hour before someone comes to get it. The car is not always going to be on the move.
You can park your car wherever you want, but the app might not necessarily request it. If you wanted the app to lend it out to another driver, then you would want to park it somewhere that is more likely to happen.

So explain what should happen if this ride/drive-share routing app did exist in a situation where a person travels to more than one location and lives a full and busy life.
Let's assume that if you are going places with lots of traffic flow, there will be vehicles passing regularly that are on your ride/drive-share network. If that's the case, then you just hail a ride with the app. Now, let's say the driver of the next vehicle to pick you up is planning to depart the vehicle before your destination and there is no one else to take over the driving. In that case, you would have to wait for another ride, if you didn't want to or couldn't take over the driving. If you could, then you would get picked up and when that driver gets out, you would take over the driving. You might also be picking up and letting out passengers both before and after you take over the driving.

It could be my scenario above or it could be a family transporting kids to various locations.
Families and children are obviously a special case with special needs. You always claim to be a positive person, yet you look for the most negative scenarios to undermine ideas.
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Old 06-05-19, 08:41 AM
  #85  
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Originally Posted by pedex View Post
The "app" you are so fixated on does not waive the laws of physics or economics. Nor solve all the problems you think.

We had car2go here for awhile. On demand usage rental cars that used an app to find and drive the car, drop it off wherever you want in the operational area when done. The hourly rate was about $15 an hour.
You are just one more of the negative nancys that swoop in to poohpooh ideas that could undermine the one-car-per-person economic model for transportation economics.

If sufficient numbers of users and sharing vehicles/rides, then an algorithm should be able to coordinate the various user-destinations into braided trips, especially if riders and passengers can alternate and take over the driving when someone wants to exit the vehicle.
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Old 06-05-19, 08:50 AM
  #86  
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Originally Posted by tandempower View Post
You are just one more of the negative nancys that swoop in to poohpooh ideas that could undermine the one-car-per-person economic model for transportation economics.

If sufficient numbers of users and sharing vehicles/rides, then an algorithm should be able to coordinate the various user-destinations into braided trips, especially if riders and passengers can alternate and take over the driving when someone wants to exit the vehicle.
How long will it take you to understand the transportation and delivery businesses? Until you do that you have no idea what is going on or how to go about it.
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Old 06-05-19, 11:35 AM
  #87  
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Originally Posted by pedex View Post
How long will it take you to understand the transportation and delivery businesses? Until you do that you have no idea what is going on or how to go about it.
I understand that ride-share platforms exist and that they coordinate rides using algorithms that match ride-seekers with potential ride-givers.

I also understand that currently, there is no way for a driver to use his or her own vehicle to go to a destination without making his or her vehicle unavailable for further rides.

I also understand there are car-sharing platforms and rental car platforms that allow drivers to share vehicles

What is missing from the market is a platform that combines ride-sharing with driver/car-sharing within the same integrated platform.

If Uber doesn't fill that gap, someone else will eventually. There is just no reason to block IT and smartphone technology from facilitating forms of transportation sharing that hold immense potential to reduce congestion by overcoming limitations of current public transit systems.

The only reason these things are having trouble getting off the ground is because of aggressive reactions in favor of the status quo because of fears that change could have negative economic effects.

How long can such reactionary forces suppress technological possibilities? Forever? If so, is that the kind of world you want to live in?
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Old 06-05-19, 11:52 AM
  #88  
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Originally Posted by tandempower View Post
I understand that ride-share platforms exist and that they coordinate rides using algorithms that match ride-seekers with potential ride-givers.

I also understand that currently, there is no way for a driver to use his or her own vehicle to go to a destination without making his or her vehicle unavailable for further rides.

I also understand there are car-sharing platforms and rental car platforms that allow drivers to share vehicles

What is missing from the market is a platform that combines ride-sharing with driver/car-sharing within the same integrated platform.

If Uber doesn't fill that gap, someone else will eventually. There is just no reason to block IT and smartphone technology from facilitating forms of transportation sharing that hold immense potential to reduce congestion by overcoming limitations of current public transit systems.

The only reason these things are having trouble getting off the ground is because of aggressive reactions in favor of the status quo because of fears that change could have negative economic effects.

How long can such reactionary forces suppress technological possibilities? Forever? If so, is that the kind of world you want to live in?
1. No, no algorithm needed, they are sent out to whoever is in the area and responds to the request for service. This has been explained to you before. All you get is a pick up point, no destination most of the time and that is subject to change. The billing company will use algorithms for billing sometimes but not dispatching. It could be done with a destination included but it really doesn't help much.
2. incorrect
3. yet you don't seem understand how any of this works
4, there has to be a viable market for it, there isn't one and even Uber is failing at an old model that does work when done correctly
5. the results of road building and traffic in the US and other nation indicates congestion won't change at all
6. ya, losing $$ tends to keep things from happening, economics is funny that way
7. Longer than you can learn to quit being so repetitive and verbose. My world? It doesn't matter.

