Darth Lefty 

I remember biking to school a lot when I was little, before we moved way out of town. But after that the schools were always too far. My high school was not a reasonable daily cycling distance from my home, nor was weather in Phoenix usually cool enough. We lived in the exurbs and my sister was in a private school downtown so Mom was driving regardless, and I got dropped off. The school bus was available but shall we say I didn't enjoy the company. I did bike a few times before I got my own truck, but it wasn't the usual thing.

kmv2

lol they drive him 1 mile?

'Murrica

kmv2

Maybe not removed, but often omitted or restricted in postwar construction - take a walk in a typical North American post WW2 neighbourhood - if you can walk, it might just be a sea of parked cars with no sidewalks.. even modern suburbs here sometimes have no sidewalk or even just sidewalk on one side of the road.



Road widening and parking lots also take their toll on sidewalks. Buildings or their setbacks were often eliminated/moved. When the sidewalk is pushed as far out of the way as possible, you still have utility poles, garbage/mail boxes, restaurant patios etc to install in that space as well.

Do parks and people's homes count? Most major cities razed homes, tore up railroads and took away parkland to build their through city highways or widened boulevards. Hausmannian in essence to create open spaces and cities, but without a real consideration of existing or anticipated pedestrian traffic.

I suppose the good thing is that people are finally realizing "oh ****, we actually want to walk places".. and we are seeing somewhat of a reversal of the road widening fads of the past.

PlanoFuji

His claim was that sidewalks were removed during the process of widening the road. Possible, but very unlikely. I was simply asking if he had any evidence of his claim, or was it another one of those 'I believe it happened' things...

kmv2

Understood. It could be interpretation too, maybe when the road was originally constructed, residents opted for a wider road vs. a road with sidewalks.

Either way, before/after photographs of North American downtowns are a good place to start if you wanted examples. Maybe Roody could provide that in this case. Otherwise I guess you "owned him".

And to elaborate the discussion past this particular street, I believe it happens.

PlanoFuji

I don't doubt that it may happen; however, there are some legal ramifications (that affect something personal) and I am looking for actual examples of where it HAS occurred (if it has)... Searching photographs of random cities is unlikely to be productive...

Roody

I remember that there used to be a narrow road with sidewalks. Then I remember at a later time that there was a wider road with no sidewalk. Unfortunately, I don't know how to link to my memory on this iPad. Maybe if I was using the desktop I could embed my memory, but not on the iPad.

I intended for this to be an experiential thread. I thought people would want to share their experiences with their kids and grandkids going back to school. Can we resume that now? Please?

Roody

If that is your intention, please start a new thread rather than ruining this one. Again, the topic here is kids and grand kids going to school.

kmv2

Here's one in my city,

Goes from tree lined neighbourhood with small streets (a park sandwiched by two small streets I consider to be a major pedestrian space that was removed) to high speed interprovincial trucking route..

https://www.kingedwardavenue.com/historyaerials_e.htm

Right now, its now basically skid row and you basically have to be in a car going at high speed, because you just want to get the hell out of there..

PlanoFuji

Thanks! However, it doesn't help my problem since it is from Canada and the laws I am researching are not going to apply.

PlanoFuji

And yet YOU raised the subject I was asking you about and made a claim about that subject. All I did was ask you for some evidence... my reasons for asking are irrelevant. But I guess you believe that you can include any point you like without regard to the 'point' of the thread, but others must adhere to a different criteria...

I-Like-To-Bike

Perhaps Roody should request that the list moderators change the rules for this list to read:
1. It is OK for Roody to continually digress to OT topics and political rants (see the Youth Sports Thread in P&R for an example), or to cry about thread hijacking whenever he chooses not to clarify or explain his own remarks in a thread.

2. It is "ruining" a thread when someone posts a comment or question a previous comment that Roody does not want to read or answer.

Roody

No. I made a point about how I went to school on narrow roads with sidewalks, but now those roads don't have sidewalks, and this might be one reason that fewer kids now walk to school. Now you are asking people to help you with your research assignment for some legal question. I tried asking you politely and you persisted. What is wrong with you?

Roody

I need to get away from this forum for a while. My apologies for the role I have played in trashing it. What is wrong with ME? I ask myself.

PlanoFuji

You take offense at being asked if you had any evidence of your claim (which you just admitted you made)? I asked once and let it go... Hardly an issue, except in your mind. So the answer to your final question is nothing is wrong with me... Though you seem to be having some issues.

Artkansas 

On the subject of sidewalks, I will trust Roody in his descriptions of what he observed. It does seem though that there is a new appreciation of the importance of walking and riding bikes resulting in a bigger demand for sidewalks, and that now sidewalks seem to be more a integral part of new development. So, at best, the argument about whether sidewalks are being demolished is as important and as timely as arguing about who sank the Maine. Let's drop the subject.

I was looking at the website of my elementary school. I was happy to see that at least they still had bicycle racks, though I have no doubt that they are much diminished from my days there when riding a bike to school was the norm. Apparently, now parents must sign a permission slip to allow their child to go to school on foot or by bike.

gerv 

Although... I volunteered at a boy scout bike rodeo this weekend. I was the co-op bike wrench for a bunch of kid.

Guess what? Kids just love to ride bikes. I couldn't get these kids to stay off their bikes long enough for my fascinating lecture on fixing flat tires

cooker

I live surrounded by schools. There is a middle school across the street, and primary school next to it and the high school is visible across a park. These are all public. There is a private girls' school behind us.

Traffic is bad. Lots of parents drive kids to both the elementary and middle school. You can't get in or out or our driveway (in a car) for about 15 minutes before 9 am. The afternoon rush is milder. I think some middle school parents drop kids off in the morning since they are driving to work anyway, and then go in to work a little after 9, but some of those parents let the kids fend for themselves at the end of the day.

Still, lots of parents walk their kids to the younger school. It's rare to see kids younger than about 10 walking without an adult. I walked alone to school starting in kindergarten or grade one, back in the 1950s. Lots of kids walk themselves to middle school. A few kids bike and there are 2 or 3 teachers who bike to the middle school. I see them because they come in early, before I leave, or if I'm rarely home sick or on holidays. I don't know if any bike to the elementary school as I only look out onto the far back corner of the property.

The traffic jam doesn't bother me much. If I leave for work before 8:40 (usually around 8) it is no problem and I just have to remember to alter my route to avoid another school closer to work in case I go by it at crunch time. If I leave home at 8:45, since I may have nothing booked first thing at work, and I am trying to get downtown just after rush hour, I have to filter through the traffic jam for two blocks on my bike before I can pick up speed, but it only costs me a minute or so.

However, my wife, who drives during the day finds it all extremely maddening and is always worried she'll need to go somewhere urgently right in the middle of the mess, and will be stuck. She claims the private school parents, who have to get through the public school jam to get to a back entrance to their school's primary grades building farther up the block, are the most inconsiderate and dangerous, barging through in their giant SUVs with no concern for other people's safety or right of way, but she might just be making classist assumptions.

Needless to say, my kids all walked to school. If they were in kindergarten or grade one, my wife just had to walk them across the street to make sure the other parents didn't run them down, and then they could squeeze through a gap in the fence and they were in the schoolyard.