Best way to learn what I am talking about is go drive for Uber or Lyft for a week or two. None of it works the way you assume or think.
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Old 06-05-19, 01:28 PM
  #89  
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Originally Posted by pedex View Post
1. No, no algorithm needed, they are sent out to whoever is in the area and responds to the request for service. This has been explained to you before. All you get is a pick up point, no destination most of the time and that is subject to change. The billing company will use algorithms for billing sometimes but not dispatching. It could be done with a destination included but it really doesn't help much.
What prevents multiple drivers from responding to the same call, then?
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Old 06-05-19, 02:33 PM
  #90  
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Originally Posted by tandempower View Post
What prevents multiple drivers from responding to the same call, then?
When someone accepts the run it stops being offered but you only get like 20 seconds to decide.
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Old 06-05-19, 03:01 PM
  #91  
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Originally Posted by tandempower View Post
What prevents multiple drivers from responding to the same call, then?
That would be what happens with wrecker drivers responding to a car accident.

Uber or Lyft would be similar to shopping for a single item on eBay. You purchase the only one and the software takes that item off the market.
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Old 06-05-19, 03:09 PM
  #92  
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Originally Posted by pedex View Post
When someone accepts the run it stops being offered but you only get like 20 seconds to decide.
Well, the system would have to be updated to keep track of destinations of multiple ride/drivers in order to efficiently pair drivers with passengers who are willing to take over driving after they get out at their destination.

It's not undoable, and it would reduce costs and allow more passengers to ride if they were also willing to take over the driving when necessary.
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Old 06-05-19, 03:18 PM
  #93  
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Originally Posted by tandempower View Post
Well, the system would have to be updated to keep track of destinations of multiple ride/drivers in order to efficiently pair drivers with passengers who are willing to take over driving after they get out at their destination.

It's not undoable, and it would reduce costs and allow more passengers to ride if they were also willing to take over the driving when necessary.
Again, you really have no idea what is going on in the real world with these things. Surge pricing is already being cheated and exploited by drivers and so is the acceptance rate. It would take very little to upset this system you dream of.
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Old 06-05-19, 03:49 PM
  #94  
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Originally Posted by pedex View Post
Again, you really have no idea what is going on in the real world with these things. Surge pricing is already being cheated and exploited by drivers and so is the acceptance rate. It would take very little to upset this system you dream of.
Really? What would it take, exactly?
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Old 06-05-19, 03:54 PM
  #95  
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Originally Posted by tandempower View Post
Really? What would it take, exactly?
Losing massive amounts of money or just eliminating car ownership and/or accepting potentially really bad personal service.

We already have car pools. Use them.
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Old 06-05-19, 04:08 PM
  #96  
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Originally Posted by pedex View Post
Losing massive amounts of money or just eliminating car ownership and/or accepting potentially really bad personal service.
You are talking about some external level. I thought you meant there was some reason within the share platform/system that it wouldn't work.

Uber is currently filtering out bad drivers and riders, so the bad service problem will be dealt with as the sabotage that it is.

As for eliminating car ownership, why would that be a bad thing? Most people don't really own their cars anyway. They just make monthly payments on them until they trade them in.

If Uber or some other ride-share platform could get you a lower monthly payment, why would that be a bad thing?
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Old 06-05-19, 04:15 PM
  #97  
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Originally Posted by tandempower View Post
You are talking about some external level. I thought you meant there was some reason within the share platform/system that it wouldn't work.

Uber is currently filtering out bad drivers and riders, so the bad service problem will be dealt with as the sabotage that it is.

As for eliminating car ownership, why would that be a bad thing? Most people don't really own their cars anyway. They just make monthly payments on them until they trade them in.

If Uber or some other ride-share platform could get you a lower monthly payment, why would that be a bad thing?
From a game theory standpoint the idea is a loser platform is irrelevant.

Human nature is a factor you don't seem to grok.

People like freedom. Speak for yourself but I like my vehicle and of the 53 of them I have owned 51 were bought and paid for with cash.

Uber is already losing so much $$ they will likely fail. They aren't something to be emulated IMO. Last thing I would want is them to be a creditor either.
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Old 06-05-19, 04:55 PM
  #98  
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Originally Posted by pedex View Post
From a game theory standpoint the idea is a loser platform is irrelevant.

Human nature is a factor you don't seem to grok.

People like freedom. Speak for yourself but I like my vehicle and of the 53 of them I have owned 51 were bought and paid for with cash.

Uber is already losing so much $$ they will likely fail. They aren't something to be emulated IMO. Last thing I would want is them to be a creditor either.
Thank you for explaining your POV, as I now can see that everything negative you say is just biased by your overall desire to see ride-sharing fail to preserve what you see as a better standard of living that comes with everyone being forced to drive their own cars.

Thank you for confirming you are just another person who wants to eliminate choice and/or prevent it from growing.
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Old 06-05-19, 05:16 PM
  #99  
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Originally Posted by tandempower View Post
Thank you for explaining your POV, as I now can see that everything negative you say is just biased by your overall desire to see ride-sharing fail to preserve what you see as a better standard of living that comes with everyone being forced to drive their own cars.

Thank you for confirming you are just another person who wants to eliminate choice and/or prevent it from growing.
It would seem that Pedex knows something about the subject.

Per this article, the next step will be self driving cars, not car"share" with a human driver.

https://apnews.com/9e2ecdd44fde4dce96add343ec02decf
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Old 06-05-19, 05:52 PM
  #100  
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Originally Posted by tandempower View Post
Thank you for explaining your POV, as I now can see that everything negative you say is just biased by your overall desire to see ride-sharing fail to preserve what you see as a better standard of living that comes with everyone being forced to drive their own cars.

Thank you for confirming you are just another person who wants to eliminate choice and/or prevent it from growing.
Thanks for completely misunderstanding my position.
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